Ladies, and gentlemen, good day and welcome to the earnings update conference call for Exide Industries Limited, hosted by Investec Capital Services India Private Limited. As a reminder, all the participant lines will be in the listen-only mode, and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during the conference call, please signal an operator by pressing star, then zero on your touch-tone phone. Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Aditya Jhawar from Investec Capital Services India Private Limited. Thank you, and over to you, sir. Yeah, thank you. Good afternoon to you all. From Exide Industries Limited, we have with us MD and CEO Mr. Avik Roy, Director of Finance and CFO Mr. Manoj Kumar Agarwal, President and Company Secretary Mr. Jitendra Kumar. Before we proceed, here is a disclaimer for the call. Few statements by company's management in the call will be forward-looking in nature, and we request you to refer to the disclaimer and earnings presentation for further details. We will start the call with a brief opening remark from the management, followed by Q&A session. I would now like to hand over the call to Mr. Avik Roy for opening remarks. Thank you, and over to you, sir. Thank you, Aditya. Good afternoon, ladies, and gentlemen, and a warm welcome to you all for the Exide earnings call. At the outset, let me take this opportunity to welcome Mr. Manoj Kumar Agarwal on board as the new Director of Finance and CFO of Exide Industries Limited. He takes over from Mr. Asish Mukherjee, who, after a long stint of 18 years, has retired from the position of Director of Finance and CFO. Manoj had been with us for the last two years. He joined this company as a Deputy CFO, and through routine succession planning, now he's on board as the Director of Finance. So I welcome Manoj on board. I will take you through the key highlights of our performance for the last quarter and the fiscal year 2025. During the fourth quarter, nearly 75% of our business, nearly three-fourths of our business, has registered double-digit growth, even on a high base. Within these, mobility after market, solar, and IUPS businesses continue to contribute to strong growth. The remaining 25% of the business witnessed a decline in revenues, impacted by a weaker demand scenario in businesses like auto OEMs, telecom, and home inverters. This led to an overall modest 4% sales growth during the quarter, though on a high base. However, if you notice that on a quarter-on-quarter, on a sequential quarter basis, we have grown 8% in quarter four. Also, in quarter four, I'm happy to inform you that we exported the first batch of our advanced AGM batteries for SLI applications for the exports market. Operating profitability was impacted due to high input costs in the quarter, on account of a considerable increase in the cost of antimony, which is one of our major alloying elements in lead-acid battery chemistry. On top of that, we had some write-off of certain slow and non-moving operating assets. Prices of antimony have massively surged in the last six months, thereby impacting profitability margins both on year-on-year and quarter-on-quarter basis, particularly. However, even though in absolute terms has increased by 4% on a sequential basis, even cash flow from operations at a pre-working capital increase level has sustained at the last year's level. Before I move to the annual performance, let me talk briefly about the economy and the industry dynamics. While the GDP growth of India subsided from 8.2% in FY 2024 to an estimated value of 6.4% in FY 2025, the manufacturing growth has further slipped from 8% in FY 2024 to almost an estimated 3.4% this year. This signals a slowdown in manufacturing activity. Domestic auto replacement demand was robust throughout the year, while the OEM demand from automotive was muted, especially in the passenger vehicle segment. In reserve power, both industrial UPS and solar trade markets witnessed steady growth in demand, but the home inverter market remains soft, with its demand expected to pick up in Q1 of FY 2026, which is the current quarter. Government spending and capital outlay have decelerated in key sectors like railways, power, and infrastructure over the last couple of quarters. Automotive batteries continue to perform well in exports, but demand for industrial batteries, which has been a major stay for us in the European market, has been impacted by the ongoing slowdown and recession across new markets, and this is a pre-tariff era. This is the last fiscal year I am referring to. With this context, the annual performance mirrored that of the fourth quarter, with around 70% of our business performing strongly, while the rest experienced some demand headwinds. Even the margins were marginally impacted due to higher raw material prices, as I mentioned, and lower-than-expected growth in a few business verticals. However, I would like to highlight that despite the tough macro environment, our performance has shown signs of resilience. Our balance sheet still remains very strong, with zero debt and high cash flow generation. As we enter FY 2026, the outlook for the lead-acid business remains positive across most business verticals. I believe that Exide, with its advanced product portfolio and Pan-India distribution network and a strong brand recall, will continue to benefit from the growth opportunities. During the year, we have strengthened our business and the go-to-market strategy by transforming from an SDU-led organization to a functional organization. We have also strengthened our senior leadership team by bringing in seasoned business leaders from global corporations. Apart from this, on the operational front, we have undertaken multiple initiatives on cost excellence and upgrade of manufacturing technology. For example, we moved a substantial part of our two-wheeler manufacturing capacity to punch-grade technology in Q4 itself. All such