Ladies and gentlemen, I welcome you all to the Q3 and 9 months FY25 Post-Earnings Conference call of Control Print Limited. Today, on the call from the management, we have with us Mr. Shiva Kabra, Joint Managing Director, and Mr. Jaideep Barve, Chief Financial Officer. As a disclaimer, I would like to inform all of you that this call may contain forward-looking statements which may involve risk and uncertainties. Also, a reminder that this call is being recorded. I would now request the management to detail us about the business performance highlights for the quarter, the growth plans, and visions for the coming year, post which we will open the floor for Q&A. Over to the management team. Yeah. Hello everybody. My name is Jaideep Barve, and I'm the Chief Financial Officer of Control Print Limited. Welcome you all to the earnings conference call for the third quarter of the financial year 24-25 of Control Print Limited. We appreciate that you have taken out time from your busy schedule to attend this call. First of all, let me wish you and your families a Happy New Year. Mr. Shiva Kabra, the Joint Managing Director of Control Print Limited, also joins me on this call. For first-time joiners on the earnings call, more information about CPL can be obtained by visiting our website. Just for your information, the detailed presentation has already been put up on the website, as well as in the investor presentation notification on the exchanges for this call. Now, let me provide you some highlights for the performance of CPL for the third quarter of FY24-25 on a standalone basis. Revenue from operations on a standalone basis, the total income for the third quarter is approximately 95 crores. This is a good growth from approximately 84 crores in the third quarter of the previous year. Just for information, the FY23-FY24 and FY22-FY23 income was 347 crores and 295 crores, respectively. This revenue trend actually augurs well for our company, and we look forward to ending FY24-FY25 with a solid revenue. Pipes, food, dairy, steel and metal, cable and wire continue to be our top five verticals. We also have two divisions which we are planning to focus on, apart from the coding and marking, one is a track and trace, and the other is the packaging division, where we feel there's a lot of scope for improvement in the revenue. On the expenses and the profitability level, I would like to state that the Q3 COGS is a little bit higher as compared to the quarter two of this year and quarter three of the last financial year. The primary reason for this increase in COGS is because there's been a change in the product mix of the revenue. That said, management remains committed to optimize the procurement costs as well, and we definitely look closely into the economy, efficiency, and effectiveness of operations. This, we feel, can definitely lead to a reduction in the operating costs going forward. Employee costs, depreciation, manufacturing costs, and other expenses, they have been incurred in line with the business needs and requirements. The EBITDA and the PAT growth was at negative 1.86% and positive 5.19% on a year-on-year basis. For us, the way forward we believe is increased revenue expected in the packaging business, both in India and overseas, better penetration in the track and trace segment with strong orders in the pipeline. Our overseas subsidiaries will continue to be monitored by us, which focus on growth targets. For coding and marking, which is the main revenue for us, the change in sales strategy to focus on bigger and key accounts will definitely result in both a jump in the revenue as well as ensuring a good quality of revenue. Our installed base will be increased, and we will focus on increasing our larger market share. With now, the floor is open for questions. Thank you, Jaideep. All those who wish to ask a question may use the option of raise hand. In case you're unable to raise hand, you may put a question in the chat box, and we'll call you to ask a question. Jaideep, before we move to the Q&A, could you throw some light on the reasons for the soft performance in the standalone business and the lower gross margins in Q3, and what is leading to this phenomenon? I wouldn't call this actually a soft performance because the revenue continues to be robust, and we've got a good pipeline of orders. In fact, the Q4, we will be ending on a strong revenue performance on a standalone basis. There has been a bit of increase in the cost of goods sold as well as the SG&A expenses. For the cost of goods sold, investors would know that the majority of our revenue comes from consumables, and some portion comes from the printers, the AMC services, and thus spare parts revenue. We have got a change in the product mix, so more number of printers have been sold in the current quarter. Since the cost of goods sold for the printers is higher, we find a reduction in the overall gross profit for the coding and marking division. When it comes to the increases of overheads, which is basically the general administration overheads, there has been some increase in the traveling expenses for sure. We've been trying to also put up our exhibitions in India as well as overseas. So there is an increase in the number of exhibitions as well. And there is some bit of rise in expense because the Q3 has got lots of festivals. So in line with Diwali or Christmas or New Year, the sales and promotion activities were increased this quarter. Okay. We have a first question from the line of Aniket. Aniket, you can go ahead, please. Yes, thank you so much. So I just wanted to ask you that this time you have highlighted a slide on V-Shapes, especially. So can you throw some light on this opportunity and potential for this product considering its pricing? Yeah, Shiva, you want to take this question? Yeah, sure. So I think as we discussed previously, again, if it's like a pretty general question, I would first ask that people explore this product and maybe understand a bit more about what it does. But it's a sort of single-use or a mono-dose format of packaging, which has some advantages over the current forms of packaging, namely the standard sachet, the thermoforms, and of course, single-use plastic or glass bottles and other types of single-use packaging. So it's a different type of a technology. And of course, it's got some challenges of its own in terms of cost, relatively speaking, but it has some technical advantages and aesthetic advantages, which could give a fair benefit to a lot of customers who use it. It's something that we are developing, but it's very difficult to comment offhand on just