Good morning and welcome to the 26th WAM Capital Annual General Meeting. This is a hybrid meeting held both online and in person here at the Museum of Sydney. I'd like to acknowledge the Gadigal people of the Eora Nation and pay my respects to elders past and present. Thank you, everyone here, for joining us in person and for your continued support of WAM Capital, and thank you, everyone who's online. Before we begin, I'd like to display a disclaimer on the screen, so please get your reading glasses out. And that broadly says that we will only be providing general advice. I'm Geoff Wilson, Chairman of the Board of Directors, and joining me here today are my fellow directors, Kate Thorley, Dr. Philippa Ryan, Angus Barker. And online, we have James Chirnside and Matthew Pancino. Also here with us today for the last time is fellow director, Lindsay Mann, who has been with us for 12 years, who joined when we merged with another listed investment company, and has really been an outstanding member of the board, and it's with great sadness that I think everyone on the board and shareholders say goodbye to Lindsay. He's a shareholder. He'll stay as a shareholder, but say goodbye to Lindsay as a director, so I probably shouldn't be doing it now, but on behalf of all shareholders, I'd like to thank you, Lindsay, for those hours and hours and hours of reading through every document in micro detail and always finding significant things that we need to adjust. Yeah, we will all greatly miss you. Acting in capacity as moderator is Ophelia Lam, who is Wilson Asset Management's head of finance, and she'll assist in addressing any questions either in the meeting or that are asked online. We have Richard King down in the front here, representative from our auditor, Pitcher Partners, and so if there's any particular questions that you'd like to refer to him on the Financial Statements, he is here. It's just after 10:00 A.M., and the quorum is present, so I declare the meeting open. The notice of meeting has been circulated to all shareholders, and in the absence of any objections, I'd like to proceed on the basis that the notice has been taken as read. I encourage you to read the chairman's address, which has been announced to the ASX earlier, and also we've emailed it to all shareholders. If anyone, if you didn't receive the email, then please go on the Wilson Asset Management website and sign up for emails, and then we can keep you fully informed. Shareholders who've logged into the webcast with your username and password will have the opportunity to submit questions online and/or ask audio questions, as well as voting on all resolutions. If you are joining us online, questions can be submitted at any time. For those shareholders that are online who wish to ask a verbal question, an audio question facility is available during the meeting. Obviously, for those shareholders that are here in person, if you could raise your hand, then the microphone can be brought to you. Voting today will be conducted by way of a poll on all items of business. I'll be opening the poll in a minute, and when I do open the poll, a voting icon will appear on the navigation bar. Simply select one of the options to cast your vote. If you change your mind, you can change your vote. You can change the option at any time until I close the poll, and I'll be closing the poll just before the closure of the meeting. I now declare voting open on all items of business, so you can cast your vote at any time in the room. You can cast your vote at any time or online. You can also, in terms of the chairman's address, which I mentioned that we sent the full detailed chairman's address to the ASX and also emailed it to shareholders. I'll just give you a little bit of a summary. First of all, probably looking at, in terms of going back and looking at the year we had, let's look at how we've started 2025. I'm pleased to say that the WAM Capital Investment Portfolio, and this is, I've got to take my hat off to Oscar Oberg and his team. It's increased 8.9% in the four months to the end of October, and that's outperforming the All Ords by 2.5% over that period. That performance has allowed the company to add to its profit reserve, and the profit reserve at the end of October stood at AUD 0.157 a share. The directors expect for this current year that the dividend, assuming it's maintained at the AUD 0.155, will be partially franked to 60%. In order to sustain a dividend of AUD 0.155, the investment portfolio would need to increase approximately 16% per annum. There can be no certainty that these returns can be maintained year in, year out. Just to give you a bit of perspective, if you cast your mind back a year or so, we were sitting on, and I think in the more detailed chairman's address, we were sitting on one and a bit cents a share in profit reserve after the payment of the final dividend a year ago. When we were coming into December, as a board, we were with only a profit reserve to pay effectively half the annual dividend. We were seriously thinking about it. It looked like we were in a position where we were going to have to cut the dividend in half. Because of the incredible performance, the strong performance in terms of the outperformance that Oscar and his team delivered, we were able to maintain the dividend because of the performance, particularly over the December, January, and February