Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the Befesa Preliminary Year-End Result 2024 Conference Call. I am Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the Befesa Preliminary Year-End Result 2024 Conference Call. I am Youssef, the conference c all operator. I would like to remind you that all participants will be in listen-only mode and that the conference is being recorded. The presentation will be followed by a Q&A session. You can register for questions at any time by pressing star and one on your telephone. For operator assistance, please press star and zero. The conference must not be recorded for publication or for broadcast. At this time, it's my pleasure to hand over to Rafael Pérez, CFO. Please go ahead. Good morning and welcome to the Preliminary Full Year 2024 Results Conference Call of Befesa. I am Rafael Pérez, CFO of Befesa. This morning, I'm joined by our Group CEO, Asier Zarraonandia. Asier will start with an executive summary of the period, and then he will cover the business highlights of the steel dust, as well as aluminum salt slag recycling business. I will then review the financials by business and will cover the evolution of commodity prices, our hedging program, and finally, cash flow, net debt, and capital allocation. Asier will close this presentation providing an update on the outlook for 2025 and an update of our growth plan. Finally, we will open the lines for the Q&A session. Before getting started, let me remind you that this conference call is being webcasted live. You can find the link to the webcast Preliminary Full Year 2024 Results presentation on our website, www.befesa.com. Now, let me turn this call over to our CEO. Asier, please. Thank you, Rafa. Moving to page five of the business highlights. Befesa has delivered a strong fourth quarter and full year results despite a challenging macroeconomic environment, which demonstrates the resiliency of our business model. Total Adjusted EBITDA in the fourth quarter has been EUR 62 million, up 27% compared to the previous quarter, making a record level for quarterly results, reflecting a strong year-on-year performance. For the full year, Adjusted EBITDA reached EUR 213 million, an increase of 17% compared to the previous year. Operating cash flows have increased by 30% year-on-year, driven by a strong cash conversion. Leverage at year-end reached 2.9x, below our initial target of 3x. We have delivered solid performance during the year, with solid steel dust volume in our two main markets, Europe and the U.S., despite the challenge that the steel sector is suffering. In our aluminum business, we have delivered a strong performance in our salt slags recycling business, driven by the Hannover plant back to full operations and strong volume received from our customers. On the other hand, our secondary aluminum business has been impacted by a challenging automotive industry in Europe. I will elaborate later on all these aspects. On outlook, we expect 2025 to be another year of strong earnings, strong annual growth, and further delivery during the year. We are adjusting our business plan and capital allocation to focus on reducing delivery and investing in ongoing approved expansion projects. As such, the expansion plan in China is stopped due to the current market conditions. Our growth CapEx will focus on finishing the refurbishment of Palmerton and the expansion of Bernburg, both low-risk projects from an execution, technology, and commercial point of view. Moving on to page six. Overall, our steel dust recycling business has delivered strong results in 2024 in Europe and the U.S. In Europe, the steel sector is going through a challenging period, with steel production in Europe at the five-year low levels impacted by weak demand. In Europe, despite this challenging environment, the level of steel dust delivery from our EAF steel customers is stable and solid, and we continue to run our plants at a very high capacity utilization with an average of 92%. In the U.S., in the steel dust recycling business, we are running the plants at good levels of utilization, similar to previous quarters, around 70%. The measures that we have been taking and best practices that we have been applying to improve the recycling operations are on track and delivering good results, achieving higher EBITDA per ton gradually. The zinc refining plant in the US is in the final stage of the ramp-up and turnaround process, with a strong focus on cost reductions. In 2024, the unfavorable combination of TCs and premiums for Special High Grade produced around EUR 15 million negative contribution. In our Asian operation, we have delivered robust Q4 in Turkey and South Korea, reaching a strong level of utilization. Our Chinese plants continue running at an utilization level of 50%, impacted by weak electric arc furnaces steel production. Moving on to page seven, business highlights for the aluminum salt slag recycling business. In the aluminum business, we have delivered a strong volume of salt slag recycling, which has been partially offset by weak secondary aluminum results. On salt slags, the strong volume has resulted in a very high capacity utilization of the plants, driven by the Hannover plant in Germany back to operations at full