the technology because you have to go in a pretty in-depth method of understanding that product, frankly. It's somewhat similar to our existing business in that it is an IP-led product. It has also got a lock between the machine and the materials. I would say the closest equivalent would be Tetra Pak, but of course, Tetra Pak is way bigger in terms of size and scope. It's an idea to develop this product and make it a bigger product in times coming forward. I just wanted to mention, Jaideep, we've got three, four questions, and I wanted to answer those questions. Whatever questions you've received from investors, let's address those before we start to address everyone else's questions. Yeah, we did receive three questions. One was on the operating cash flow. So, as part of the MIS what we prepared, we do not have an operating cash flow prepared on a division-wide basis. But all I can say is that coding and marking, which is the flagship revenue segment for our company, we've got a good cash flow generator out of it. There's no compromise on the sales price, and overall, the profitability looks very good on that. Another question was asked about the employee costs to us. So we would like to say that we are also in an expansion mode, and there will be obviously some kind of an increase in the salaries and also the bonuses amount or incentive amounts paid out. So we would expect an increase in the personnel costs going forward as well. One more question which was asked to us was on the margins or the cost of goods sold, which I've already answered previously. Okay, okay. So just one question. What is the capacity to manufacture the machinery for the products in India, and what's the scale of plan about it? Which machinery you're talking about specifically? V-Shapes, V-Shapes. Yes, so for the V-Shapes, we're going to make the materials in India. That's the idea. But the machines are still being made in Italy. My rough guesstimate is that Italy could make about 40 machines before they need some sort of expansion in space. At that point of time, we'll start shifting some part of the manufacturing to India, but not before, so right now, we are far from selling 40 machines a year, so we need to scale up the sales first, then we'll deal with these other issues shortly, but yeah, that's one of the things, and the material capacity is something that we are going to be looking at in India. We're actively working on that, but it's still in the discussion stage. It's still more of a lab development type of stage. Okay, all right. So that's it from my side. Thank you so much. Thank you. I'll request all participants to limit the initial round to two questions. We'll take the next question from Deven Kulkarni. Deven, you can go ahead, please. Yeah. Hi, Jaideep. Can you share the category-wise mix for Q3, sales mix? Yeah, Deven, definitely. For the Q3, as you're aware, we've got revenues into four segments. One is printers, consumables, the spares, and the service. So the breakup for Q3 is 16%, 61%, 7%, and 15% for printers, consumables, spares, and services. And if you would like to have a comparative between the quarter two, it was 13%, 64%, 7%, and 15%. Okay. So it seems like our consumable revenue growth has dropped sharply. It used to be around 15%, 16% till Q2. If I take 61% as the consumable mix, the revenue growth for consumables would be hardly 10%. Is that right? The revenue growth, you mean to say? Yeah, the revenue growth only for the consumables part, not for the printers. Yeah, it would be about 15%, yeah. For the consumables? Yeah, yeah. Okay. So can you share the same category mix for Q3 of FY24, that is last year? Q3 of FY24, I'll have to work and get back to you, Deven, on that. Okay, but you are saying that in the, I can give you the previous year's breakup, which was about 16%, 61%, 8%, 15%. Okay. So actually, the product, in fact, in the consumables and the printers also, each of the products also has got a different type of costing attached and a revenue attached. So this actually is a very complex question because some of the inks are high priced, some of the inks are not high priced, some of the printers are high priced, others are not. So the way the product mix changes, it has an impact on that. Okay. So the way to put this question is so our total revenue is around 12%. And you are saying that consumables revenue has grown at 15%. So ideally, in that scenario, our gross margins should have expanded year on year, but they have contracted by 4%. So that's where I'm not able to connect the two. So there's been a sharp increase in the number of printers sold. I mean, the delta is about 81 odd printers on a net basis. So yeah, that actually explains the mathematics. Okay. No, but if overall revenue growth is 12% and consumables have grown at 15%, then other categories, which are largely printers, would have grown at a slower rate, right? No, printers. What is happening is, Deven, that the printers, if you have an increase in the volume of printers sold, obviously the cost of goods sold is going to be higher. And that is why the gross margins become lower. So from the last quarter, we have actually for the printers, it was about 13%. Now it's about 16%. Okay. Okay. If I may say something, I think more important is fundamentally, there's no change in our selling prices or our cost prices. So it's a mix of product fluctuations and the sort of also the types of products that we are selling. So it could be within the product categories and certain other things. We don't disclose some exact numbers upfront. It's also, like I said, there are consolidating subsidiaries, but everyone has to understand those same businesses, the digital printing, the packaging business, which is the V-Shapes and so on, and the track and trace we also do in India as part of our standalone business. So it's like a division within Control Print itself rather than having any separation. So a lot of times, the results of those are also coming in this existing business. And we have, in fact, promised to give a— That's why I think there was a question on the cash flow and the profitability of the coding and marking business. And Jaideep, so we're not going to exact cash flow. I think Jaideep and I made that. But the profitability of the coding and marking business has increased in line with the revenues or maybe better than that, at least on an approximate basis. That's coming from our MIS. It's not an audited type of number. So the difference is that the additional costs are coming from certain other parts of the business, so to say. So just to give a brief overview of what's happening, I