initiatives have started delivering results, and we will continue going into the next year. Moving on to the lithium-ion cell manufacturing project, we have invested nearly INR 1,000 crore in FY 2025, and additional INR 300 crore equity has already gone in the month of April to EESL, our 100% subsidiary. With this, the total equity investment in Exide to date is INR 3,602 crore. Construction works are progressing well, and the project is expected to start commercial production in the current year. We have a range of commitments secured, ranging from MOUs to PACs in production to co-investments in line with leading E2-wheeler, E3-wheeler, and E4-wheeler OEMs. With this, I close my opening remarks. We will now be happy to take your questions. Over to you, Aditya. Thank you, sir. We will now begin with the question-and-answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on their touchstone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and two. Participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. Ladies, and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. The first question comes from the line of Pramod Amde from Incred Equities. Please go ahead. Yeah, thanks for taking the question. So the first question is, you had called out home inverter, there has been a weakness. Do you think this is more short-term, or any structural changes you feel are a challenge? Thank you, Pramod. Let me give you the context. One is internal, and the other one is external market-driven. In the first while, our home inverter business was sitting under our SBU automotive. It was mainly a part of the automotive SBU, though it is a non-automotive business. It was a major portion. Our only go-to-market was with the automotive network. Now we have separated reserve power and mobility with the new organization system. Now mobility is going to build its—sorry, reserve power home inverter is going to build its own network. That work has started from Q2 once the organization changed. They have been getting success because we are now expanding independently in their own network and not relying solely on the automotive network like in the past. This is a go-to-market shift for which we have readjusted the organization. Therefore, both the mobility as well as the home inverter, both these business verticals will benefit because now they will ride on their own strength and not rely on each other's network. That was a very conscious decision which we took. On the market side, on the demand side, yes, we had some early onset of monsoons. The peak season we missed out. However, if I look at my last two weeks, last two months' performance, I see that it is coming back, which gives us a hope that Q1, which is the peak season right now, is going to be a strong season for inverters. This year, inverter growth is a key element of our growth agenda. I can tell you some of the actions which we have taken, new actions we have taken in the last quarter or so. Now we are entering new white spaces, which we had never had to do in the past. For example, we are entering the white goods space now with our complete inverter systems as well as inverter batteries. We are launching RP Home. If some of you have noticed, we have launched this RP Home series targeting the home UPS systems through this new channel. These are the few go-to-market initiatives with which we are confident that we'll get back to the position that we had in the growth path. By the way, we are still the leading manufacturer of, a leading number one in inverter batteries in India, despite the decline. Sure. Thanks for the detailed answer. The second one is with regard to EV cell manufacturing. Considering that you might be approaching the OEMs or other parties for the same, what type of cell formats you are getting better traction with, and how are you planning capacity distribution for these cell formats as you build capacity? That is one. Second, any development on Hyundai MOU which you have signed? Let me take the first one. We are probably the only one that when we started this project, we tried to mitigate the risk through multiple chemistry and multiple format methods. We have two lines of cylindrical and two lines of prismatic. All these are, which means two lines of NMC and two lines of LFP as well. We see traction on both sides from different end markets. We have been in advanced discussion with two of the leading OEMs for two-wheelers on the cylindrical side. Similarly, on the three-wheeler side, we are talking to some people on the LFP side at a very advanced stage. Also, LFP prismatic is helping us to address the stationary market. I think we are in a reasonably safe position because the entire project is going on parallelly. Maybe the production will start one month in advance of the other or two months in advance of the other, but still the investment has been made in all the four lines together. That is why we are not too worried about finally where the volume of tech will shift because we will be able to cater to all use cases. The last question was on Hyundai. I think whatever you see in the public domain, whatever we have announced regarding the binding agreement, that still stands. As I said, it is in active stage where we are putting up all the resources to get ready. The product development has started and will soon come out with additional information in public domain. Sure. Thanks and all the best. Thanks a lot, Pramod. Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Vaibhav Soothi from JPMorgan Chase. Please go ahead. Yes, thanks for taking my questions. Best wishes to Mr. Manoj for the new role. My first question is on the lithium-ion business. Could you just elaborate the range of commitments that you mentioned with respect to the customers and if there are any delays on the plant side? Because initially, we had anticipated completion by the end of FY 2025, and I think the project cost for the first phase is almost INR 5,000 crore, but the investment right now is around INR 3,600 crore. Yeah, I mean, just sense on the range of commitments and when do you expect the SOP would be great. Okay. So there are three questions, Vaibhav. One is on the commitments with the client, the other one is timelines, and the third one is a detail on investment, right? Let me start with the timelines first. As I said, if you recall in the last analyst call, we already said that we will be ready with commercial production within this year, which means FY 2026. Earlier, of course, we planned for FY 2025 or we announced FY 2025, but then there were serious problems on visa issues and things like that, geopolitical issues, which we overcame very quickly. We are lucky to have overcome that. Now we have more than 100, I mean, 130-150 Chinese engineers in the shop floor commissioning all the equipment, including people from our technology partners. That is why we said we will start the production or the trial production within this calendar year. Then we will need some time for homologation with the OEMs. You know how the process works because your design validation is done by the OEMs on the prototypes, which has been done already. Now, once you start your serial production, from that production line, they will pick up volumes and put it in their vehicles and run homologation process for about four to five months. Then the real volume, the commercial serial production starts. This is a standard process which we are following for lithium also. This we followed for lead-acid in the past also. Therefore, even if I start the trial production of the commercial line, start of production happens in month zero, likely in month four or five, the serial production will start because that time we will require for homologation. That is how we have decided on the timelines, more or less. Also, all four lines will not be commissioned together, one after another. We'll start with the cylindrical NMC line, which is meant for two-wheelers, for which we have been in advanced discussion with many of the clients. That will be our first priority, and then take it one by one. The next one will be one line of LFP prismatic targeting three-wheelers and four-wheelers. This is how we are planning. Regarding the commitments, as I said, I mean, all I can tell you is that it's in multiple stages. For some, we have already started PAC manufacturing, but we will convert to our own cell manufacturing. Now the PAC manufacturing is happening through outsourced cells. The moment we are ready with our own cells, we'll shift to our own cell and manufacture the PAC. With some, we are at MOU stages. There are co-development and design validations and things like that are happening. With some, we have a binding agreement, as we have already mentioned, which you know is in public domain. There are three types of engagements we are having with customers right now. Good to see that at least the largest two-wheeler OEMs, three-wheeler OEMs, and some of the four-wheeler OEMs are engaging with us because they see a value in sourcing local cells. Does that answer your question? Yeah, yeah. That's very interesting. Just a follow-up. Can you tell us the number of customers, like five, 10, 15 that you're engaging with? I mean, given that cell prices in China now, at least LFP is around $55 per kWh just the fact that you mentioned that we still see value in cell manufacturing in India, like in the cost side, yeah. Vaibhav, please excuse me. I may not be able to tell you the number of customers because the major EV OEMs are so few, it is easy for you to crank the names, which I will not be there for them. All I can tell you, see, today, the government is incentivizing cell imports and disincentivizing PAC and module imports, right? Which means government is incentivizing that import cell from China and makes the PACs and modules in the country. That is not going to be the future. There has to be once the domestic manufacturing capacity of cells is in place, government has to switch the priority on incentivizing local cell manufacturing. Otherwise, this industry will never grow in India. In the current structure, do you feel that the industry will grow that if you incentivize, you put only 5% import duty on cells and only make the module and PAC, then India will miss the bus for capability building in cell manufacturing forever? It's not only us, it's for everybody. At this moment, since the demand is more than the supply of cells, and since we will be the first one to start in a gigascale, I think till that time, this environment will stay where cell import gets incentivized and PAC import gets disincentivized. Once we have a domestic capacity of cell manufacturing and particularly high-quality gigascale, I'm sure even the government will switch the priorities, and that is what I get to hear from various forums. Then the discussion will be a different discussion. It will be more of how you can deliver large-scale, large-volume sales to the OEMs at market prices. That is my short answer. Okay. Very helpful. And just last question, if I may squeeze in. On the lead-acid side, you mentioned that antimony prices have risen sharply. Can you just tell the contribution in the raw material basket? Because lead, plastics, and sulfur is the major contribution. I mean, how would the rise in antimony prices really impact margin going forward? Thank you. Two questions. One is, what is the impact of antimony currently, and what will be the impact in the future? So Vaibhav, in Q4, we had a negative impact of about INR 50 crore in absolute value purely due to antimony. And this is net of the price increases which we have announced to the market. The problem was this antimony was rising so sharply from $11,000, it went up to $16,000 per ton in the same quarter. By the time we announced our price increases, it has further gone up. By the time we announced our