Electric vehicle business, and Mr. Dhiman Gupta, Vice President, Treasury, Investor Relations and M&A. This will be followed by Q&A. Over to you, Balaji, sir. Firstly, thanks everybody for coming in at short notice. Much appreciated. What we'll try and do today is to quickly run you through the business of EV, why we see potential in this business, and why we are excited about it. Then I'll quickly cover the business rationale as well as the team structure, and then happy to take any questions. Without further ado, Shailesh, can I request you to talk about the business? Thank you, Balaji. Let me take through the first section which is around the EV industry. Let me first take you all through the previous TML EV journey so far. Starting with the EV industry growth. We have seen that in the past few years; the industry has been growing at the rate of 1.5x to 2x every year since FY 2017. This year, we are expecting the industry to grow by 2.5x to 2.7x. What is really driving this steep growth is the favorable government incentives, which is not only the central government FAME II program, but also the state government incentives, which is a top-up to the demand incentives being extended by the central government. The second reason is the launch of more credible, practical and aspirational mainstream EVs like Nexon. The customers talking very positive about their experience, which is really enabling the other customers to start considering electric vehicle. We have been seeing that the ICE vehicle prices have increased since the BS6 implementation, and it continues to increase with every emission norm change and introduction of safety norms. Because of the steep increase in the fuel prices also, and the inherent benefits that electric vehicles have as far as running cost is concerned, it is also kind of creating a pull from a consumer perspective to consider electric vehicles. We request all the participants to please stay connected while we reconnect the management. Participants are requested to please stay connected while we reconnect the management. Thank you. We request all the participants to please stay connected while we reconnect the management. Thank you. Participants are requested to please stay connected while we reconnect the management. We request all the participants to please stay connected. The line for the management is disconnected. Ladies and gentlemen, the line for the management is reconnected. Thank you, and over to you, sir. Okay. I hope you were able to see the earlier slide, but this is the growth that we have seen in the market share. This is slide number Five. Slide number six. If you see the market share growth, we started with 11% market share in FY 2018. We had just one product, which was the Tigor EV meant for the fleet segment, government fleet, and since then we have been launching new products like Nexon EV in the personal segment. Since then, with the success of Nexon EV, the market share has increased to 71%. You are also seeing the steep growth in volumes that we have seen. This actually is limited to the supplies. The real potential is really seen in the right side, which shows the growth potential of EVs. The dark blue line shows the cumulative bookings that we have been receiving, and the gray line is showing what we have been able to retail because of the lack of supplies. There is a very steep increase that we are seeing in the demand, but we are fast trying to ramp up and catch up on the supply side versus the demand. I will talk about going forward, what is really going to drive the EV industry. Two big factors. One is the government incentives. We have seen 11 state governments coming with very progressive EV policies, which as I said, is topping up the demand incentives versus what is already available from the central government incentives. The PLI schemes, which is focused on advanced cell chemistries as well as the PLI for auto is focused on EVs. Both these in combination is going to really drive the adoption of EVs. The other demand drivers that we see is one, the stringent emission norms from 2022 April, we are going to see the introduction of CAFE, which will drive all the OEMs more towards electric vehicles to offset the emissions coming out of the ICE. So that itself will create some push up to. The total cost of ownership is seeing parity with respect to the ICE power trains like petrol and diesel. From next year onwards, you will see the parity even in the personal segment. This basically would be the tipping point in terms of driving the adoption of electric vehicles. Also, you have better customer options as OEMs are introducing long-range EVs. Range anxiety has been one of the key bottlenecks or barriers to adoption of electric vehicles. In the coming years, we are seeing manufacturers like us going for higher end products as compared to the medium range products that we get today. All these factors in combination is going to really provide a very exponential growth in the future. How Tata Motors is planning to lead the charge in this space on the back of this opportunity, as far as product is concerned, we have planned for introducing 10 electric vehicles by FY 2026, in the next 5 years, which would be in