capacity. This strong operating result has been partially offset by lower FMB aluminum price. On the other hand, our secondary aluminum segment has been suffering during the whole year from a very weak European automotive industry, which is affecting the demand of secondary aluminum. This is putting a lot of pressure on the aluminum metal margin, which is suffering compression compared to the levels of last year, caused by weak demand of secondary aluminum, coupled with difficult access to aluminum scrap in the market. Now, Rafael will explain the financials in more detail. Thank you, Asier. Moving to page seven, sorry, moving to page nine, financial results for our steel dust segment. Steel dust delivered EUR 170 million of Adjusted EBITDA in 2024. This represents a 25% year-on-year improvement compared to 2023. EBITDA margin improved from 17%- 21% in the period. The EUR 36 million EBITDA improvement has been driven by the following factors. The year-on-year impact from volume was flat, with a total plant utilization at 70%, similar to last year. On price, a strong positive EBITDA year-on-year impact of about EUR 44 million, with the three main price components being: EUR 7 million EBITDA impact from higher LME prices, 5% in the year. EUR 15 million positive impact from high zinc hedging prices, EUR 140 per ton higher, year-on-year on average. And thirdly, EUR 22 million positive impact from the lower zinc treatment charges, which was set at $165 per ton for the year 2024 versus $274 per 2023. On costs and others, Befesa coke average price continued further normalization throughout 2024 to levels below the 2022 average price, driving EUR 11 million of positive EBITDA impact in the year. Operational improvements in the U.S. recycling operations also have delivered positive EBITDA contribution as well in the period, improving the EBITDA per ton on the steel dust treated. All these positive impacts have been partially offset by general inflation and other effects, mainly attributable to EUR 15 million negative contribution from the zinc refining operations in the U.S., which is going through a turnaround plan. As Asier explained, we are laser-focused on executing our strong cash reduction plan. Moving to page 10, financial results for our aluminum segment. Aluminum salt slags delivered EUR 43 million of EBITDA in 2024, which represents a 10% year-on-year decrease compared to EUR 48 million in 2023. The year-on-year EUR 5 million of negative EBITDA development was mainly due to the lower aluminum metal margin, partially offset by lower energy prices. On volumes, overall positive EBITDA year-on-year impact. Our recycled volumes of salt slags increased by 18% to 426,000 tons in the period, driven by the resumption of operations at our Hannover plant. Our secondary aluminum alloys production volumes increased by 2% to 171,000 tons. With these volumes, we operated our plants at a strong utilization rate of about 91% in salt slags and 84% in secondary aluminum on average. With regards to prices, overall negative EBITDA year-on-year impact of around EUR 11 million, mainly driven by pressure aluminum metal margins versus the previous year. This compression in the aluminum metal margin is caused by two main factors. On the one hand, there is a scarcity of aluminum scrap in the European market, driven by lower overall industrial activity, as well as higher exports of aluminum scrap away from Europe, and secondly, by a weak automotive industry in Europe, which impacts the demand of secondary aluminum from automakers. Aluminum FMB price was up 5%, with an average slightly above EUR 2,300 per ton. The negative price effect was partially compensated with year-on-year lower operating cost, mainly through the lower energy prices of electricity as well as natural gas. Moving on to page 11, zinc price and treatment charges. Regarding zinc LME prices during 2024, zinc has been trading with some volatility over the marginal cost of the producer zinc TC, trading sideways in the range of $2,300-$3,100 per ton. The average of 2024 zinc LME price has been $2,780 per ton, which is slightly above the last year's average of $2,650, on average up 5% in the period. In 2024, zinc prices have been trading well above the marginal cost of the producer, which is around $2,500 level. On treatment charges, on the right-hand side, in 2024, treatment charges for zinc were settled in April at $165 per ton for the full year 2024. As explained earlier, this reduction had a positive impact of around EUR 22 million in 2024. We have to wait until March or April to see the settlement of the treatment charges benchmark for this year of 2025. As a reference, the spot treatment charge in the market is trading on the negative zone, which very rarely happens. This shows the current supply-demand dynamics in the zinc market, characterized by reduced supply of zinc concentrates from mines, which is making spot treatment charges to be negative. It seems that this dynamic continues, which may imply annual treatment charges for 2025 should remain at a low level. Turning to page 12 on hedging, we have taken the opportunity of the volatility in the zinc price seen throughout 2024 to extend our hedging book further towards the end of 2026. With this