period. In terms of the dividend we're paying, you'd be aware when COVID struck, a lot of companies reduced their dividends. We maintained it. Our assets fell by about 20%, and we were paying out a little under 10% of the assets via a dividend. At this point in time, we've continued to pay the dividend when the profit reserve is there. I I think you just got to be aware, and as I've tried to articulate in the chairman's address, that we are paying, we're really paying you a super return, which is made up of the capital that we've made in terms of with fully franked dividends. So please be aware of the profit reserves, and our ability to keep paying dividends at that rate really depends on the performance of the portfolio, and some people do get caught up with the performance of the share price, which has traded at quite high premiums, and it now is trading around NTA and the underlying portfolio, so that's pretty much the sort of just a few of the bits I wanted to highlight from the chairman's address. Now, I'd like to move to the formal part of the meeting, and there's four items of business as set out on the notice of meeting. Three items are to be voted on. The notice of meeting and explanatory memorandum were circulated to shareholders. In the absence of any objections, I'll proceed on the basis that these items are taken as read, I note that Boardroom are the returning officer for today's meeting, and they'll be conducting our poll. I further note the resolution one is subject to voting exclusions as outlined in the notice of meeting. The board recommends approval of each resolution, and as chair, I'll be voting the open votes provided to me for each resolution. We'll advise the ASX as soon as the results are determined, and that'll be a little later today. You may submit any questions or comments you have to the financial report now. The first item of business to receive and consider: the Financial statement, the Directors' Report, the Auditors Report for the company, for the year 2024. As I mentioned, there's no resolution on this matter. Do we have any questions online for the director's report and auditor's report of the company for the year ended 30th of June 2024, Ophelia? Nothing for this one, Geoff. Do we have any questions in the room for that? No. Now, we come to the items of business that require a vote. Resolution one relates to the adoption of the remuneration report. You submit online. Please submit any questions you have now. The proxies received are on the screen. For the open proxies, I mentioned earlier that the one granted to me as chair, I'll be voting in favor. Do we have any questions online for the remuneration report? Nothing online. Do you have any questions in the room? No. As a note for the questions, I now put the motion for that resolution be approved as set out in the notice of meeting. Okay, so everyone's voted. Now we go to resolution two, relates to the re-election of myself, and I have to leave the chair. So I'll now pass over to Kate Thorley to handle this resolution. Thank you. Thanks, Geoff. Geoff, would you like to make a short speech regarding your re-election? Look, thank you, Kate. WAM Capital is obviously the first listed investment company that we floated 26 years ago, and I've fortunately been in the chair since then. When we floated it, we had 2,000 shareholders. In the first two years, 35% of our shareholders sold, and we went down to 1,300 shareholders. And then we realized that rather than going talking to the brokers about finding people to invest, we needed to communicate to our shareholders. And that probably started the journey of trying to engage and communicate with our shareholders over time. For those that—sorry about today—well, for those that came to our early AGMs in the History House and got, I think, our first AGM, we got donuts that were all—we had stale donuts that we've lifted. Well, I haven't tried the food out there. I hope we've lifted the food up a standard since then. No, sorry, I'm just rambling now. I'll throw myself to the mercy of the shareholders and let them decide my fate. Thank you. Thanks, Geoff. Okay, you may now submit any questions or comments that you have with regards to resolution two now. The proxies are on screen, and for the open proxies which have been granted to the chair, I will be voting in favor of the resolution. Are there any questions in the room for Geoff? No, nothing? Very good. Any questions online? Nothing online, Kate. Very good. So as there's no further questions or comments, I now put the motion that Mr. Geoffrey Wilson be re-elected as set out in the notice of meeting. You are a shareholder or a proxy holder and eligible to vote online. Could you now please complete your vote for resolution two? I'll now pass back to Geoff. Thank you. Thanks, Kate. So now we'll go to resolution three. Oh, this is the re-election of Kate. So you can continue on. Well, Kate can only, well, Kate's been with us for 20 years, so can you take us from 20 years to now? That's right. I only did the first couple of years. No. So I'd like to pass over to Kate. Is there anything in particular you'd like to say, Kate? Just, I guess, echoing what Geoff was saying. I mean, for most of you who may or may not know me, sorry, I'll take a step back. So I've been with Wilson Asset Management now for almost 20 years and as CEO since 2011, and prior to that, I was a chartered