different body styles, in different price points, from affordable EVs to EVs with higher range, more sophisticated technologies. On the sales and marketing side, we are also going to increase the micro markets where we are present today. As you saw that today, we are present in 60 cities, but we'll continue to expand every year into more cities. As we are introducing more electric vehicles and different models. Awareness creation has been seen as the key enabler to drive the adoption of electric vehicles. We have been doing that for the last 2 to 3 years, and as we open the new micro markets, we'll keep focusing on awareness creation. We are coming with more options to access the EVs through subscription model, which will allow those customers who are still wary to adopt a new technology, an option to go for a 12-month or a 24-month subscription. Capability building, we are driving deeper localization, strictly following the phased manufacturing plan as laid down in the FAME requirement. Now, going forward, we are also going to go beyond that and go for deeper localization, focusing also on the localization of child parts. Of course, building the center of competence. Ecosystem has been the biggest enabler in driving adoption. This is one clear advantage that Tata Motors has by tapping the group companies who have domain expertise in different area of ecosystem, whether we talk about charging infra or cells, manufacturing or different financing solution. This is also what we are going to extensively leverage going forward. This is how we plan to really proactively win in the EV space. Over to you, Balaji. Yeah. Thanks, Shailesh. What I'll try and talk about is the business rationale and how does it all come together. If you recollect that in the March 2020, the board had approved the proposal to actually subsidiarize the PV business, which we are confirming that by 1st of January next year, that will be fully operational. That was done with a focus to ensure that we are able to drive a differentiated focus between CV and PV. At the same time, we would want to unlock the business for value and see if we're able to get partners to work with us on this area and drive operational flexibility. It also improves the ability of TML to reward its shareholders, that is the purpose which is currently being executed. Along with that, if I look at the PV strategy, which we've been consistently maintaining, the PV strategy is to win sustainably. With that in mind, we had called out in our Investor Day as well, that we definitely want to go after a double-digit market share, which we're happy to confirm we are there. A high single-digit EBITDA. It is still a journey. We are progressing well. We would want to be FCF positive by FY 2023, which again, we are progressing well. For this, the action that we have put in place was to reimagine PV, the front-end execution. The whole slew of products under New Forever, the full portfolio being refreshed, and is doing very well for us. Leverage the ALFA and OMEGA architectures. We had the Altroz launch on ALFA. Now have the next product coming, which is Punch, that's just launching as we speak. On OMEGA, we had first the Harrier, then we had the Safari coming in thereafter. We want to leverage these architectures more and more. Existing assets are being really juiced to the limit. Look at the factories, the production capacities, everything is being driven hard. It's very careful investment choices that we have made, all in the spirit of to win sustainably. Move on to EV. It started as a fledgling unit, and then we are very clear as we started experimenting with it, starting to understand it, and starting to see the consumer react to it. Very clearly, we want to lead the charge in the Indian EV market there. That's the reason the strategy was to win proactively. Here, the actions are very dramatically different to the PV. We want to introduce 10 new EVs, catalyze the charging infrastructure, invest proactively in drivetrains, products, platforms, and the like. There is a very inherent dichotomy between these two, and that is the reason when you look at the implications for it, when you look forward and say that if this is the kind of potential in this country, we will need to really invest. EV will require at least $ 2 billion of investments, INR 16,000 crores plus kind of investment will be needed over the next 5 years. PV will definitely be fund constrained to support this aggressively a spirations. Therefore, we are also clear that we need to continue to invest in EV in order to build momentum and retain the competitive advantage. Lastly, but equally importantly, EV technologies are still evolving and hence they are risky inherently. If this is the implication that we have, then the way we have to look at this business and the investor pool that we need to look at is going to be different. There's a huge advantage going for EV, that it has got a very clear net zero emissions as a fundamental call to it, which is fabulous. Therefore, we can then use this potential of the EV business to tap into a different segment of investors who are focused on the long term, who are focused on a carbon free world, and who have a very different outlook to