second increase, it has further gone up. Therefore, we could not recover everything. Net net, we have INR 50 crore of downside impact on antimony itself in Q4. Going forward, and we have seen that in the initial comments, I have said that there are two elements. One is antimony, and the other is also some write-offs of some non-moving operational assets. If I do the math and if I add this back, we were at a very good EBITDA margin level even in Q4. We were actually close to 13%. Now, how do we mitigate that? First of all, these one-time write-offs will not come back. Secondly, antimony, we have taken a price increase from mid-February; we took a 1.5%. On March 1, we take another similar amount. From April 1, again, we have announced. We are passing on the increase to the market regularly. In April, antimony prices have somewhat stabilized. We will get a value of this increase. It is always lagging because it is continuously increased. I am sure you know the reason for this. This is a geopolitical reason. These had started much before the tariff war. This is just because China decided to ban exports of antimony because of national security issues. Therefore, the prices started shooting up. China produces about 40% of global antimony production. One of the largest applications of antimony is also in the military, which is bullets. There are a lot of geopolitical and military considerations that China has decided not to export antimony. We are the collateral—what should I say? We got damaged, the battery industry. However, as of now, we have to only pass on the pricing cost increases to the market. Some of our customers, even with whom we have indexed on lead, appreciate that this non-lead increase is also a reality. They also track the international market. We have been able to convince a lot of them for price increase, including institutional customers. That is the answer on the antimony current and future. Okay. Thank you so much. Thank you, Vaibhav. Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Aditya Jhawar from Investec Capital. Please go ahead. Yeah, thank you. Continuing with this question of antimony, what is the extent of price increase left to pass on the incremental increase? Aditya, thank you. It depends on at what level you are tagging the antimony price. If I look at the current price levels of $60,000, $60,000- $62,000 average, I think we are more or less covered. Okay. Okay. With the increase of from 1 April, which we have announced, we are more or less covered. Going forward, we do not know to what extent it will move again. That is the answer to your question. Sure. Second question is, what is the—can you quantify the write-off that you have taken in this quarter? Yeah, it's about INR 25 crore. INR 25 crores. Good. Sir, on continuing with the margin question, now we are doing a lot of cost-saving initiatives, and there is a tech upgrade, there is content costing, as well as punch grid. If you can help us understand that, how should we think about our margin trajectory over the next couple of years? Because when we benchmark ourselves with Amara Raja, our competitor, profitability is much lower. If you can throw some light, whether on tech upgrade, cost saving, warranty cost, what are the drivers of margin expansion? How should we see it play out in the next two years? Yeah. Thanks, Aditya. First of all, as I just now mentioned, even in quarter four, if you add back these negative effects which I said, we are already close to 13%. We have done that math ourselves. This mainly came because we switched over to punch grid for motorcycles, for two-wheelers, in the month of January. That has given us three major benefits. One is on the material cost. Secondly, with the level of automation these punch grid lines have, we have a lot of impact on the manpower cost on the ground. Third, which I personally feel is the most significant impact, is the improvement and consistency in quality. This is majorly going to impact our—has started benefiting our internal rejections, our warranties, and that we are monitoring. I think this is the most significant long-term impact. Now, we invested for only 50% of the capacity last year. Having seen the benefit coming in, once half of the capacity shifted to punch grid, we immediately made a capital investment for the remaining portion, which will come on live around, let's say, November of this month, with the machines coming in and commissioning and everything. From November onwards, even the balance 50% will also go into punch grid. Whatever benefit we are getting on 50% of the volumes, we'll get on 100% of the volumes. Motorcycle is one of our key growth drivers and margin drivers going forward. This is on the punch grid. We have similarly invested in continuous casting process, which I think we are the first one in the country. We have done it through collaboration with our partners in the USA, East Penn. This has also given us huge impact, a positive impact on quality as well as benefit on the cost. That machine has also started running from March. This was one line we converted first. With the success of that, we have also decided to invest on the subsequent lines, another two lines we have invested or decided to invest, which will also come maybe end of this calendar year. These are the actions we are taking on the cost margin improvement agenda. This takes time. For two years, we have been only about maybe one and a half years, we have been running pilots on these machines because we wanted to invest in one line, run pilot, polish our hands, and then horizontally deploy. That is why this was taking time. The results of the pilot trials have been extremely positive, and we are very happy that we'll be able to drive. This is one of the examples of our margin improvement agenda. There was one more question which I am missing out, Aditya. Can you repeat? No, I think the warranty cost, I think you covered it. Warranty, I