think we've discussed this in the past. I don't know how many people are new, but we've taken some new business initiatives and new divisions that we've created. And so both on the standalone basis and a consolidated basis, that's where we're seeing the differences coming from. But like I said, for me, what we track is the selling prices and the manufacturing cost and those margins. Of course, the SG&A is not really tracked that closely by me, but there's no real fundamental change in the selling prices or the manufacturing cost. Okay. Okay. Understood. Thank you. Again, I want to say these are for mature products. There are some products we sell in lower volumes because we're developing them. A lot of times, we even might sell them at a loss because there's a lot of one-off costs associated with them. So just so that everyone's aware. We'll take the next question from Saket Kapoor. Saket, you can go ahead, please. Yeah. Namaskar, sir. Thank you for the opportunity. Shiva sir, if you could just allude to us the way forward as you are seeing in terms of our subsidiary performance, especially the overseas ones, how well are you in line with the program which has been scheduled by you in terms of their performance? If you could just throw some more light, where are we in terms of the nine months? And going ahead, how are we planning to execute our style of operations, especially from the subsidiary performance? If you could give us some more color on the same? So personally, I'm happy. I think the focus right now, honestly, is mainly on CP Italy, which is our V-Shapes division, because that's much bigger than both Markprint and Codeology combined. And both Markprint and Codeology are profitable, but we're not focusing so much on it right now because this is a much bigger business opportunity for us. But we're also working on that, and that's also improving. So the main thing is right now to ramp up the packaging machinery in all directions. So there's many things in that. There's a technical consistency. That's the single most important thing, in my opinion. Then the marketing part of ours is sorely lacking. So we're working on that. Maybe in this quarter, there'll be a lot of change in that. The sales aspect was lacking. So we only hired about six. We're talking about maybe seven people that we've hired, but it's all come in the last three, four months only. So it's going to take another three, four months minimum for them to contribute because there's a technical aspect to it, an element for it to, for them to understand the product enough and develop those cases enough. Again, the sales cycle for these products is longer. So I can't tell everyone what's happening exactly. But I feel the pipelines are promising both in our track and trace business and in our packaging business and also in our digital printing innovations that we've made. So I'm sort of happy because I'm going to be looking, like I said, for me, a quarterly basis or even an annual basis might not have that much meaning. But this was a planned strategy on our part to increase our long-term growth rates. The core coding business is doing well, and therefore, we can afford to keep investing in other businesses. So I think we've just got to go through this entire cycle, and it's going to take some time for it to build up to a certain size of revenue before they really contribute to the bottom line. And secondly, Shiva sir, our core business domestically, what is our understanding from our clients in terms of their utilization capacity, utilization, and the economic activity? As As we see in terms of the GDP number and the other data, the spending from the government side is on the lower side. So how is this translating into the demand outlook from our key client area or clientele industries? If you could just throw some more light, that is directly to the consumable requirement. And sir, in terms of the—y eah, yeah. Okay, please. So we are doing well in our domestic coding and marking business. I'm talking about the coding and marking. I'm not talking about all the other parts of the business. Because like I said, those are more in the investment phase. But in the coding and marking business, we are doing fine. We are selling well. We are growing. And there's more acceptance of our newer products that we've come out with. So we are doing okay on all fronts, I'd say. There has been some... So the only... And like I said, from the market, our Q3 results in terms of number of printer sales and everything was actually better than the first two quarters. So it could fluctuate, but we have a good pipeline right now. The main fluctuations are there on our side, mainly because we had changed our sales strategy. I don't know how many of you are aware. I said we were focusing more on larger customers only who have a certain size of business. I don't know. I think we mentioned this in the previous con calls. So that just took some time for it to implement. Now also, it's not, I'll say, 100% implement, but maybe there's a 60%, 70% acceptance of what's happening. Because saying something and the sales team believing in it and accepting it is a very different thing. That's my own experience. So even if whatever I say, it might not matter. So the pipeline, the domestic coding and marking pipeline is fair, and we expect it to be steady, not spectacular, but it's doing well. I don't know how the GDP and the economy and all is doing, but we don't have any excuses because the market is big in the end. In between the four of us, we only have 21% market share. And from an overall market perspective, maybe we're 17%-18%. And maybe the market will be like INR 2,100-2,200 crores, and we'll be like maybe ending at 400 this year or so. I don't know. Someone back calculates us about 18% or something. So we still have scope to grow, even in terms of market share. Although it's a slow, difficult growth, as we all know, in this type of business, but it's possible. Sir, last point, you mentioned about shift in the strategy part, addressing clients with higher market share, higher volume of business. If you could just explain, sir, and what have been the impact on our sales and therefore the bottom line, just if you could just give elaborate more on the same? No, so I think it's obviously the idea is to target the larger customers because in India, the large customers still control a high percentage of the addressable market because they still have control of access to the kiranas, to the smaller stores, and even to the modern trade where they have a lot more stores, I think, because those brands are well known. So we