investments in this space. There is therefore potential to unlock significant value. At the same time, fund our growth aspirations in this business and take the lead in moving the Indian automobile industry to a carbon free world. This fits in very well even with our sustainability aspirations as well. With that in mind, there are four aspects of year. This is the project name for this transaction. First, create a pure play EV company to focus on passenger mobility. This will be created as an asset-light subsidiary of Tata Motors. We'll house all the dedicated EV talent and design capabilities of TML, and we'll really aim to attract top-notch global talent into this particular company. Second, we'll want to step up the investments in EV and related technologies to greater than $2 billion over the next 5 years, as I've already talked about. Third, we'll want to leverage the existing PV assets and investments to drive efficiencies as well as drive speed to market. We need to ensure that we stay ahead of the curve on this one. The PV company will therefore be a tool manufacturer. We provide all the services to EVCo to make it stand up on its feet. Fourth, onboard like-minded investors who will be able to provide us capital, access to the global ecosystem which they are already invested in and unlock value. Most importantly, this external scrutiny of an external investor will always ensure that we are on purpose and will really sharpen our delivery focus. Those are the key aspects of CEER. This is a transaction structure, slide number 12, where PVCo will become 100% subsidiary of Tata Motors on January 1st. The EVCo, the new company, we've not yet named it, we'll find a good name for it in due course, will focus squarely on the future EV products. We'll build and own the future IPs of EV, and we'll also catalyze the creation of the charging infrastructure in the country. The external investors, where we'll take 11%-15% in that company, and we have Tata Motors, the list co, having ownership of 85%-89% in this company. Also, these two companies will pool their CAFE credits, so that now that we have taken EV out of the PVCo and put it out there in terms of all the revenues, et cetera, this will require carbon credits in the future. That will be a pooling arrangement that we'll be putting in place. This is where we're delighted to share with you the TPG Rise Climate, which is a new fund of TPG Growth. We'll be investing $1 billion at a valuation of up to $9.1 billion. This process obviously involved a selective outreach to marquee investors over the last 2 months, and that has now reached a conclusion now. TPG Rise Climate will be the lead investor, and they are a $7 billion fund with a focus on investing in companies that enable carbon reduction in a quantifiable way, and ADQ will be the co-investor. What are the key terms of the deal? It's a $1 billion equity funding, where TPG Growth has a commitment of INR 7,500 crores, $1 billion. 50% of this will come by March 2022, subject, of course, to conditions precedent being met. Also, of course, the set up of the EV company is one of the conditions precedent as well. The balance 50% will come by Q3 2022 on achieving go live actions. Basically, the EV company needs to set up the whole IT systems, everything for it, in order to be able to recognize revenue in that. They were expecting by Q3 2022 that will be done, and therefore we can go live thereafter. That will mean that is the time the next tranche will come in as well. The instrument is a CCPS structure, and it converts into ordinary equity shares in the EV company based on achieving revenue thresholds. only constraint there is achieving revenue thresholds. The valuation will be up to $9.1 billion. Depending on the ratchet moves from 11%-15%, the maximum that TPG Growth stake in the company will be 15%, and the minimum will be 11%. That's how this will be working out. These are all on a post-money basis. That's what we had to say. There is additional material in the deck for you in terms of references on what are the drivers to growth, why has Tata Motors EV been doing well. That's available for you to read. I don't want to spend time on that. Happy to take any questions that you may have. Ask me. Has anyone got a question? No, we haven't dropped off. You're there on mute, aren't you? Yes. You got a question? Let's take a question. Yes, go to Read her the questions. Can you read out the question? Can you hear us please? We request all the participants to please stay connected while we assemble the question queue. Thank you. Hello, am I audible? Yes, ma'am, we are able to hear. Yeah. Okay. The first question is from Jinesh Gandhi. He has asked quite a few questions. Maybe I will read them out. The investment plan of $2 billion would require further investments, possibly further dilution in Tata Motors' stake in EV business? EV investment plan talks about investing in charging infra. Does it mean that the EV business would invest independently of Tata Power for charging infra? What level of EV penetration do you estimate in PVs by FY 2025, FY 2030? Sir, maybe you can take these three questions, and there are another three. Yeah. That's great. The first