covered. Yes, warranty, I covered. Yeah, yeah. Sir, tell us. We are trying to address this problem through manufacturing technology because most of the warranty issues which we faced were from manufacturing inconsistencies at large scale, which we are trying to move to automation, like I mentioned just now. Yeah. Yeah. My second question is on the lithium-ion business. Now, looking at the decline in the prices of LFP, NMC globally, what is your assessment in terms of what could be the profitability and ROC of the project now? Also, now you're engaging with customers, you are getting a sense that who is looking for a cell, who is looking for a battery pack. If you can give a ballpark range, what could be a margin, EBITDA margin expectation and ROC, maybe at about 50% utilization, what should we expect? At 100%, what should be that number? Aditya, at this stage, I think it's a bit too early to comment on EBITDA margin. Our focus is to get into customer contracts, complete the homologation process, and scale up the production. Once we reach about 80% utilization, which means in phase I, about four GW h-five GW h of utilization, that is the time when we will start getting a view on the returns. Because it's quite possible that once we reach 80% of utilization, we might observe that, no, we need to put up some more capacity immediately to get faster than given. You see what I mean? At this moment, we have said that we'll not go for more than six GW h, plus the Hyundai contract will kick in. Once these are all in line, let us reach about 80% of utilization, ramp up as fast as possible in one to two years' time. Then we will see on our returns. Simple reason. Unlike lead-acid, and this is a global standard, you will know, for the first couple of years, a typical cell manufacturing plant has a huge amount of internal rejections as well as yield losses. You may have heard from other players in China or any other places. The first two years, we have to improve our manufacturing process maturity, which means reduction of our internal scraps and improving on our yield. Once we do that, our manufacturing cost, manufacturing efficiency will reach a level which today we cannot imagine. Today, while calculating our returns, we are factoring all these kinds of wastages: double-digit scrap, the high single-digit yield loss. We will only see this after one or two years when the manufacturing process matures. This is not only for us. Every manufacturer has to go through this learning curve. Once that one or two-year cycle is over and we reach maybe 80% utilization level, we will be in a much better position to recalculate our returns and the timeline of that. Sure, sir. That's very helpful. That's it from my side. Thank you. Thank you, Aditya. Thank you. A reminder to all participants, please press star and one to ask a question. The next question comes from the line of Kapil from Nomura Wealth. Please go ahead. Yeah. Can you hear me? Yes, Kapil. Good. Yeah. Good afternoon. Thanks for taking my question. Sir, on the growth side, if you could give some thoughts, last year was a little bit tepid on growth. We had roughly about 4% growth. For the lead-acid business, if you could just share some thoughts on why the growth was low and what are the initiatives you are taking and what kind of growth to expect for next year? Yeah. So is your question focused on quarter four or full year, Kapil? Sir, full year. Full year. Full year. I have mentioned, like you have heard in the previous calls or the previous releases also, if I break down our growth, overall growth into our segments, let me give you a color. Four-wheeler aftermarket. Four-wheeler aftermarket contributes to about 25%-30% of our sales. That has grown by double-digit full year. Solar. Solar business has grown substantially every quarter to almost 25%-27% growth. This has been a very strong year for solar. They are planning to build a INR 1,000-1,200 crore kind of a franchise out of solar business alone for the next year. Two-wheeler aftermarket. Two-wheeler aftermarket, in the first couple of quarters, we did very badly because we were almost starving the market because of shortage of supplies. Why? Because we were moving over from these conventional cast plates to punch grid plates. There were a lot of transition happening in the factories. Therefore, we were almost starving the trade market because we could not stop supplies to our OEM commitment. The trade market was suffering. The first two quarters for motorcycle batteries, two-wheeler batteries, has been very big. Overall, we have grown by just touch double-digit for motorcycle. If you look at quarter on quarter, I can give you first quarter, we were 2%. Second quarter, we were plus 6%. Third quarter, we were plus 10%. Last quarter, we grew by 18%. As the supply improved quarter on quarter after this punch grid was commissioned, if you see the motorcycle growth rate has now gone from 2% in Q1 to 18% in Q4. Therefore, we have taken a very aggressive plan for next year also on motorcycle growth now that the lines are operating. This is how it is. Our auto exports also jumped because there were many white spaces. We hardly have any market share. It also grew by close to 25-30% full year. If you look at complete mobility, complete mobility full year, they contribute to about, let's say, one-third of our business, 35% of our business. It has almost grown by 15%, both put together, four-wheeler and two-wheeler. On the infra, we had a drag, mainly because of telecom itself, we lost. The telecom was almost minus 25-30% because of very high base in the previous year because the 5G rollout happened in fiscal year 2024 when there was a boom of towers. That 5G boom went off in December 2023. From then on, the telecom demand came down, both from the demand side as well as shift to HMI and solutions. Telecom dragged down the business big time. The other good thing was that the IUPS business, which