are working more on those companies because our service levels, our printer quality, and everything is geared more towards the customer who has a high who's demanding. So the more demanding the customer is, the better it is for us, and that improves our competitive edge. So that's where the strategies had a shift. And it's working successfully for us now is what I feel. So I think even in the first few months, it took some time for everything to settle in. But now it's beginning to pick up. Like I said, things are getting more streamlined. And like I said, there is an effect because bigger customers have or mid to big-sized customers just have a longer sales cycle. So it's taking us more time to conclude a sale. The sale is in a higher number of printers. So overall, it doesn't negatively affect us, but it's more lumpy. That's what I'll say. It can be changed more from quarter to quarter as compared to when you have a good amount of smaller customers that even evens out. Right. Right, sir. So thank you. And for the innovative coding one, the small acquisition, which was our first acquisition a few years ago, how have been their performance and what steps are we taking to improve their size and their contribution to the company? So Jaideep, do you want to take that one? Yeah, I want to. So Innovative Codes, we've got a strong growth in the revenue. In fact, it is 36% as compared to the previous quarter. And if the last year's turnover was just about INR 10 crores, which we've actually done in the nine months. So it augurs well for that company. And with a little bit of management of costs in a focused way, the profitability also should be better by the end of the year. So we are doing very well with Innovative Codes. Thank you. Thank you, Saket. Thank you, sir. Yeah, thank you, sir. We'll take the next question from Bhavesh Rathod. Yes, I'm audible? Yes, you are. Yes, Bhavesh this side. Good afternoon, everyone. So the company has recently incorporated a wholly-owned subsidiary in U.A.E. So what are markets which we intend to cater to via this entity and how? So again, this is mainly a sales outlet for us for the Middle East and Africa. As of right now, it's a very thin-staff type of a thing. And that's what the plan is. It's not. We're not planning to have a full-fledged operation there. So it's mainly to cater to the Middle East and Africa only because we have some sales there. And because our sales are increasing in that region, we need to streamline because exporting from India is a big pain sometimes because of the amount of paperwork involved for every single sale. So maybe we're going to use it as a more financial type of a make it easier to just make things faster. Plus, having a salesperson or two out there will make a difference in terms of increasing the sales output in that region. It's just an extension of our thing. Think of it as an extra branch of us rather than a real subsidiary of sorts. Okay. So it's basically a demand-based supply, I guess, r ight, sir? Yes. Yes. Okay. And so are we going to have all exclusive contracts as well, or only will be inclusive? I don't understand that at all. I didn't understand that question. Can you just explain that, please? Are we going to have exclusive contracts from them, or is it a normal contract? No, it's the same as we sell machines. We sell printers. They buy inks. Everything is there. Exactly the same as the India business. Price points are higher. Costs are higher. So it all evens out in the end. And from there, also, we plan to support the Africa business. And we have some printers and some sales in Africa. So yeah, I think it's just easier to get shipments and other types of things done because the amount of paperwork out here is like 10 times more. That's all. Okay. Okay, sir. And the consolidated top line quarter-on-quarter basis seems to be mostly flat. So however, the nine-month position shows a growth of around 17%-18%. So what shall be expected top line for FY24, sir? It's too early to say. On a standalone basis, I think we had said that we're targeting INR 400 crores for standalone. That was, again, something we had said that this is what we were looking at. But on a consolidated basis, we don't have any targets, and we're not giving anything out. Because these are mainly the consolidated, many businesses that we are still in the growth phase. So it's really difficult. It's more about establishing those product lines, establishing those businesses, and then seeing how we do out there. Thanks, Bhavesh. We'll take the next question from Arnav Sahuja. Arnav, please go ahead. Congrats on a strong selling result. So I just have two questions. So what has been the OCF and FCF generation in the three months and the nine months of this year? So I think that question was asked already on email. We gave a reply to that, Arnav. And we said that we've not calculated the profitability or the OCF overall. We don't disclose that because I think it's disclosed every six months or 12 months. So whenever we audit it, we'll give it out. But we did say that the profitability of the coding and marking business, because that question was asked, is higher than I mean, or it's increased in line with the revenue of the coding and marking business, so higher. And we expect that the operating cash flow of that business would have also increased in line. Again, the way our FICO is structured in SAP, it's not that easy to clarify this. So someone will have to do a real deep dive. So again, I won't give those types of numbers. But the way our MIS is structured, again, I'm saying it depends on the type of reporting that we have. Coding and marking business has improved in both revenue and profitability, and it's been in line. In spite of some higher costs, which Jaideep has told specifically in travel and other types of expenses for some reason, we have to go into that in depth because we also don't know why those costs have suddenly spiked up so much in this year. So it's a concern for us also. Part of those costs are also because there are other new business lines that are being there. And we also said that the margin concerns are related to that. So again, the cash flow for core operation, we believe, is steady. Again, like I said, I don't have the exact numbers for that, but it's steady. The operating cash flow could be steady. Part of what we do in new businesses could also be part of revenue, but it could also be part of an investment. It could be looked at both ways. It's like that's something that obviously you all have to consider from your own angle. So just following up a bit about the subsidiaries that you