question, Sneha, was. Charging. No. Before charging was two parts. $2 billion. Further dilution. Firstly, I think this $2.2 billion of investment is over a 5-year period, therefore, there's also business cash flows that are out there. Therefore, we will look at it at an appropriate time in terms of further fundraise if we need to do. Currently, there's no plan for any fundraise at this point in time. This INR 7,500 crores that is coming in will serve us well in the coming years to take all the action that we need to do. We are there, one. Two, with respect to charging infrastructure, if you notice, we have said catalyzing charging infrastructure. We have not yet had any conversation with Tata Power in terms of what structure that we need to put in place, if at all. That is something that we'll work with them in the coming days to ensure there's a mutually satisfying outcome that comes out. This is basically being reserved here in terms of investment that if we need to do, we'll be happy to do it, and we want to co-invest with them, we'll be happy to do it. If they want to take the lead in investments, we'll be happy that way. Any option is out there. All options are open. What we have basically, the spirit with which we have done this deal is that nothing should come in the way of realizing the ambition that we have set for ourselves in the EV world. Therefore, if it means we need to invest in charging infra, we'll go ahead and do it. That's how we have looked at it. Dhiman, can you check that the call is connected? Yes. It is connected, Shailesh. We can hear you. Investors and analysts can hear us? Inba, the call is connected, right? Yes, ma'am, the call is connected. We can hear the management. Yeah. Okay. The analysts are also connected. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Go ahead, Dhiman. The next question, sir, I'll take maybe two. What level of EV penetration do you estimate in PVs by FY 2025, FY 2030? Can you give a flavor of the current revenues, EBITDA, PAT for the EV business? Let me answer the first question. I'll talk first about the industry. In the next 5 years, we are anticipating a double-digit penetration as far as the Indian market is concerned. For Tata Motors, we have specifically taken a target of penetration of 20%+ with the 10 products that we are planning to launch in the next 5 years. That's the answer to the first question. On the revenues, currently, if you notice, we are selling about 1,000+ vehicles every month, and overall, the revenue is in the region of about INR 500 crore-INR 600 crore. We aim to hit an EBITDA break even in this business next year. Obviously, since it is a focused investment, we obviously intend to invest, move into an investment phase in the next 3, 4 years, and then subsequently, we expect the business should expect to go cash positive there onwards. By when would the entire cash come into the company? Is the investment of INR 75 billion linked to any milestone, or how would it be done over 18 months from the first tranche? Yeah. I think the cash, as I said in my presentation as well, will come in two tranches. First tranche expected by March 2022, once we conclude the transaction, CP is implemented, which we are confident of. The second tranche will come in by end of the next calendar year, by which time we should be able to get all our internal IT systems running to start recognizing revenue in the new company that we are creating. The receipt of INR 7,500 crores, other than these two, there's no other constraints. We will receive the full INR 7,500 crores. The performance obligations go into the stake that is there, which could move from 11% to 15%. The $9.1 billion, that's why I've called out that up to $9.1 billion is basically 11% of the $1 billion that is out there. That's how the calculation works. Hope that's clear. The next question is from Pramod Amte, from InCred Capital. What are the terms of interest rate till conversion? The timeline for first conversion and last conversion. What is the investment till date? Very nominal. Yeah. Dhiman, go two questions at a time. It's very difficult to remember otherwise. Sure. Coupon rate on the CCPS are very nominal. Nothing to write home about. As far as conversion itself, the whole thing is by FY 2027 is when after the contract there is a conversion. In case there is any capital raise and there are thresholds, then there is a possibility of a post-conversion. Those are details. Most of it is confidential, so I wouldn't want to get into that. What is the investment till date in EVCo specific projects, and what is the exit route plan for new investors in EVCo venture? I think the investment, as I said earlier, is close to about INR 16,000 crores, is the kind of investment that will go into the new EVCo. As far as exit options are there. All options are available for the investor, right from Tata Motors buying them out to third-party investor. We find a third-party investor for them, or we swap it into Tata Motors, or we merge it into Tata Motors, or we IPO it out. All options are available for us. It's a pretty flexible option structure that is there. We'll work together with them and make it happen. Is the plan for finding a partner in the car division complete with