extension, our zinc hedge book covers close to 24 months of hedge at increasing hedging average prices of EUR 2,650 or $2,950 per ton in 2025 and 2026. This level of hedging represents an all-time high level of hedging for Befesa and will provide around EUR 20 million-EUR 22 million of incremental EBITDA in this year 2025, regardless of what happens with the zinc price. We continue to monitor the market to close volumes for the first quarter of 2027. Our hedging strategy remains unchanged and continues to be a key element of Befesa's business model, providing earnings visibility and predictability, lowering the impact from zinc price volatility. This year is a great example of how our hedging strategy enabled us to benefit from the volatility of the zinc price. While the average zinc price in 2024 has been $2,780, we have been able to hedge the second half of 2025 and entire full year 2026 at an average price of $2,950. This is $170 higher than the average LME zinc price in the year. Now, moving to page 13 on Befesa energy prices. The page shows the evolution with the three main energy sources that we have in Befesa: coke, natural gas, and electricity. With regards to coke price, which today represents around 55% of the total energy bill, the normalization that started in the second quarter of 2023 is continuing throughout 2024 to levels below 2022 average. Average coke price in 2024 has been around EUR 180 per ton, which is 20% lower than in 2023. This had a positive impact on our steel dust operations, as explained in the bridge. Despite this positive trend, however, the average coke price in 2024 is still around 30% above the average levels seen in 2019 and 2021. Regarding electricity, which today accounts for around 25% of the total energy expense, prices decreased around 20% in 2024. Gas prices stayed pretty much in line with previous years. Now, turning to page 14, cash flow results. The operating cash flow in 2024 has reached EUR 192 million, which represents an all-time high level and an increase of 30% compared to the last year. On the EBITDA to cash flow bridge, starting with EUR 213 million Adjusted EBITDA and walking to the right, working capital consumption of EUR 26 million in the year, down from EUR 37 million in the previous quarter. As in previous years, working capital improvement improved significantly in Q4 compared to the previous quarters. Overall, working capital consumption was pretty much driven by the increase in revenues and receivables. Taxes received in 2024 came in at EUR 4 million as a result of a tax final assessment of the previous year, resulting in an operating cash flow of EUR 192 million in 2024, up 30% compared to last year. On CapEx, in 2024, we have invested EUR 56 million on regular maintenance CapEx, EUR 23 million in growth CapEx, mainly related to the refurbishment of Palmerton in Pennsylvania, and EUR 40 million in the 50% acquisition stake in Recytech. In summary, total CapEx of EUR 118 million in the year. Total interest paid increased to EUR 42 million in the year, mainly driven by the year-on-year higher EURIBOR, as well as a slightly higher margin spread. On dividend, a total dividend of EUR 29 million equivalent to 0.73 EUR per share was paid to shareholders in the third quarter of last year. For 2025, the board of directors will propose to pay a dividend of EUR 25 million equivalent to 0.63 EUR per share or 50% of the net income. In summary, free cash flow before dividend and M&A amounted to EUR 65 million. Cash on hand stood at EUR 103 million, which together with the EUR 100 million undrawn revolving credit line provides Befesa with more than EUR 200 million of liquidity. Gross debt at the end of 2024 stood at EUR 722 million. Net debt at closing of the year stood at EUR 619 million compared to EUR 662 at the end of the previous quarter, resulting in a net leverage of 2.9 at the end of the year compared to 3.4 at the end of the previous quarter, and better than our initial target of3x. Turning to page 15, debt reduction and leverage. In July 2024, we extended the maturity of our debt until July 2029. The new financing, together with our consistent hedging policy and cash flow generation profile, provides the strong financial backbone to support the future growth of Befesa, with a strong focus on capital allocation discipline and leverage management. The reduction in the leverage ratio from 3.4 to current 2.9 demonstrates our commitment to rigorous capital allocation. We will continue reducing the leverage throughout 2025 to keep it between 2x and 2.5x going forward. To do so, we will prioritize our growth CapEx on those projects that will deliver immediate cash flow upon completion, like Resitec and the approved projects of Palmerton and Bernburg. Also, we will keep the annual regular maintenance CapEx around EUR 40 million-EUR 45 million in the coming years. On dividend, we are committed to maintain our dividend policy to pay between 40%-50% of the net income to shareholders as dividend. Now, back to Asier on outlook and growth. Moving on to page 17 on outlook, you can see in the page the main drivers of our view for 2025. As explained earlier, we expect 2025 to be another year of strong double-digit earnings growth and further deleveraging during the