were mentioning. So we saw pretty good revenue momentum in these subsidiaries. But is there any timeline during which we can expect the employee costs and other expenses to just settle down a bit for these subsidiaries? Is there any information on that? That question was raised. It was written to us. I think Jaideep has been saying we're expecting in our standalone business an INR 8-10 crore increase in wages and associated costs like travel and whatever other stuff, the SAP licenses and whatever happens next. That's what our standalone is. For subsidiaries, it's very difficult for us to predict because I'll be very honest. People abroad cost significantly more. We are more slow in the way we're hiring them. As of right now, in the packaging industry, we've got three salespeople and Christian himself, our head, who also is quite deeply involved in that aspect. In India and Africa, we have four salespeople in the Gulf. Between this, we want to first stabilize with this many. We have a head out here also of our packaging business. So we want to stabilize first before we really ramp up and say that I'll get people in South America and North America and Japan. You get my point. But I don't know if I'm going to do that or not, right? It It all depends on how I'm seeing the pipeline going and evolving. My idea is not to generate profits. My idea is to scale up fast, but also not be a bit rash about it. So first, get things right in these two geographies where we already have the strongest presence and coverage, and then scale up. So that's what the idea would be. In the track and trace business, again, it's a similar type of situation where we are scaling up out here in India. And that's also working out. The pipeline out there is also quite promising. In the digital printing, we've had some sort of technical glitches. So we've got good interest, but we need to be working out some last-minute hassles, I can say, to everything has to work perfectly. Otherwise, this whole business is useless in our case. So it seems like everything should work perfectly, but sometimes it can take longer than what we expect. That's the only problem. So that's what it is. But again, I'd say so as far as especially the packaging business goes, we would want to if we're feeling we're doing well in that, we're going to just scale up our operations faster. And there's no obligation for us to make money is to grow that business as fast as possible so we can maximize the opportunity. But right now, we don't see a good visibility within Europe and India, Gulf, Africa, which is the area we're covering pretty well. South South Asia, we don't want to really scale that business up in terms of adding another 15-20 salespeople abroad. We're going to cost us a bomb. And supported operations because everything for us to make a sample actually costs us a lot of money, to be honest. We have to give 100 samples to someone. That's a huge cost to me because to get the printing done, to get everything done, to do the quality test costs me a lot of money. So like I said, we want to make sure that we've got everything correct here before we say that we are ready to really take this out and we focus more on our core geographies there. So in India, an INR 8-10 crore cost increase, including the coding and marking business. That's what we're expecting. And abroad, we're not giving any predictions or in our subsidiaries because it's going to be, we're going to have to take it month by month and see what's happening. But as of right now, I'd say, yeah, we have all the people we need for right now. But if we feel we're doing better, we don't have any problems increasing. Okay. Thanks a lot. Just one clarification. I didn't catch the sales mix of Q3 FY25 properly. If you could just repeat that, that would be great. But for Q3 and Q2 as well. I didn't get your question, Arnav, c an you just repeat it? So you had mentioned the sales mix between printer, consumables, spares, and services. Yeah. Okay. So for. Yeah, Arnav. So for Q3, between the printers, consumables, spares, and services, it is 16%, 61%, 7%, and 15%. And for Q2, it was 13%, 64%, 7%, and 15%. Okay. Thank you. Yeah. Thanks. Thanks, Arnav. We'll take the next question from Aruna Manikoti. Okay. Hi, Jaideep, and hi, Shiva. Good afternoon, everyone. I have very basic, simple questions. The first question is, which company is giving us the top competition when it comes to our core business, like coding and marking? Is there any publicly listed company giving us top competition or any private company? Which company do you consider as the top competitor? Do you want me to answer, Jaideep? But I think it's been in all the previous calls, Videojet, but especially Domino is the number one in India. And then Videojet, Markem-Imaje, and Control Print are about equal in size. So you can say we are the four major players. Domino has got about a 30% market share. And between the four of us, about 80% of the coding and marking business of India. And Domino is about 30%, and then the others between us are between 21%, 22%, 23%, something like that. So it's just slightly yeah. That's not what the situation is. So I'd say Domino Printing Sciences, Videojet India, and— Imaje. Markem. Yeah. These are the three key competitors. Oh, great. Thanks for answering, and then my next question is, what is that one thing that we are doing differently when we compare ourselves with our competitors for our core segment, like coding and printing again? Is there something that we are doing differently when compared with them? If so, then what is that? So if you want to have some variations in strategy, like I said, I think we focus on some slightly different product lines. But all of us have a full range of products and a full range of services. So all of us are full-suite players, so to say. Now, of course, I mean, I don't know. I'm not saying it, but there can be various car companies with different strategies, but largely, they're covering similar things. So obviously, and I'm quite sure that we give a superior experience. I know that for sure. But in the end, in our business, the products are quite sticky. So change is slow to come. But we believe we've got a good product lineup, a great technology lineup, and we've got the best service and technical team out there to support that. Now we've come out of the more targeted sales strategy rather than being all over the place. Hopefully, the sales and marketing will measure up to the quality of our products and innovation and our service team and their efforts. Hopefully, if that catches up, then we could increase our market