this transaction, or would you be still looking for a conventional car partner? Currently, it's fair to say that's not on the front burner, but that doesn't mean we are not open to conversations. We now have to land this deal and take off on EV, so that's what our focus would be at this point in time. We are not saying no to anybody who's interested in working with us. The next question, sir, is from Sonal Gupta, L&T Mutual Fund. He says, "Hi, many congratulations to Tata Motors on the deal. Given that you've announced $2+ billion investment in EVs under this company, will Tata Motors also infuse any capital, or will that be raised from other investors at a later date? I think firstly, if you notice, we are incorporating the company from Tata Motors, from where this dilution is happening. Therefore, we do not see a need for any further capital to come in from Tata Motors. Instead, what is actually happening is a full access to the full PV ecosystem in terms of factories, in terms of sales points, management bandwidth, design, all that is going on there, brands, nameplates, everything. Therefore, we are actually wanting to use everything that has happened in Tata Motors and give EV its full support to ensure that it is able to take off. That's how this deal is being constructed. Other than product and platform development, are there any other areas where EVCo will invest R&D and build IP around it? Shailesh, would you want to take that? Yes. The IPs will be built primarily around products. That is for sure. There will be additional capacities which will be needed to meet the aspirational numbers that we have set for ourselves. These would be the two primary areas which I said. Since there will be localization of components, et cetera, this will be another area. If there is a need, as Balaji said, for charging infra, if we need to invest to meet our aspiration, that is something which we will discuss with Tata Power, and that can also be one potential area if we have to really accelerate things. Thank you, sir. Next question is from Raghu, from Emkay. His question is: how was the pre-money valuation $8.1 billion arrived at? I think EV valuations globally work on a different logic. We had Morgan Stanley and JP Morgan as our advisors, and we had put the whole business plan in front of them. Of course, there was a view in terms of what could be the kind of valuation that is there. Comparable multiples have been used. If you look at this valuation to the EV players in East Asia or EV players in the U.S., I think we compare pretty favorably to the East Asian peers who are out there. With respect to the U.S. peers, obviously, those are premium OEMs. Therefore it's not strictly comparable. Our all compared to East Asian peers, they are quite comfortable with the way it is playing out. It's comparable there. Next question from Kapil Singh of Nomura. Can you please talk about the key terms and conditions of this investment? What does the range of valuation depend on? We just covered that. How will the remaining amount be raised as we plan to invest $ 2 billion? Will the India PV business earn any manufacturing fee? Let me take a while to go through the first piece, which is the ratchet, 11%-15%. That is completely dependent on revenue realization by FY 2027. Obviously, the numbers I'm not in a position to share, but it is totally linked to only revenue realization, so we are pretty confident of achieving those. One. Two, with respect, there'll be three transaction agreements that the EVCo will enter with. Number one, with PVCo for a tolling arrangement to get access to manufacturing. That EVCo will toll manufacture the cars that are there for EVCo. That is contract one, and that will all be arm's length standard related party transaction that are there. One. Second transaction they'll enter into would be a royalty and an IP agreement in order to access all the brands and nameplates. For example, the Nexon brand, the Tigor brand, the Harrier brand, all of them will be available in terms of everything is ready. Even the Punch today that is just getting launched, when that becomes EV, that is also available for the EVCo to draw into. Therefore, that will be the second agreement that is gone into, and that again, will be standard Related Party Transactions and clear on that. That is the second one. Third one will be a very normal shared services agreement for getting all the shared services from Tata Motors, Tata Motors PV, in order to ensure that we don't do traditional things like accounting, payroll, all that will be available from them, so they can get started fast. The spirit of these contracts is to get EV out and running very fast. They will not waste any time doing what others have already done. They will take it on an indefinite license, or they'll take it on a RP basis and move. That is the way that structure is being done. What are the next questions? Will the India EV- Dhiman, whether the... Sorry, sir. Will the India PV business earn any manufacturing fee? Yes. For the tolling arrangements, there will be a fee to pay to the PV company. For use of the brand and IPs, there will be a royalty and IP agreement for which there'll be a fee that will be going in. Those are