year. This is fundamentally based on better zinc hedging levels, as Rafael explained, as well as lower zinc refining cost in the US. In steel dust, we expect to continue running the plants at high capacity utilization and achieve a stable volume compared to 2024, despite current challenging steel industry in Europe. In the US, we expect higher EAF steel dust volume driven by volume from new contracts. In China, we expect a slightly better situation than in 2024, with overall positive contribution in the country driven by a positive development in Jiangsu. On our aluminum business, we expect a stable salt and slag volume compared to 2024. However, on secondary aluminum, we expect a stable to negative evolution as we continue to see metal margin compression caused by aluminum scrap scarcity in Europe and a weak demand from the auto sector. The zinc refining plant in the US, we managed to stabilize operations during 2024, and we are taking strong operation cost-cutting measures in 2025. We are aiming at a fixed cost reduction between EUR 15 million-EUR 20 million to be captured in 2025. The current environment characterized by low TCs and low zinc premiums makes it to be at the bottom of the cycle for the refining business. On energy prices, we expect a slightly lower overall coke prices for the group in 2025. However, we are expecting natural gas and electricity prices in Europe to be higher than 2024. On treatment charges for zinc, the zinc concentrate market remains very tight at the moment, with a spot TC in the negative territory, which will indicate that the trend for TC will be downwards. As a reference, the last 15-year low was at $143. For 2025, we are expecting 2025 benchmark TC to remain stable or lower than $165, which was the level for 2024. As explained by Rafael, average zinc price hedging for 2025 at EUR 2,640 will drive strong earnings growth in 2025. On zinc prices, we expect some degree of volatility driven by global macroeconomic and geopolitical uncertainty. The marginal cost of the producer's C1 is around EUR 2,500 level, acting as a floor of the zinc price. On leverage, we are expecting to finish 2025 below 2.5x, as explained by Rafael. We are adjusting our business plan and capital allocation to focus on reducing the leverage and invest in ongoing approved expansion projects. As such, the expansion plan in China is still due to the current market conditions. Our growth CapEx will focus on finishing the refurbishment of Palmerton and the expansion of Bernburg, both low-risk projects from the execution, technology, and commercial point of view. Moving on to page 19 of Palmerton. The refurbishment of Palmerton plant in Pennsylvania is moving well on time and on budget. The first kiln of the project is already completed and in operation. The second kiln will be completed by the second half of the next year. We are signing new contracts with the steel makers' customers, and so far, we have secured more than 50,000 tons that are coming into operation during the 2025 year. Moving on to page 20 on Bernburg. With regards to the expansion of the secondary aluminum production capacity in the Befesa plant in Bernburg, in Germany, we are moving forward with the permits, authorizations, and commercial contracts with customers. This project is linked to the demand for the recycling aluminum we are getting from existing Befesa customers in Europe. We expect to start investing in the second half of the year. In summary, our growth plan is flexible, and we are adjusting and adapting it to the current circumstances, balancing leverage and CapEx, which results in a better growth and financial profile over 2025 and the next years. Thank you very much. Thank you, Asier. We will now open the lines for your questions. Ladies and gentlemen, we will now begin the question-and-answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on their telephone. You'll hear a tone to confirm that you have entered the question queue. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and two. Participants are requested to only use handsets while asking a question. Anyone who has a question may press star and one at this time. The first question comes from the line of Brian Butler from Stifel. Please go ahead. Hey, good morning, or I guess, afternoon. Thank you for taking my questions. Maybe we can start just, where do you see kind of the current environment relative on the steel production cycle? It looks like it's very depressed and in a normalized kind of recovery or getting back to a normal level in steel production. What kind of incremental upside would that be to Befesa, color-wise? Thank you for the question, Brian. I think it's a very theoretical question about the full recovery of the steel production over the last five years. Obviously, it's different by regions. It's a different picture. In Europe, basically, we are in the full capacity. So no matter what they do, probably we are going to be, again, growing inventories, but not many differences in throughput. Of course, in the U.S., we will be waiting for if there is an increase, we are going to fill the mining capacity that we have still in place. It reminds me that we have a 70% utilization. This is the same in the case of Asia. I mean, probably it's in