share. Right, right, right, right. That makes sense. That makes sense. My next question is, do you anticipate any challenges or negatives for the upcoming quarters for our company? Anything that you're anticipating? No, I think we've been quite straightforward that the coding and marking business looks steady. It looks okay, and our businesses are cost scaling up, so nobody can see anything. When we mature, we'll talk about them more, but right now, our message to all investors and shareholders is transparent that it's still a growth phase for us. It's still an investment phase for us, and obviously, there has to be a timeline to it, like Mr. Saket Kapoor and other people have said, but we'll definitely like to scale up and hit a certain size, and that's when we'll start focusing more on then the margin part, so we look more at the gross margins. We want to maintain our gross margins in the business considering we're doing a certain volume, so that's something we don't really compromise upon. The idea is always that even if this business becomes 100 crores, the gross margin should remain a certain percentage. We're talking, say, 60% or 65% or 50%, whatever it may be, 50%. That should remain from day one. It might not be that way because a lot of times we have high costs when the volumes are low, both on the cost of goods sold and in terms of the actual sales, like other expenses. The idea is as that business scales up, it should have a pretty good profile and be positive for us. Whether it's going to scale up or not, how long it's going to take to scale up, if it's going to scale up, all these sorts of things, these are unknowns. My last question is— Aruna, please, may I request you to rejoin the queue, please? And I request all the participants to restrict their questions to two per participant. We'll take the next question from Ridhima Goyal. Hello. Hi, am I audible? Yes, yes, Ridhima. Yeah, thank you for the opportunity. So I have two questions. First question is, would it be possible for you guys to share the financials of your acquisitions? How much is the top line and what are the EBITDA margins, the existing top line and the margins? And what is the synergy benefits we are going to what would be the growth and the margins we are expecting from these acquisitions? That's number one. Yeah. So I think, Jaideep, you can answer this question. Yeah, yeah. So Ridhima, once we consolidate the results of all of the subsidiaries, we do not have a practice neither any of the companies have a practice of releasing the financial statements. But in case you would like to have a specific question regarding any of our subsidiaries, please feel free to write to me at cfo@controlprint.com, w e'll be able to resolve your queries at the earliest convenience. Okay. No problem. Thank you. So next is the margins which we have in the quarter three. Is it a one-off thing, or we can expect that going forward? These are the sustainable margins which we can expect in the next few quarters? Yeah. As Shiva had said, there has been no compromise as such on the selling prices. The only thing is that some of the cost of goods sold can become cyclical in nature, but we definitely, as part of the senior management, we take a hard look at the cost of goods sold and consumables, and we are definitely trying to increase our economic efficiency and effectiveness of operations, so there might be changes, but overall, we feel that we should be able to control it in a better way. So we can expect the margins can revert back to 24%-25% levels? Yeah, definitely. But what has happened is that we've got a subsidiary in Italy, which we have already mentioned. They are in the growth phase. In fact, we are trying to support them and trying to establish their teams, trying to spruce up their sales and promotional activities. So this is an investment phase for us in that company, as a result of which the revenues might be on the lower side, but there will be costs. So we are clearly looking at long-term prospects and increase in the revenue. So that's the reason why we feel like on a consolidated basis, our margins have dropped down now. No, that I know that it has dropped down because of those reasons. But I'm asking the future prospects. Will it going to be at these levels, like 22%, or it can reach to 24%, 25% or 26%, which we have in the earlier quarters? No, we definitely would like to reach that level again. As I noted, we want to have a stable profitability margin. So we definitely look forward to doing that. Okay. Yeah. Just one last question. Will it be possible for you guys to share the exact mix of the end user industry? What is the FMCG mix or what is your daily mix exactly? You share top five industries, but what would be the, in terms of percentage, how much the sales are being done to? You see, Ridhima, as Shiva has pointed out, I mean, we work in the oligopoly, where just four of us dominate about 80% of the market, and we don't divulge sales-related information. That's what. I mean, we can't divulge much into that. Thank you. Ridhima, may I request you to rejoin the queue? Yeah. We'll take the next question from Shaurya Puniani. Hi, I'm audible. Yeah, you are. Yeah. So regarding that Italy subsidiary, so could you quantify as to what is the revenue potential, some ballpark range? So Shaurya, it's a new type of product. So obviously, it could be very high or it could be a flop. It's not possible for us to say it. So obviously, we are tough. Everyone has high ambitions and hopes. When you do something, what's going to happen is a different type of a business. So let's see whether we are able to move along as we are. I think someone asked this question. I don't remember earlier. And I pointed out that we are also rolling out in stages because, A, we don't have the capacity to have the management bandwidth for every single thing. I think it might have been Arnav. I might have his name right. I said that we don't have the management bandwidth for every single thing. Neither do we want to just take on a whole bunch of costs and go all helter-skelter whether we can afford it or not as a separate thing. We want to sort of really put our strategy in properly, perfect everything in these markets, and then take it forward. It's going to take some time to scale up. But so far, what I can say is there's good interest in the product, which is, to me, the single most important thing. It's an innovation. We have to understand that people are already invested in the existing technology. To change a platform is not easy, especially when it costs more, which is another problem on a per-unit basis. But there