standard RPT transactions that are there. It'll only to be to the extent of what they've used. If EV today creates a new brand, EV creates a new IP, they won't be paying for that on the PVCo. Actually, very straightforward, simple arrangements. There's nothing complicated in that. Actually, even nothing interesting in that also. Right. Next question from Gunjan from Bank of America. Can you talk about the back end supply chain in terms of battery cell tie-ups, and what is the penetration that you expect in the next 5 years or so? Next 5 years, I already answered this question a while back. From an industry perspective, the EV industry in India is expected to be in the, what to say, early double digit. Penetration is what we expect. From a Tata Motors perspective, we are aspiring to be 20%+. As far as batteries are concerned, right now, we have already localized the pack and module in India, and this is being supplied to us by Tata AutoComp Systems. Going forward, as far as cell manufacturing is concerned, is something also which is under consideration by the Tata Group, and that decision will be taken. If that's the case, then we'll source it locally. As of now, we have arrangement with some of the international cells company, to give cells to Tata AutoComp Systems, who in turn converts that into battery pack and gives it to us. There's no exclusive cell manufacturer whom we have tied up with as of now. Next question from Binay Singh of Morgan Stanley. What are the revenue thresholds for conversion to equity? What are your EV targets in volumes and revenues? As I said earlier, I won't be in a position to share that. That is confidential for obvious reasons. All I can say is that we are pretty confident that we'll hit them, and therefore, it's our aim to max out the valuation, $9.1 billion at 11%. That's what we are running after, and that's what even TPG Growth is running after. Therefore, both of us are aligned that we are to make land claim there. Next question, sir, is from Pramod Kumar of UBS. How many of the upcoming 7 EV launches will be born electric? Related to that, what will be the launch pipeline for the ICE portfolio? Yes. In the next 7 products, we could definitely be considering a dedicated born electric EV, it is too premature to talk about it at this stage. We'll talk about it closer to the date, it is definitely under consideration, and in the plan. In the interim, we are also going to tap into the multi-energy platform architecture, which I talked about in my presentation, which enables the current modern architectures in the PV side which will be more electric ready, enabling it to house more batteries and therefore higher range. This is something which will be the next generation after the conversion products that we are doing. In the next 7 products, we are also considering the born EVs also. How crucial is sustained higher government subsidies for meaningful EV adoption, and what would be the likely price increase for the consumer if subsidies were to expire? Yes. Subsidy is going to be important for the next few years. This will be important, as the battery prices are at a certain level. Going forward in the next 2 to 3 years, the battery prices are also rapidly coming down, and there's a localization initiative also that we are running. The reduction on the cost that we are going to see will completely offset the need for any subsidy. Even if subsidies are going to go away, it will not take away, in any manner, the penetration levels that one is thinking of from EV industry in India, as well as from Tata Motors' ambition of achieving 20%+. Even if subsidy goes away in the next 2 to 3 years, it should not impact, because by that time, the cost structure would have come down significantly. The next question is from Prateek Poddar from Nippon India Mutual Fund. With a $ 1 billion of funding, can we expect capital intensity in the standalone business to reduce going forward? Will the EV company eventually be de-merged for value creation? I think, as far as capital intensity in the PV business is concerned, I refer back to strategy. We are very clear that we want to win sustainably. We are very clear that we want to be cash positive. That strategy continues. There's no change as far as that is concerned, and we'll definitely invest to ensure that we want to continue to grow that business. That business is not being milked. That business is being invested prudently. The reason why the EV investment, we actually want to step up our aspirations, and therefore we want to drive investments there. That's the reason Helios is being done. As far as destination, what happens with that, time will tell. As the chairman puts it nicely, we feel the stones in the water and then we'll figure out where we go. This is the first step that we are taking, and we believe it's a step in the right direction. Where will it take us? Time will tell. Next question from Chirag Shah of Edelweiss. Based on business plans, and say everything goes as per plan, by when the CCPS converts into equity, and what are the key areas that you are looking to spend in the EV space? Yeah. I think the latter part of the question I've already answered; therefore I'll skip that. As far as