is basically the VRLA business of IUPS, which goes into industrial UPS for critical power backup, also grew by double-digit. This also gives us hope because we have a very high-quality product for this market. We have invested in our factory, and we have come out with new products addressing specific use cases like data centers, like hospitals for critical power applications. We are very hopeful that those new products which we launched are yielding results. What dragged down, I mean, a major contributor is, as I mentioned, inverter batteries. For inverter batteries, we have fixed up a complete strategy of building new network architecture and also coming out with the RP Home series of champions which you are seeing all over. We want to gain back our entire market, Pan India. We are strong in some pockets. We are not so strong in some pockets. Whenever we are weak, we are trying to come back. This is broadly how it was. European exports declined because, as I mentioned, Europe was just between bad to worse in the last fiscal year. The decision has been taken in, particularly our main markets, Germany, U.K., and Italy, where we saw this downturn of our traction battery sales. Hopefully, right now with this new trade economics going on and with the new exchange rate being in our favor, we might see a peak in the next upcoming year. All in all, as I said, about 70% of our business grew more than 10%, and about 30% of our business grew by, let's say, minus 9%. That brought down the overall growth to the number which you know. Kapil, does that give you a full picture? Yes, sir. Very detailed answer. Thank you so much. The drag that we are seeing in the telecom business, is that in the base, or do you see further declines from where we are? What I hear from the customers is that I think it has bottomed out last year. Even if it does not have a growth potential in lead-acid, it should have a growth potential on the lithium side. But lead-acid portion, I think it has bottomed out because there are still some geographies where lithium does not have a business case. Lead-acid has because there are areas which they call green sites, for example, which means the power cuts are not so heavy that they need a diesel generator site as a backup. If they can do away with the diesel site, then lithium has a business case. There are some sites where the power cuts are so heavy till now that they have to have a diesel backup. Therefore, there lithium comes in. It's a mixed bag. I think most of the lithium solutions are going towards the green sites right now. They have a good business case without the diesel generator. I would like to believe that the lead-acid volume has bottomed out this fiscal year. Great. One question I had on the. Not a plan for growth in telecom. Okay. Okay. Sure. So one question I had on the lithium-ion business. What would be, in your assessment, the right level of duty that you would, that should be there on this segment, the lithium-ion cells, the import duty I'm talking about? Kapil, I will not like to be an advisory to the government. I think there are the associations where we are also part of, and we are working together, and we'll soon approach once the capacities are ready. I think this is too early, to be fair to the government also. Today, suddenly they put a duty on cell. Many of these businesses, back businesses and model businesses will suffer because where will they get the volumes from? Once people like us, we are up and running with a certain scale. Suppose even if we come out with about 10 GW h or 12 GW h of production capacity, annual product, then it makes sense to approach the government. Now it is cell manufacturing is almost zero, nearly zero in megawatt level. I think we still have a dependence. The industry has a dependence on import of cells. With the new geopolitics and the new regime that you see around, there has to be a local capability development on cell manufacturing in India, not only for the Indian market, but also possibly exports out of India to the Western world. That is the time when we should actually bring this to the notice of the government. We are actively discussing this in the associations where we are part of. Sure, sir. Sir, if you have done any assessment on scenario analysis or break-even levels, what would be the range of utilization at which the business would be break-even for the lithium-ion cell? Let me give you a little bigger context. Let me start from the demand side, right? We still predict that about 120 GWh-130 GW h will be the market size by 2030. Then we do a kind of a linear graph with six GW h capacity in phase I. We do not see this to be much of a challenge to use our capacity. The question is when, because this will not be a linear growth. This will be possibly back-ended growth, most probably. There are certain applications and use cases which are coming up, which were not originally in people's minds. Advanced cell chemistry production started particularly with electric vehicles in mind. Now you suddenly see that the stationary storage demand has boomed, which is incremental in nature. This demand will be mostly back-end loaded because there are long gestation periods of the projects. Quick information for you. I think a couple of months back, the Ministry of Power has announced, mandated the solar developers that if you have to reach 500 GWh by 2030, as government has planned, now for all grid-connected solar, you should have a minimum 10% storage backup for 2-hour capacity, which means today we have 500 GW is the aspiration. Today, we are at, let's say, 100 or 80 GW. So balance 400 GW, 10% of that for two hours, which means 14-80 GWh of storage capacity alone is an incremental market. Just compare that with a six GW h capacity that we have put up. In terms of demand, I do not see an issue if I do this math. The only thing is that will it be linear? Will it be back-ended? Will it be