is interest. But interest versus sales versus profits, and these are different things what I've seen in life in the past. So I won't say anything. Let's just keep rolling it along. And maybe by the end of the next financial year, we'll have a better idea of where we really stand. So like 15 months from now is probably where we'll understand. So 29th March is when we actually took over V-Shapes. And in the first six months, we've been getting things in order. And I'll say literally maybe from October and November, we've been doing real work in terms of sales and other types of things. That's what my own feeling is. There were many gaping holes because we bought it from liquidation. And just to get things streamlined has taken us time both in India and in Italy and wherever else we have our operations for this. Okay sir. And sir, i s it possible to give a segment-wise margin? You're talking about the Coding and Marking business, which, I mean, just so that I understand? Our margins are the same. Coding and marking. Our selling prices are the same with respect to which industry we sell in and our cost. So roughly, our margins, whether we sell in the Coding and Marking business, we still do about 60%-70%, 65% industrial, 35%-40% packaging. But the margins are the same across both. In fact, the industrial might be a bit higher because we do more specialized inks and more weird requirements, so to say, like more specializations, more customizations, more interfacing, more everything. Less plain vanilla stuff where our margins are just a touch lower. So the more specialty inks, the more weird things we do, we normally charge a little bit extra. Okay. Thank you. Thanks. Shaurya, we'll take the next question from Tushar Talwar. Am I audible? Yes, yes, Tushar. Yeah, thank you. So I have two main questions, slightly detailed ones. So my first question is that on sales strategy, you have mentioned that in the last one year- or- so, we have revamped our sales strategy. One second. If you can just redo this, Tushar, because I think you're getting some sort of a humming sound that's coming. If you can just check your mic one second and redo this. Or is it a humming sound coming? I don't know. Is it better now? Yeah, Tushar, it is better now. Okay. So on the sales strategy, I wanted to ask that you have mentioned that we have revamped our sales strategy in the last year or so. My specific question is that are we vacating the lower end of the market? And I'm asking this specifically because in the last year or so, we have seen another listed company in this space called Aztec Fluids. And it seems to me, when I read the concalls of both the companies, it seems like Control Print is focusing on the larger clients, the bigger clients. And there is some space which is being vacated, which is being taken up by these smaller companies. My specific question is, do we think that these younger companies may eventually start overlapping with our new strategy and change the structure of the oligopolistic market that we participate in? This is my first question. My second question, sir, is on Codeology. I'll ask you to hold your second question because I'll answer your first question first, otherwise I'll forget your first question by the time the second question comes. So specifically, yes, that space is being vacated. Yes, you're correct about that. We do have some very good products for that space, but we don't have the bandwidth to service and sell to that many customers without increasing our sales or service costs. It would be profitable, but then the management bandwidth would be a question, especially since we're doing new products and new industries. The second thing is these products that we put in are very sticky, and like I said, I don't know if you were there earlier. The more demanding the customer, the higher our competitive advantage, both in the industrial segment and in the standard segment. Not only across compared to smaller companies, I can guarantee that even across Videojet, Domino, Markem-Imaje, and Control Print, the more difficult, the more challenging the application, the bigger the competitive advantage we have. So far, my experience of 30 years is I mean, I've been in this business close to 20 years since 2025. But my experience of that, and from what I understand, is that the four of us have always maintained that 80% market share. The reason being that the cost factor is frankly quite low in terms of the spend for the customer. In the end, those customers have more expensive lines. They have higher costs. I think that the way people are thinking now, Tushar, is changing. So when I used to work myself, I used to be I was like more in frontline sales and marketing right in the beginning of my career. And people were very focused on the cost of the ink and the cost of the printer. And it was really about cost, cost, cost, and price, price, price. And since about the last 10 years, it's changed. It changed to reliability. And now people are also calculating the operational efficiency and the cost of downtime. So we're actually having some cases where we're changing the equipment because the maintenance time of the existing equipment might be 1%, and the maintenance of the new equipment might cost you like 0.5% or less than that. So for that person, if you can travel over 500 manufacturing lines, for example, and I can improve my efficiency even 1.5% by just changing a coding and marking device, that's like adding eight extra lines, which is almost like a factory. So the way people are thinking now with these larger customers is different. To be honest, and I'm not getting into specific competitors, the Chinese printers are not bad. They've definitely improved. Before, we were at 98%. They were at 95% efficiency, and that was a huge amount for a printer. Now, we had like so we last measured, we were like 99.47% uptime, which is like the highest economy in the entire industry. And the Chinese guys would be maybe at 98%, 97%, 98%. So the gap is closed in terms of percentage terms, but there's still a gap. For people who, like I said, if you've got something like an internet connection to save a few hundred bucks or even a few thousand rupees, you're not going to take 1% downtime. 