the range of 70%, and we have room to increase up to, well, of course, 100%. China, no doubt that we have very low capacity utilization rate. So the effort, it's a combination, difficult to say, but at the end of the day, it depends where you want to move and multiply by some average EUR 8 per ton, and you can multiply whatever is that. But difficult to say an amount depending on the recovery, of course. Okay. And then I guess just one on modeling. Working capital was the use of cash this year. How should we think about working capital needs into 2025? Thank you, Brian. Well, basically, the usual working capital outflow is driven by the increasing activity. Revenues increased 5%, and accordingly, the receivables. I think going into 2025, as you know, we will provide the full-year guidance once the treatment charges have been settled around March, April. But I think from the working capital point of view, you can pencil in like EUR 10 million-EUR 15 million, something like that. Okay. Great. Thank you for taking my questions. Thank you, Brian. Thank you, Brian. The next question comes from the line of Shashank Shekhar from Citi. Please go ahead. Hi. Good morning, everyone, and thank you very much for this opportunity. I have three questions. The first one is on the utilization rate at the steel dust recycling business. In the fourth quarter, it has increased to 74%. Just wanted to know, how did you achieve it, and is this rate sustainable going forward? My second question is on Henan plant in China. How much is the current capacity utilization at this plant, and is there any plan to reduce cost there? My last question is on your cost. What is your view on cost inflation for this year? Hi, Shashank. Thank you for the questions. Starting for the first one, the Q4 is a 74% utilization rate, higher than the others. Basically, as you know, the utilization rate normally out of the deliveries by region is affected by the maintenance stoppage of the plants, and as well, in the particular case of the Turkish third Q stoppage by a strike. So all in all, the fourth quarter is a good and strong 74% utilization rate. Moving forward, I do recommend more to see it in the yearly level because depending on the maintenance stoppage that we have to do to our plants, the quarters could be different. As an example, first Q in 2025 could come a little bit lower in utilization because we are stopping a big plant and so on. But the full year, I think that in general, we are going to increase the capacity utilization slightly. I mean, 70%-75% is a good reference. In the case of China, as you know, we have two plants. One of those, Jiangsu, we are running the level of 60% or something like that capacity, and what we expect in 2025 is even a little bit higher in the level of 60%-70%, well, could be the same. We are not being very optimistic unless we see a clear change in the market, so I think that repeating or a slightly better situation in Jiangsu plant is something that we can consider. Henan plant is just running in the level of 20%, and we don't see more than that in 2025, so overall, we are talking about 50% capacity, more or less, in China, and could be a good reference, 50%-60% in 2025. Regarding costs to be in those low levels, well, we can say that we have Henan with a minimum people at the plant, and even we are using when we stop the other plant when we have to run campaigns in Henan. So we are having the costs in a very controlled way, and that's why even Henan being stopped is not delivering negative and neither in the case of the two plants together. Regarding the costs of inflation for next year, I think in overall, well, you know that taking out the energy that Rafael has explained about the coal, but the electricity and what you have the typical fixed costs like personnel and maintenance and something like that. It is the inflation rate by countries, but in global, I think that something like EUR 5-6 million globally could be considered if you want to have a round number. The next question comes from the line of Ioannis Masvoulas from Morgan Stanley. Please go ahead. Thank you. Thanks Thanks very much for the presentation and well done on the results today. First question on Palmerton. Given the investment there, can you give us an idea on what sort of EBITDA uplift you anticipate for 2025 versus 2024, and then at full run rate 2026 versus 2025, just to get a sense on the EBITDA trajectory there? Thank you. Thank you for the question, Ioannis. The Palmerton issue, I will suggest to focus globally in the US because obviously, we have a strong capacity currently, and when the Palmerton being back on track at the end of this year with the two kilns, well, utilization rate in general in the US will be affected by the availability of dust on our contracts and the production of our steel makers' contracts. But the key here is that the increase of volumes in general in all the plants, we are more or less thinking that with the new contracts which are coming for the new projects, in 2025 could be in the range of 5 million-6 million additional. But I think it's as we have explained during the presentation, well, globally, we expect more achievement in the US altogether with the refining plant savings. 