upfront? That is the question. Therefore, we have multiple use cases and multiple chemistry that some will move faster than the other. Two-wheelers move faster, we feel. Three-wheelers will move faster, we feel. BESS will move fast, we feel. This is how we see the market going. Now, our readiness. I think once we, as I mentioned to Aditya's question before, once we reach 80% of the utilization, which is around four GW -five GW, we should see how our manufacturing cost performs, and we should see how the lithium price pan up. That time, we should do the real math because operationally, we will be also more efficient. As I mentioned, from initial hassles of battery scraps and yield losses, we will also come out of that. We will see what the lithium prices look like. That is the time when we will be very confident that at what level we'll be breaking even. If required, we'll decide on further capacity put up at that stage. Right now, I will not like to comment on a break-even timeline or a percentage utilization. Our target is to ramp up slowly over the couple of years to minimum 80% utilization and a running factory. Thanks, sir. Sir, how are you doing your price? Sorry to interrupt a Kapil. I would request you to rejoin the queue if you have any further questions so that management can answer as many participants as possible. Thank you. Participants, please restrict yourselves to two questions so that the management can address as many participants as possible. If you have any further questions, you may rejoin the queue. The next question comes from the line of Mohit Jain from Tara Capital Partners. Please go ahead. Yeah. Can you hear me? Hello? Yes, please. Can you hear me? Yes, Mohit. We can hear you. Yeah. My question is, I'm assuming right now, all the expenses relating to your lithium-ion plants are getting capitalized. By when do they start, let's say, flowing into the P&L segment? What kind of an impact would it have in the interim period if this becomes fully utilized? See, right now, these are all capital work in progress. The project is ongoing. So. Yeah. So by when do they start sort of getting completed and start going in the? As I said, we will take a call because we will be commissioning it stage by stage, not all together, because not all will be ready on the same day. Also, on priorities, like we said, one line, another line, another line will do stage by stage. Then we will capitalize progressively. Okay. You mentioned that in the initial phases, obviously, the losses here are higher, higher injection rates, etc. Can you help us understand just so that we are clear whenever it hits the P&L, what sort of an impact overall can we expect so that we are not caught on the wrong foot? The global standard, I can tell you, because we cannot talk about ourselves because we have not started producing, right? If you look at international benchmarks of cell manufacturing, it is normally between 10-12% rejections happen in the first startup phase. That is what we have been told. My question was in terms of, let's say, impact on our margin because of all of this, what is the kind of impact that we can expect once it starts going into the P&L from the lithium-ion side on the overall margin reported by the company? Mohit, as I mentioned in the previous question, at this moment, we will not like to make a comment on margins and ROCs of lithium-ion business because this is largely unknown. All I can tell you is that we will be the first one to run or start a gigafactory of cells in India. I have not heard anybody who has announced that in the next 12 months' time, they will come out with production of cells. Industry has not grown. We will be the first one. We are saying that within this calendar year, we'll start trial production of this and that. I have not heard anybody saying that in the next 12 months, they'll start production of any manufacturing of cells. At this stage, I will really refrain, even if I have my own calculations, but I would refrain from sharing that with you because industry has not picked up. Right now, all data you have is from Chinese manufacturers. Once the Indian manufacturing starts, then you have a much better view. As I said, our priorities are on a different line altogether, more on customer engagement, more on manufacturing efficiency, more on development of product, technology partnership with as well, so on and so forth. Got it. Okay. Thank you. Thanks a lot for answering my question. Thank you. Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Sonal Gupta from HSBC Mutual Funds. Please go ahead. Yeah. Hi. Good afternoon, and thanks for taking my question. Just on the go-to-market strategy for the home inverters, the batteries that you mentioned. I just want to understand, right, you have a very extensive network of auto batteries. Now you want to separately build a network for the home inverter. Does that mean that there is actually a loss in sales? I mean, it will take time to build such a network, right, to replicate something like the depth of your auto network on the dealer side. Is there a risk here, I mean, in trying to build another separate channel? I think probably I should have clarified a little bit more, Sonal. I did not mean that we exit from that channel completely. I said there are complementary channels which we never explored in the past because this business was under the automotive segment. Therefore, some of the white spaces or some of the channels we left out. For example, the e-commerce channel, which we have never participated. You see my competitors, they have substantial presence in the e-commerce market for both electronic inverter systems and inverter batteries. The white goods channel where they sell consumer durables, we were not present in the past. We were still number one in India without even being present in these segments because we were fully going through the automotive network. What I mentioned is that