accountant and sort of grew up in country Queensland, spent most of my 20s in London and Ireland. I was just reminiscing with Pip, and then moved to Sydney and joined Geoff and the team of six, I think there were six of us at Wilson Asset Management. And look, probably where I spend most of my time is with the team, our amazing and very talented team, but also on this shareholder engagement piece, which is so incredibly important when you're managing your capital in the various listed investment companies. So as a team, we all pride ourselves on ensuring that shareholders understand how we're managing your money and always looking at ways to engage with you and take on your feedback and ensure that we're always looking to improve not only how we're performing within the portfolios, but also how the share prices perform over time. So with that, I really do hope that I can continue on as a director of WAM Capital, and I'll pass back to you, Geoff. Thank you. Thanks very much, Kate. So the proxies are up on the screen, and going forward, we'll be announcing the proxies to the exchange before the meeting so everyone can see them as an improvement on communications with shareholders as suggested by Stephen Mayne. And good suggestion, Stephen. Do we have any questions online? A few different. Nothing, Geoff. Any questions in the room? No? I now put the motion that Kate Thorley be re-elected as set out in the notice of meeting. Please, if you're in the room, please vote on the device you've been given. Anyone online, please also vote. So I'm going to declare the poll closed in a second or two. Or do we do the questions? We'll do the questions, yeah. So please, everyone vote, because after the questions, I'll be declaring the poll closed. So we've got a few general questions on. Oh, actually, why don't we take them in the room? Any general questions in the room, and then we'll go online. Yes. Okay. So if we can go. Anna, thanks. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I was just wondering if you have any knowledge or understanding of why recently WAM Capital was listed in the newspaper as a company that was AUD 4 billion of value and paid absolutely no tax? Did you see that article? I didn't see that exact article. I saw the data. It was a list of companies, some of which were very dubious, in my view, all of which paid no tax, and second last, for the sake of the argument, was WAM at AUD 4 billion. Yes. Yes. Yes. Okay. Jesse, our CFO, why don't I pass over to Jesse and take through that? Yes. So So that measure looks at the turnover of the portfolio. So the AUD 4 billion has come from, so when we buy and sell securities, the tax office looks at our size with respect to our turnover. So on the sale of our securities, so given the fund is around that AUD 1.7 billion mark and we turn the portfolio over two to three times a year, that's how they get to that sort of, I mean, that AUD 4 billion of value that they record us in those reports to look at then the tax that you pay on that revenue. Obviously, how our tax situation works is very different. You have to consider both our buying and our selling in terms of what our realized gains on positions are that works out our tax position. So just taking our gross turnover of AUD 4 billion, that's not what we get taxed on. It is rather misleading, including listed investment companies in those reports, but that's why we're included from that size perspective, just given the turnover. The tax—I mean, the way we pay tax comes in two ways. Partly, our tax is taken care of by the flow-through dividends we get from other investments in the portfolio. When we get fully-franked dividends on the portfolio, obviously, we don't have to pay tax on that income. We can utilize the franking credits like shareholders can utilize them, and then we pay tax on the remainder. Generally, in a year that, say, for example, if the portfolio is up 10% and you've got a tax bill of 30%, normally two-thirds comes in the actual physical payment of cash, and one-third comes from the flow-through dividends that we get on the investment portfolio. But we definitely pay quite a lot of tax each year, obviously, paying out that franking to shareholders. Those tax office reports, unfortunately, pick up some very unique numbers in our tax return and don't really tell the full story. Oh, so in theory, the numbers in the article didn't include the tax we paid? I don't think so and it also. Yeah. That's what it said. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But unfortunately, it's how the tax office releases the data. It picks it up on certain parts of the tax return and doesn't, if you look at our financial statements, you'll see the tax that we pay in there. Yeah, we should. We will. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Do you remember who it was? No, no. I remember. Yeah. I saw it online because, yeah, someone sent it to me. Yeah. But I actually didn't see the newspaper article. I didn't realize it. I didn't realize we'd made it that far. Yeah. Yes. Yeah. Thank you for the exciting news. I'm looking forward to the much-improved donuts this year. I hope they're not the ones left over from the first meeting, but. The last year's one. Yeah. Just like since tax is the topic of discussion, I'd just like you to let us know what the current position is with franking credits in this fund since WAM Research has gone now to partially-franked dividends? Jesse, do you want to go through why they're partially-franked? Yeah, why don't I pass over to Jesse? Yeah. I mean, very similar position to WAM Research. I mean, to Geoff's point before, at the start of last financial year, we had around AUD 0.016 left in the profits reserve after the payment of that final AUD 0.0775. So all the dividends that have been paid during this year have come from the performance of the investment portfolio. And there is a timing difference, obviously, in generating the performance and paying the tax. So whilst the performance had been generated and the profits reserve was available, there is that timing difference in sort of that performance and realization and the payment of tax. And unfortunately, we had enough to maintain the dividends at the cash amount, but we didn't have enough in the franking balance to fully frank the dividends. So we thought it was prudent, given the available franking we had and the expectation of that flow-through dividend yield that I mentioned, that we could maintain that 60% franked. And that's sort of at the moment where we are based on the profits reserve available and the available franking credits that we expected to be around 60% franked. And as we mentioned in WAM Research, obviously, if the portfolio can continue years like last year, up 26% and generating big amounts in the profits reserve and obviously the realization of that, that would be the pathway to getting back to fully-franked. And just on that, there was a question online, which I'm aware of, that how long will the dividends be franked to 60%? At this stage? Well, actually, in terms of paying the dividends, how long will we pay the dividends in terms of where the profit reserve, where we can still make profit? Cast our mind back in the GFC, there was a period there where we didn't have any profit for a six-month period, so we couldn't pay a dividend. So yeah, with that provided. So yeah, the two parts of the question that came in online is, how long will the 60% dividend be paid, and when will we go back to 100%? Any ideas? That was a guess, isn't it? Yeah. It It is a guess. At this stage, we foresee that the FY 2025, if the fully-franked dividends are to be maintained, sorry, if the dividends are being maintained at AUD 0.155 over the year, we expect it to be 60% franked. We would need some consecutive years' sort of performance well above that 16% per annum that's required just to maintain the dividends to sort of edge back to that fully-franked territory. That would be the pathway back to fully-franked. Yeah. Just so that I can understand it a little better, do you pay your tax on the 30th of June each year, and therefore that's when your franking balance increases, presuming you've made a profit? And the other thing is the franking credits you get from dividends in the companies you invest in. And when you make a loss, does that wipe out the franking credits that you get from the dividends, or are they in a separate bucket? Yeah. Just quickly on that one, we get to keep them. Even if we had a loss, any franking that we get from the investments in the portfolio, we get to keep that in our franking account, which is obviously separate to the balance sheet, and can pay that out. I mean, I would love to pay the tax bill at 30 June every year, once a year. Unfortunately, the tax office has a very different view on that. So we're on regular installments generally throughout the year, so monthly. So if you're ever looking at our NTAs, we try and tell you, obviously, the franking account is disclosed in the annual report every year, but each month, if we're paying tax, there's a disclosure in the NTA, which is telling you essentially the cents per share amount that we're paying in tax. So you can always keep an eye on when those tax payments are happening. And it is good to remember because it does come out of the pre-tax NTA when we're paying that cash away to the tax office. But we try and manage the cash flows quite closely because we, A, don't want it to have a big impact to the investment portfolio performance in generating that for shareholders. But B, obviously, we're conscious of the franking account and managing that at the same time to maintain dividends. So the installments that you pay are calculated by the tax department based on your previous year. Is that how it works? Like provisional tax? Yeah. That's the default position? Obviously, we can vary those installments based on the performance for the year. So if that installment is based on, say, performance and profit generated on 10%, but this year we're at 20%-30%, we'd be varying that installment to not make a big cash outflow, say, at the end of the year or when the tax return is due. We want to just be paying that along the way. If you've paid too much tax and you get a refund, how is that handled in terms of your franking balance? Yep. So if we did ever pay too much tax and we get a refund, that does reduce the franking account when you get the refund. I mean, there's been very few instances we've overpaid. We try and manage that closely so we're never getting any money back. It's more sometimes as a final top-up payment when we do our tax return in any event. Yeah. Thank you. Right. And we have a question over. Yep. Just there. Thanks. Good morning, Jeff, board members. As always, thanks for your time today and