CCPS conversion is concerned, there are two thresholds. One is FY 2027. Depending on the revenue that we achieve on that particular period, there is a floor of 11% and a cap of 15% as far as stake is concerned. That is the way in which it will convert. One. Two, the other angle is that if for any reason Tata Motors does a fund raise, primary or secondary, and that meets certain thresholds, then there will also be a forced conversion on that basis. Those are the two events, and that can happen earlier than that. Therefore, which form it takes, we will see. Those are the two things there. Next question from Satyam Thakur of Credit Suisse. What are the underlying EV volumes estimates by year that we have gone with, based on which the valuation was based? Whether electric buses and LCVs will remain separate from this new entity. The first question I'm not in a position to answer. All we are saying is that there is an internal plan that we are working towards, which we believe is aspirational, and we and TPG really believe that this is the kind of aspiration that we need to go in with. That's why we are putting our steps jointly together on that one. As far as EV buses are concerned, that's outside the perimeter, and this is one piece there. Be it LCVs, buses, they're all outside the perimeter. I f for any reason there is a technology that EV company develops, which the commercial vehicle business wants to pick up because it makes sense for them to use what is already being created, then that of course, is something that they'll pay a licensee and take that. That That is as per any normal OEM IP transaction that will be happening. That's how it is. Next question is from Ronak Sarda from Systematix. What kind of assets and liabilities will move into the subsidiary? The presentation talks of an asset-light model. How does that work? Will the subsidiary be eligible for PLI scheme? A great set of questions. One is, as far assets and liabilities are concerned, no asset, no liability moves from Tata Motors PVCo into EVCo. It's an asset-light company. PLI. PLI scheme is something that has been announced. We welcome the scheme. We will approach this as a Tata Motors group because that gives us more degrees of freedom, and the payoff obviously happens for electric vehicles in passenger vehicles and commercial vehicles. Therefore, we will take the payoff in those. Those investments, the threshold investments includes ICE. Therefore, it makes sense for us to go as a Tata Motors group to invest in that. As far as battery PLI is concerned, that's another one. Those are on advanced chemistries. That's a separate discussion, and Tata Motors participates in that. We will look at it as a Tata Group and see what is the best way to leverage that particular opportunity. For the automobile advanced technologies piece there, we will go as Tata Motors Group, and EVCo will have a significant payoff that will come into it going forward. The next question from Nitin Arora of Axis Mutual Fund. What is the total requirement for launching 10 EVs, and would this fundraising be sufficient? Yes. I think the estimation of the investment size needed, and we already spoke about it, is not only in the area of product manufacturing, et cetera. We have sized the need for the launch of 10 products, and this is the basis on which we have called for this kind of an investment. It is absolutely taken care of. The next question from Rajesh Ainur. What would be the CapEx plan for next 5 years, and how much of it will be on product development? Yeah. Maybe you missed that piece there. That's what we said. At least $2.2 billion of CapEx we'll be putting in the next 5 years. Wouldn't be in a position to split it up between each of those for obvious reasons. We have another question from Jinesh of Motilal Oswal. What are the level of minimum revenue thresholds does the deal build in for, and what happens if those revenue thresholds are not met? Yeah. As I said earlier, the cap of stake that TPG Rise will be able to pick up in the EV company is a max of 15% and a min of 11%. Therefore, those are floor and cap, and therefore the valuation would be the revenue thresholds will move within that, and if for any reasons we do not meet the revenue threshold, then their stake caps out at 15%. If for any reason we dramatically exceed the revenue thresholds, and therefore, then the minimum stake they'll have is 11%. The valuation obviously caps out on that basis for this transaction. Next question from, again, Satyam Thakur from Credit Suisse. How does profitability of the EV business compare to that of our ICE PV business at gross and EBITDA levels? What scale do you envisage it would be necessary for breakeven? At this point in time, we are pretty confident that the EV business will get a EBITDA breakeven next year. Its contribution margins are similar to what we are seeing in the PV business already, and therefore, we are confident it hit an EBITDA breakeven next year. Thank you. Next question from Nitij from Jefferies. Would you be able to share some details on your EV plans for coming years? For example, what platforms and products, say, in the next 2 or 3 years as you walk the path to 10 EVs? How do you decide what's the