2026, we think that we still see growing volumes, and it's too early to say the effect because there are many things to consider, but another easily 50,000 tons, 60,000 tons more could arise for 2026 onward. The idea is to be in two years with the projects coming into, I mean, into the market or running at the end in the next two, three years, coming to utilization rates of 80%-85% for 2027 or something like that. This is the idea, and we will keep informing about the delivery and how the things are going. Okay. Got it. So basically, just to recap on the U.S., if we look at the increase, the volumes, plus the fixed cost reduction at the zinc refining, you're looking at something in the order of EUR 20 million-EUR 25 million improvement? Yes. At least 20, I will be more comfortable to be a little bit more reserved. But yes, I think it's a good combination. Okay. Very clear. And the second question on the CapEx guidance, because I'm a bit puzzled here, you talk about EUR 100 million for the coming years per annum, right? And within that, you talk about EUR 40 million-EUR 45 million of sustaining CapEx and remaining spending in Palmerton and Bernburg in the order of EUR 55 million-EUR 60 million. So that gets us to around EUR 100 million or maybe slightly around EUR 100 million for 2025, but I would have expected a meaningful step down from 2026 and something closer to sustaining CapEx levels in 2027, which is not what you're indicating today. So could you perhaps elaborate what drives that and whether there are any additional projects that you are considering as part of this EUR 100 million run rate? Thank you. Yeah. Well, it's true that you define very well about the 2025. Those are the idea, Palmerton and Bernburg in the part of the growth. For the next years, I think it will depend. The level of 100 is a good reference, obviously. We don't want to move a lot from that, slightly up or down, because what we want to do is the next projects in line, which are salt slag plant in Europe or a second kiln in the French plant for electrical furnace dust treatment. I mean, we'll come when we will see or when we see that the market is there, right? So in theory, in the pipeline, you could have those 100 million considering that all the plants are coming one after the other. But again, we will inform about when we start the next plants, like the salt slag and the French kiln, right? So it will depend on that. But the 100 million is a good reference because the idea is to do under this kind of cap or reference, again, those projects going and splitting one after the other during the years. Okay. Got it. And just to clarify, on Palmerton, there is no remaining in 2026, and on Bernburg, there is a bit more to go, right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Excellent. Thank you very much. Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Lasse Stüben from Berenberg. Please go ahead. Hi. Good morning. Just to follow up on the zinc refining asset, just to confirm, so you're expecting that to be broadly break-even this year. Is that the right way to think about it? And then the second question is just on China. Are you seeing any early signs that that's improving? I mean, that seems to be a bit of a tailwind for the resi construction sector. So I'm wondering if there's any early signs that maybe also into 2026 that that could be a bit better than it is now. Thanks. Thank you for the question, Lasse. Well, in the case of refining, yes. In general terms, it's true that we can have in mind about EUR 15 million-EUR 20 million improvement, and that could be directly on the profit and loss account of the group, which is going to be. The results of the refining plant itself will depend on the TC evolution as well. But on the other hand, this TC we will collect in the refining plant of the U.S. as well. So EUR 15 million is a kind of net contribution from one year to the other, no matter what is the final result about TCs and so on in the refining. So this is a little bit idea is to reduce cost in 2015 and capture this positive effect in 2025. Regarding China, yes, we see that it is a slightly better situation based on new contracts and will depend all the time about the capacity utilization that the steel makers are. We are a little bit more positive than in 2024 with a contribution of, I don't know, EUR 4 million-EUR 5 million, so something like that among the two plants, which is better than the break-even point at this point. But it's not a very important contribution, but it's a good signal that the plant in Jiangsu, specifically when it's running, is delivering positive EBITDA as it was planned, how to say, at the same price levels, treatment charges, and situation. But yes, we expect this contribution is not something very significant for the whole group operations, but it's a positive signal that the things could become better there. Okay. Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Christopher Blizzard from BNP Paribas. Please go ahead. Yes. Good morning, and thank you for taking my question. I have two follow-up questions on the U.S., please. Could you help me to better understand the timing perspective when to expect additional steel dust volumes to positively impact your operations? So particularly, in which quarter should we expect those positive contributions? And secondly, is my understanding correct that out of the EUR 15 million-EUR 20 million of cost savings, EUR 15 million will make it through the P&L in 2025, and then there's this spillover effect for 2026? Thank you. Hi, Christopher. Well, starting for the second part of the second question, yes, it is there to be for all the years because it's affecting to the fixed cost and all the operation costs of the plant. I think that once we get this level, it is nothing to do with being back on the level that we are having, right? In the case of the U.S., well, the idea here always we have to explain or try to explain that our plans in the U.S. were based on the current circumstances of dust availability for the players that we are in that country or in the area because it's North America affecting. The reality is that there are projects for new electric furnace plants that probably you have already monitored that are coming into the picture. Such as ArcelorMittal in 2025, Algoma in 2025, Nucor, West Virginia is coming as well in 2026. All in all, it's depending on when those projects start to be in the picture and tracking. Our expectation is more or less clear than in 2025. Reference of 50,000 tons is the reference when we are in contact with those guys, the new guys that are coming into the picture when they are going to finally start up operation with a good ramp-up. But in that range, it's secure in the near future. For 2026, we hope that it's another 60,000 or 70,000 max could come with those projects and 2027 and other something like that as well. So in the three years, probably the total idea is to have 150,000 tons more. Timing and effort will depend as well on the evolution of the other parameters that are affecting our results. But to have an idea, as I said before, you can get those kind of tonnages, more or less have your numbers and multiply by the EBITDA level that you want about the and you are going to have a kind of idea contribution. In our case, we like to be closer to the years where we are talking about to define more or less. That's why 2025 we see in the range of 6 million or something like that contribution, depending on the market evolution, but now it's a good reference. And we'll see a little bit higher in 2026 and so. Okay. Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Batıkan Kaya from Kepler Cheuvreux. Please go ahead. Yes. Well, I have two questions about the U.S. as well. So the first one would be, how is the integration of AZR in the U.S. developing? And the second one would be, what are your synergy targets for the region in 2025? Thank you. Hi, Batıkan. Thank you very much for the question. Well, integration in the U.S., we can say that it's done. I mean, it was the couple of years we were discussing about the evolution of the synergies and things like that, but we can say that now where we are is more or less where we want to be, providing that we are always in an ongoing or improving systems for all our plants. So I think there is room to do better things and so on. Integration in general in the group is done for sure, and the cost efficiency in the furnace is already done. For not repeating a lot, the refinery is where we are now focused for the reduction of the cost, and this is how we see. Thank you. The next question comes from Jorge González from Hauck Aufhäuser Investment Banking. Please go ahead. Good evening, sir and Rafael. Thank you for taking my questions. So two questions from my side. The first question on the very strong end of the year, especially for the Waelz sold volumes in Q4. I was wondering, with this very strong level of 108,000 tons in Q4, I was wondering if there is any negative delta in Q4 for the steel dust that we should have into account, as you have not offered this time the charges in the Q4, the isolated picture for Q4. I was wondering if there were additional costs for the refinery that were booked in Q4 or any other thing that compensated a little bit the super strong sales of Waelz in Q4. That will be my first question. And the second one, I'm sorry if you have already answered this because I had problems with my connection, is that if you can be more specific with the lingo you are using for the initial 25 target, if this double-digit strong growth, we should think something like high teens% maybe in EBITDA or what do you have in mind with this target? Thank you. Thank you, Jorge. Well, in terms of volumes, I think I said I anticipated something in some previous questions as well, but Q4 has come very, very strong. We cannot say about some periods in our activities because depending on the deliveries and depending on the maintenance stoppage of the plants. Normally, the Q4 used to be a strong four if you get the series of four years. But this is mainly because there are less maintenance stoppage because we want to be out of the peak season of Christmas, December, so difficult months, and we try to do the maintenance previous periods. Which is true is that I would like to multiply the Q4 by four, but it's not the case. That's why the good reference is to have the four quarters and to see in the Q in the 2025 something similar depending on the quarters. As I say, we are