throughout the year. Wayne Perry is my name, and I'm here with our super fund and our personal holdings. I just want to talk a little bit more about the profit reserve just in terms of the, if you will, the management strategy of it. I mean, if I look at page five on the report, I see it's got AUD 0.147 per share as I assume 30 June, with a coverage of 0.9 years, and Jeff's talked to some years during COVID you couldn't pay and etc., etc. So my question is, is there a deliberate management strategy for a number of years of dividend coverage that you retain in the profit reserve, or is it just a number that comes out in the wash and you look at it, and if it's six, that's great, and if it's 0.6, well, that's great. It's just whatever it is. And I'm presuming as part of this, it can't be negative because otherwise you're going to be selling things to pay dividends. So can you just talk to the thinking behind that? Yeah. How we started announcing the profit reserve was probably just go back over time with listed investment companies. Some people don't understand how they generate profits and the ability for them to pay dividends. So I mean, we're a trader for tax purposes. So say if we start with $100 million or $100, so we go up 10%, then it goes up to $110. So then in theory, we've made $10 pre-tax. So there's no franking. Yeah, there's no franked dividend we receive, so we're going to pay $3 of tax. Then we can, in theory, pay a dividend of $7. Now, and then we pay that dividend out of $7, and so the assets go back to $100. We're not like an operating business. Well, we're not like an operating business selling widgets where we make a profit each year. Our profit is the performance of our portfolio. So if we start at $100 and there's nothing in the profit reserve and the portfolio goes down, there's no profit, and therefore there's no dividend. And in terms of, so a number of years ago, well, over the sort of 26 years, we've been trying to explain to people how it works. And then we started talking about, "Oh, well, our ability to pay a profit is how much is in the profit reserve." And so then we, yeah, then it's a number that just happens. Yeah. In terms of how much would we like in there, as directors, of course, we'd like as much as possible. We'd like two years or three years of profit reserve in there. So our ability to keep paying dividends, yeah, we have confidence in our ability to keep paying dividends. Now, as I mentioned earlier, and Jesse mentioned, pretty much after a year ago, after the final dividend had been paid, we virtually had nothing there. So if the portfolio, if the team hadn't performed as well as they did, then there would have been no dividends. Does that sort of explain? Yeah. Yeah. No. Jesse, was there anything in? Oh. Yes. Yeah. There's not. The number just as it turns out. Correct. Yeah, in theory, you could argue, and there's a good question about that, which I'll answer. You could effectively say, and I think we use this example in the annual report. Yeah. Do Do we use that example in the annual report? Do you want to go through it, Jesse? Yeah. I mean, just something that would remind all shedders, there's a lot of detail in the Chairman's letter in the Annual Report. And part of that detail is just explaining that, I mean, over the past five years, the investment portfolio was up around 10% per annum. It outperformed the All Ords and outperformed the Small Ords from an actual assets perspective. But we were paying out around 14% grossed up, including tax per annum to shareholders. Now, what that has meant is the NTA and the share price has gone backwards. Returns have been more income than any capital. It's actually been a slight capital loss. And we do need to add back the dividends, but the reason that's been able to happen was the Profit Reserve that was available pre-COVID. So the profits reserve there enabled us to sort of maintain the dividend, and then the profits that were generated sort of each year, we've been able to maintain the dividend. But the 2022 year was probably the big year when the market was down considerably, and we also maintained a big fully-franked dividend during that time. So that's sort of, I mean, the story as to where we are in the profits reserve now and why we only had sort of AUD 0.016 left sort of at the start of the financial year. In the annual report, we actually go through a scenario, which was a conversation at the time sort of around that COVID period, in terms of cutting the dividend. And if we'd cut the dividend 50%, what the NTA would be today, which sort of or at 30 June, it would have been sort of up back closer to that $2 mark. And the return in total would be the same, but it would be a different combination of income and capital growth. So shareholders have received a high income component and franking credits and have not seen any capital growth. It's been slight capital loss over that period. But if we were to sort of go back and change that decision, the NTA would be higher and the share price would be higher, but you would have received a lot less in the dividends over that time. And actually, I know we've got a question online, Ophelia, which sort of spells out the answer, spells out exactly that point. Do you want to ask the question? Yeah. Definitely. This isn't the Dorothy Dix. It just happens to be perfectly here. No. This came from Charlie and H&G