now that the business is segregated, we have options to add these white spaces to our existing network. Whatever I am telling you, whatever growth plans we have taken for next year is incremental in nature. You will see many of our, if you do channel checks, Exide being a number one inverter brand, they did not have any participation in e-commerce or in consumer durable outlets. These are the things which I mentioned that these are completely, and these channels require a completely different set of market strategy, sales strategy. It is not the same as you would sell in your conventional network of automotive channel. Those things have been all streamlined, and we have a lot of, that's why how we came out with a new value proposition for RP Home segment, as we call it, Zindagi Nonstop as the tagline. We are targeting the home users more than our automobile users. That is how. That is not that we are exiting the existing channel. It's just complementing the other places where we were not there. Got it. Got it. Thanks for the explanation. I mean, we would be selling under this tubular batteries as well, right? It's not just flat plate. No, no. This is tubular only. Okay. We will not have a strategy on flat plate inverters anymore. Got it. Got it. Because when it was part of the auto, it was large. I think a big chunk was flat plate. Yes. Yes. This was margin value things, and we had issues with that. That is why we continued and shifted completely to tubular. Got it. And just on the lithium-ion side, could you tell us what sort of, I mean, in gigawatt hours, you have 1.5 GW of capacity. I mean, where would you be in terms of your quarterly level of supplies? I mean, maybe in Q4, and what level of supplies are we doing? See, first of all, the plant we have for PAC manufacturing, 1.5 GWh is not good enough to even evacuate our own cell capacity. Now, the business is like this. The two-wheeler and three-wheeler will be a PAC business. The stationary telecom and the BESS will be PAC business. The four-wheeler passenger vehicle, four-wheeler will be largely a cell business. At least my six GW minus the cell business, that capacity should be balanced with my PAC manufacturing capacity, which is not there today. We are also increasing our PAC manufacturing capacity parallelly to align it with the cell capacity so that we can serve the PAC customers adequately. What we have been doing now is basically the thing which is not very sustainable, that is importing cells and making PAC for our customers. That is quite risky because this has volatility of pricing, volatility of quality. There is a huge amount of warranty risk we will be sitting on because it will not be back-to-back so much high-end supply. We are just holding us up before we commit big time to big time customers because there is too much of risk versus the reward. Having said that, we are still making packs for some well-known, I would say, two-wheeler and three-wheeler manufacturers. I think one of the top two OEMs. We have started doing that. We are supplying packs for telecom applications. We have brought out solutions for the e-rickshaw business, the three-wheeler electric Toto. This is a business where we want to serve through lithium solutions. These are the additional portfolios we are bringing up on the pack side. So far, in Q4, the uptick is good because we see a lot of interest in the customers. In the past, you will know there was a huge shake-up of the two-wheeler industry post the FAME subsidy withdrawal. We were sitting on large orders from not so well-known, smaller or mid-sized e-two-wheeler manufacturers. They have all gone bankrupt, mostly either bankrupt or, in many cases, there is a risk of payment. We are holding to that because they were largely dependent on FAME subsidy. While on FAME subsidy, let me also mention a little unrelated but very relevant. While the FAME subsidy has been withdrawn, which was largely on the vehicle, a similar amount has been now declared, as you know, on this PME drive, which is mainly focused on investing or subsidizing or incentivizing the public charging infrastructure as well as the fast charging networks. This includes charging infrastructure for two-wheelers, three-wheelers, ambulances, trucks, so on and so forth. I think this is something which was very much required in advance because this creates the ecosystem for EV two-wheeler, three-wheeler, four-wheeler to really ramp up volumes. This was, I think, also INR 11,000-12,000 crore. In these next two years, government wants the public charging infrastructure to improve. If that one happens, I think that's a leading indicator of a very faster adoption of two-wheeler and three-wheeler in the country. We'll be very happy to see that happening as quickly as possible. Yeah. This is just a supplementary comment because I got reminded when I mentioned FAME subsidies. Yeah. Okay. Great. Thanks. That answers the question. Thank you so much. Thank you. Ladies, and gentlemen, that was the last question for today. I would now like to hand the conference over to the management for the closing comments. Yeah. Thank you, ladies, and gentlemen. Thank you. It was a very engaging session with all your questions. I hope we have been able to give you some clarity on the business and the way forward. We are personally extremely excited to enter into FY 2026 with new management, new network, new portfolio. We will be able to ride through and we will try to deliver on the promises. We still hold to our promises which we made to you in the recent past on our numbers. Thank you all for participating. If you have any further questions or would like to know more about the company, we would be happy to be of assistance. Please reach out to us. Thank you and over to Aditya. Thank you, Sir. Ladies, and gentlemen, on behalf of Investec Capital Services India Private Limited, that concludes this conference. You may now disconnect your line.