having a strong maintenance in Spain in January in 2025. So it will depend on when we stop the plants. But the strong operation in the Q4 was or has been not for any specific reason or special reason. It's just because there was no stoppage for maintenance, and the other geographies like Asia and even China, they were running at a very good level because we have availability of dust. Regarding the 2025 evolution, you say, well, I think that we can say, I mean, what we have in mind, obviously, is that strong double-digit starting for an EBITDA level of an increase of 10%-20%. If you get the average 15%, probably it's a good reference. It's still early for us to say where, but we'll be comfortable in that range. We say strong, but it's difficult for us to say that because one of the topics that used to affect a lot to us with the treatment charges nowadays being settled or being at least anticipated now in meetings that are happening in the U.S. for the miners and smelters. So yeah, I don't know. In this level, we feel comfortable today. It's true that we don't see any risk that to be below that. More on the contrary, probably if you get the midpoint reference, it's a good reference to start to work before we provide the guidance range in the Q1 results conference. Thank you, Asier. Let me catch up with the first question because maybe I did not ask the right question. So I was referring more if there were also some additional cost in Q4, so there was this extraordinary volume in Q4. But were there also some extraordinary cost in Q4? Just to understand the total margin figure for Q4. No, sorry. I mean, nothing extraordinary. The margin depends on the combination of the geographies that you know are different margins where it's coming from the operations, right? So it will depend on that. I have the numbers on my mind, but nothing extraordinary, really. Okay. Do you have already a roadmap for maintenance works in 2025? Is it as usual in Q3, or you are thinking to make a different maintenance schedule this time? Well, it depends on the yearly basis because depending on campaigns, and obviously, we take advantage when we have stoppages for not having a lot of dust in some plants. But well, I will say that probably the weakest quarter in 2025 is the Q1 because we are going to have a couple of big stoppages in Europe, particularly. And you know that European operations is the better margins contributors. So obviously, the Q1 probably is the weaker, and the remaining three quarters we'll see. But I think that once again, probably the fourth one could be very high. But well, I think the idea is this. Q1 a little bit weaker, but the rest in a good path. Okay. Thank you for the call. I will go back to the line. Bye. Thank you Jorge. The next and last question for today's call is from Beltrán Palazuelo from DLTV Europe. Please go ahead. Hello. Good morning, Asier, Rafa. Always a pleasure to be able to participate on the call. And congratulations for the strong results. I have a little question regarding capital allocation. If you could give us more color on the dividend, and especially seeing that the balance sheet is strong and getting even stronger, and seeing that in, I think it was 2021, you said sales to do the operation in the United States. Is it in the plans at some point if the market does not reflect the strong and growing EBITDA levels of Befesa to implement a little buyback to show that you can also issue shares at 50-something, but also can buy them at 20-something? That I suppose it's quite attractive to shareholders. Is that in the cards, seeing that the balance sheet is getting stronger and stronger? Thank you very much, Asier and Rafa. Thank you, Beltrán. It's something that we want to stick to our dividend policy, which is 40%-50% of the net income to pay a dividend of 40%-50% of the net income. We have been consistent with that since the IPO in November 2017. We have explored in the past alternatives and opportunities to do share buybacks. We have always come to the conclusion that the best thing for the company and for our shareholders was to stick to the 40%-50% dividend. So in terms of capital allocation, it's about reducing the maintenance CapEx, focusing the growth CapEx in the projects that Asier has been explaining, and then deleveraging the balance sheet and keep our dividend policy. That's what I can tell you so far, Beltrán. Okay. Thank you. Thank you Thank you very much for the clarity. All the support. Thank you. Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, that was the last question. I would like now therefore to turn the conference back over to Rafael Pérez, CFO, for any closing remarks. Please go ahead. Thank you all for your questions. You can also contact the Investor Relations Team of Befesa for any further clarification. We will now conclude the conference call and the Q&A session. Let me remind you that you can find the webcast and the dial-in details to access the recording of this conference call in our website, www.befesa.com. Thank you very much to all of you, and have a good day. Ladies and gentlemen, the conference is now over. Thank you for choosing Chorus Call, and thank you for participating in the conference. You may now disconnect your lines. Goodbye.