Lavelle, Super. So both invested in their SMSF in WAM in 2015, one at 207 and one at 203. They've said that dividends have been steady, communication has been good, but the share price has been 30% lower than the initial investment for some time. Does the board have any insight to this as to when the value will return? Maybe just one additional comment to before. Over that time period as well, the shares were probably trading on average at that 20%-25% premium to NTA, at one point as high as a 30% premium. And that premium has come down at 30 June and was at a slight discount. So that's also been an impact to the share price level over that time period as well. Yeah. So there's that. And then the interesting thing is the actual portfolio, the WAM portfolio was up 11.1%. Now, let's say the management fee is per annum. So let's take 1% off management fee, so broadly 10%. And the All-Ords was up 9.6%, so slightly outperformed the All-Ords. And the Small-Ords was up 7.6% over that period. And the interesting thing is the dividend that was paid for that investor, he got AUD 1.52 in fully franked dividends over that period, which would relate to, yeah, which if he could get the refund back, about AUD 2.14. And so to me, that's the hard part. We've actually been paying a sort of a super, yeah, we've been paying out more than what we've got in there. So the big debate every dividend is, "Hey, look, are we better off?" And the example we used in the annual report, we're giving you a better yield. Yeah. If we cut the dividend before at the start of COVID, we'd be giving you a better yield than the market, fully-franked. Plus, you'd have capital. You'd feel wealthier because your capital is AUD 2. Yeah. How How we've given you your capital is by fully, well, by fully-franked dividends up until this year. So to me, that's each board meeting with capital management, "Oh, do we keep the dividend? Yeah. Do we cut it?" etc., etc. And so what we've decided to date is, well, we're, and really, the tough part is the investment guys have done an exceptional job. But you as shareholders are saying, "Well, hold it. Doesn't feel that exceptional because I bought at this price. I assume I get my dividends for free, and it's here." Anyway, does that help sort of answer it a bit? Yeah. In summary, and I'm thinking while you've been speaking, so thank you. In summary, you can argue that there's actually - if you take the whole bucket and you divvy it up into two things and you call it NTA and dividend, there's money moving from one bucket to the other, and you're making decisions in effect about where the money's going and from which bucket. And it really comes down to that. And that's fine. Yeah. No. Thank you. Any other questions in the room? Yes. Yes. Hi, Jeff. Thanks for the update on the finance. I'm just touching on a point about the share price. I basically bought WAM. I've got to say, your food during the WAM conferences are very good. I was hoping to have good food. That's why I come to this first AGM. I've got to... The highest better food. I've got to compliment you for the food at a WAM conference. My question is basically, I've got your shares in my personal portfolio that I can write off losses, but I can't write off losses in my SMSF. I've been monitoring the shares for the last three years. Unfortunately, I bought it at a premium price, as what the other gentleman was saying. But overall, the dividends are good. So at the moment, it's break-even. So I have been thinking, should I rotate WAM out of my portfolio? But I've trusted you, Geoff. So I like to know from your team's perspective, now with Trump coming in and most of WAM shares are in the small and mid-cap, I'd like to hear from your team what's the strategy moving forward and if the price may slowly climb back up with Trump being the president of the USA. Okay. And that question is pretty much around, of course, we can't give tax advice or advice. Now, what we try to do is buy things at a discount. Now, WAM is trading a little bit of a discount, so you're not paying a premium. But in terms of the outlook for the portfolio, I'll pass over to Oscar, who manages the portfolio. Thanks, Geoff. And good to see you all. I appreciate the question. I think the market always likes certainty. And I think going into the election, the fact that Trump effectively got in was good for the market because we've had precedents back in 2020, obviously, through the first term, 2016 to 2020. It was actually very good for markets and good for business. And I think that's the key. I think at the same time, you've got rates coming down in the U.S. So I'd say in terms of our portfolio and how we're thinking about things, is you want some companies that potentially are exposed to the U.S. because we think things will get better. There's also talk about less regulation. So some companies such as Square that we own, which is obviously the takeover of Afterpay years ago, that's done incredibly well for us over the last six weeks or so. ZipMoney as well. So we're looking at exposures within the portfolio that are in the U.S., but also seeing the Australian dollar fall, which is good, obviously, for exports and so forth. So companies within the portfolio with an exposure to the United States come to mind, such as Corporate Travel we've been buying, ALS Limited on the mining services side, and has a very strong U.S. exposure. So