right pace of investment in EVs since it's a very nascent industry? Yeah. In one of the earlier questions, I had tried to answer this, but let me just give you once again answer that. We are starting with the gen one products, which are focused on pure conversion, which means that we are picking up a ICE product and removing the ICE powertrain and packing the electric powertrain within the space which is there. The limitation that you have is the range. You can't go for high-range products. The generation two, which I talked about, is the multi-energy platform, where we are adapting some of the modern architectures that we have, like ALFA, into a more electric-ready platform. Which helps in housing more battery and therefore delivering higher range product, and giving more body size at different price points. This enables us to tap the next level of demand as far as electric vehicles are concerned. The third generation would more start shifting towards the born EVs. This is how will be the sequence in which different levels of electrification in our products are going to come, and how the architectures are going to shift from pure conversion to adapted platform to born electric. This is how we are planning to go about. What was the second question? Products, platforms, and journey for 10, how do you get 10 EVs? Okay, back to you. Last question. Sanjay Chawla from Emkay. How much of the current fixed costs from Tata Motors PV or the standalone entity would get transferred to the EV company? Can you just repeat the question, Dhiman? Your audio was bad. How much of the current fixed costs from Tata Motors PV or the standalone entity would get transferred to the EV company? As we said earlier, the dedicated EV engineers are the ones that will get shifted to that. That cost is anyway sitting within Tata Motors today. These numbers are all going to get consolidated within Tata Motors. Therefore, there's no delta cost coming in because of that. We've been very careful that we leverage everything that is already there in TML to make this happen. There's no duplication of cost coming in. Therefore, I would rather look at this as transferring the requisite talent into EV and getting focused work around EV. That's how we are looking at it. There's neither any cost saving. There's no restructuring, nothing in this. It's a growth initiative that we are onto. Invest and grow. That's how we are looking at it. Maybe we have time for one last question. It's from Nishit, from Axis Capital. What is the cost of? Okay, this has been covered. Yeah. Does TPG bring in any additional technical capabilities apart from the $1 billion investment into the company? How do you look at working on new ICE platforms for PVs? Will the company look to do this, or will the focus be exclusively on PVs in India? Let me split the question into two. As far as TPG Rise is concerned, I think they are a huge network of highly valuable inputs that they'll be able to provide in terms of technologies, references, connections, ecosystem. We very carefully work with them so that we are able to plug into that ecosystem there. That's a big benefit that's coming, and it's intangible for all practical purposes, but it's going to be a big one. Second, also, we are really keen. They will have a board seat. They will come onto the board of the EVCo. We do expect their valuable contributions in shaping the strategy and also, more importantly, ensuring there is adequate scrutiny of the EV plans. Those are really valuable stuff that we're expecting, and I'm sure we work very well with them on that front. Your question on PV platforms, as I said earlier, there is no change as far as PV strategy is concerned because we believe India will still have a pretty sizable ICE portfolio, ICE market that will be out there, and we will want to have our fair share in that particular market. Whatever that business needs, only thing is strategy is different from EV so that again, I reiterate that point. That has to be winning sustainably. Therefore, they will have to ensure that they deliver the cash flows and ensure that they live within their means. While PV is all about pushing it all out there and going full blast. That is the difference, nothing is going to stop PV from investing. As we speak We are saying PV will go cash positive from FY 2023 onwards, is after considering the investment that is needed for making it. All lights are green as far as PV is concerned on their growth roadmap and investment roadmap. Right. I think with that, sir, we can conclude on the Q&A. If you can have any closing remarks, sir. Sure. Firstly, thanks everybody for joining at short notice. Sincere apologies for the technical glitch we had zero notice. We could, for obvious reasons, prepare for this particular call. We have to go on the fly. I do apologize for the quality of the audio and the break-in breakouts that were happening. We'll do a better job next time on that particular front. Thank you for joining the session and appreciate your continued support. Thank you. Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, on behalf of Tata Motors Limited, that concludes this conference. Thank you all for joining us. You may now disconnect your lines.