ultimately, we think it'll be very good for markets and small-cap companies. Okay. And just on that, if anyone from 12:30 P.M. to 1:30 P.M., the investment guys, we've got a break between the AGMs. The investment guys are here, so you can ask them any questions about any stocks or any other market questions. So thanks, Oscar. Thank you. Any more questions in the room? Yes. Question. Just the lady up there and one down here. Oscar, do you want to pass yours to the gentleman here? Yes. Thank you for your presentations today. My question is just to follow on from the last one in that it's really to Oscar, I suppose, whether a fall in interest rates will also assist the value of the portfolio going forward? And Oscar, will you be, are you staying till 12:30 P.M. or not? Or can we answer that there? Is that possible? Yeah. Unless you can give us a quick answer now. I'll give you a really quick answer. It'll be very good for the portfolio. Anthony, I'll tell you why. At 12:30, he'll tell you why. And I bet he uses New Zealand as an example. He's here. Yeah. So I think I know. Yes. Thanks, Geoff. Joe, I'm a personal and corporate owner. Look, I appreciate those comments about the past asset NTA issues and so forth. And Oscar's comments briefly about the future. I did want a better picture on expectations ahead. Maybe you can advance that. And I also note Wilson Assets has been involved in a lot of takeover other funds over the last year or two. Is that going to continue? What's the benefits, pros, and cons on continuing that direction? Because that does also affect the share price quite a bit. Yes. Usually, yeah. I mean, in terms of the opportunity to present themselves, we will. And usually, pretty much all the deals we've done, it's been a benefit to shareholders. We've actually bought the assets cheaply. And as the first thing, and the second thing is some of them have had a secondary benefit. Those companies have franking in them as well. So the primary benefit is getting a better return, and that's the secondary benefit. Yeah. Yeah. But not on a per-share basis. We're not diluting. On a per-share basis, we're actually going up. Yeah. So So now, anything online before we? Yes, Jeff. I've got about five questions online. Two from Stephen. First one is, we've been a big investor in Star Entertainment and have lost large chunks of capital as the casino company created. That's not any. WAM Capital doesn't own any. Yep. Yep. And then. Have you ever had Star? No, never. Owned Star? Yep. Can you please name three worst investments over the journey, but don't just focus on the negative, and please mention our three or four best investments? Worst, that's easy. NextEd, NXD, EML Payments, EML, and SmartPay, SMP. I would say learnings. Look, for us, sort of big fund. That's it. 12:30. Okay. And three best. Oh, three best. Yeah. Lunch at 12:30 P.M. Learnings at 12:30. I like that. TUA, TPG Singapore, GDG, Generation Development Group, and Sigma. God, Sigma Chemist Warehouse. Yep. A next question. How exposed are we to a hostile shareholder resolution to either reduce the management fee or internalize management to save costs, similar to what happened to various externally managed Macquarie vehicles after the GFC? If shareholders decided they want to sack Wilson Asset Management as the manager, what sort of go away fee are we currently contractually obliged to pay, if any? Yeah. Well, in theory, shareholders decide. So that's the answer to the first part. And I don't know. I'd have to get our lawyers here to find out how much we want to get paid. So there's Jesse. Yeah. I mean, I'm pretty sure it's in the original prospectus of the company. It's normally the previous 12 months' fees on termination, including management and performance fees. Yeah. Next one. Question from Stod. WAM's ability to include liquid capital gains when paying dividends. Yeah. We don't have any liquid capital gains because we're a trader for tax purposes. Yep. John has asked, can you provide reasons for the large drop in the share price? What are the prospects for the share price in the next 12 months? Yeah. Well, it's a function of performance and going from a premium to a slight discount and actually paying sort of super dividends. And last question from Stephen is, will a full unedited copy of the AGM webcast archive be made available on the company's website? And why not lodge a full copy of the transcript at the ASX? Yeah. That's a good one. Why not? We haven't decided. Why not? But thank you, Stephen. Yeah, always good feedback. We enjoy having you. I hope you're a shareholder. I hope you own more than one share asking those questions. If that can be in the transcript if we lodge it. Any other questions in the room? Yes. Thanks. Yeah. Nick Bolton. Are we still caught up with Nick Bolton and this deal? We're dealing with that. That's in WAM Active as an or WAM Capital has a really small amount. Well, actually, yes. What is it? Sorry. The matter is before the court. That's it, Your Honor. Yeah. Yeah. No. I mean, are we allowed to say why we're taking to court? Because we think I can't say it's stolen, can I? No. No. No. No. We think something's gone missing. Yeah. But yeah. No, I can't say that. Sorry. So why don't I declare the poll closed? Why don't I declare and we'll close the meeting? Yeah. Okay. And now we've got a 15-minute break. We've got a quick morning tea. Thank you very much.