1% is three days of working. That's what I would say. You have to think of your factory is on for three additional days without working. That's the way these types of customers are calculating it now. 1.5% downtime is a big difference. Then they're all locked in. They've been trained on our printers. They were trained on the inks. The same thing for Domino, Videojet, Markem-Imaje. Unless people have a big issue, nobody wants to change. You're already in an ecosystem. It's working. Honestly, considering the small cost differences, which again are not validated, people don't want to change from that. And it's like also the soft aspects of it. So again, with your last question, I'm giving a detailed reply. There are our levels of training, the technical level of our people, the amount we pay people, because that's why there's also a lot of things we have to invest in. So it's just like a difference between going to an overall versus another five-star staff. The level of training or discipline in that will just give you a different experience. And then for those customers who are experienced to that in this type of a situation, they will value this and surely I think that what we've seen is a lot of stickiness. We've not lost that many customers ever. And that too, level to smaller competitors. If our types of customers who have issues between the four of us, the last thing they want to do is take risks and go to a smaller person. Understood. Understood, Shiva. Thank you so much. I have more follow-ups on that, but I'll ask them later. I'll ask my question now. I'll just point out one more thing. So what's happening abroad? I just want to conclude this question so that it's there. I hope. Please, please. Everybody, please read the concall before coming for the next investor call because I feel like a lot of times I'm repeating the same things again and again to everyone. So I'm just going to repeat this also. What's happening abroad is that there's a change in industry structure. Okay. So what's happened is that the big companies are not that focused on manufacturing, and there's a lot of small brands. So the microbreweries are growing. The small organic companies supplying local markets, so those types of things are growing. So out there, there's a fragmentation of manufacturing. In India, so far, I have not seen people, I don't know, Panasonic or other people like that actually having lost market share per se. So as a result, now, obviously, if the business changes and guys like Finolex, Polycab, Havells, and all start losing market share, there's a bunch of smaller cable guys or a bunch of that could affect us. And then in that case, the Aztec strategy would work. I'm not saying. But those smaller competitors would maybe gain overall market share. So right now, in India, from whatever I have seen, and obviously, this is my own view, that the big guys still seem to have some entrenched advantages. Asian Paints hasn't been dislodged in a long time in spite of new competitors coming. Their margins might reduce, but I don't see Asian Paints or Berger going anywhere, for example. So what if the industry structure changes? If there is a change, it's going more towards smaller brands, it's fragmenting, then definitely we'll have to take a look at that strategy once again. I understand, Shiva. Thank you so much. That's a lot of nuance there. My second question was on Codeology. And I just wanted to ask that we don't talk about Codeology all that much. We talk about Italy. We've talked about Markprint in the past and past concalls. And my main question here was that why do we have only 51% here? Do we plan to acquire full ownership? And what is the larger plan for this entity? Is it only for entry into the U.K. market, or do we have larger plans there? Yeah. So I'm going to take all those questions. So the first thing is 51% was strategic. What we realized from past experiences was that we don't want to buy out the existing people. We want to work with them on a three, five, seven-year plan where maybe they can exit depending on how we grow in the meantime and what sort of targets we achieve. I can't say more than that because beyond that, you've got a basic idea of what I'm trying to say if you understand what I'm saying. I get it. I get it. But are we seeing any progress there? Yeah. So they're busy. That's why we've not worked much on them because so Codeology is the reason. Again, the strategic rationale is they're mainly into end-of-line automation. Okay. So the conveyors, print-and-apply systems, the strapping systems, the other types of stuff that happens end-of-line, that's what they supply in the U.K. And that also fits in very well with our printers and track-and-trace systems for the end-of-line. So that was one thing, and the second thing is they also make print-and-apply systems, which are actually of value to us. So we're in fact working in a few cases. The print-and-apply systems is a bit of a hole in our portfolio. So again, for Videojet, Domino, and Markem-Imaje, maybe INR 20-30 crore of their business is coming from print-and-apply. We're not in that business. And of course, I'm not saying they're going to do it because we started because obviously we're later in the game. But there's an opportunity to scale up that business also. So that is one of the reasons we purchased it because to develop something in-house and do the whole learning process. I mean, it's just cheaper to buy, to be very honest. At this price, it's just buy. Buy experience, things that work from day one, and then improve upon it. So I think that's something we're getting. We're working on some print-and-apply cases also where our conventional equipment doesn't work on sort of irregular non-porous materials. And that's where we're sort of working with them to provide those types of solutions. And if we're successful, then we'll start manufacturing equipment in India also. So that's the technology that we wanted to add in. And the other thing is, like you said, it's an outlet, which is sort of combined with the existing end-of-line automation business because out there also there's an environmental focus and a cost focus. And that would automatically mean that replacing labels with high-res in the existing line is a benefit for the customer and for the environment out there. That's a reasonable factor. Right. So we have no obstacles to using their technology in other geographies? No, no. Okay. That's all from my end, Shiva. Thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you, Tushar. We'll take the next question from Awanindra Singh. Awanindra, please go ahead. Yeah. Hi. Am I audible? Yes. Yes, Awanindra. So Shiva, just continuing on from the previous participants, when we look at putting our standalone business aside, it's a stable business. It will continue to grow as the industry grows. And we can sort of there'll be ups and downs given how the product mix fits. But if we look at some of our investments that we've done over the last couple of years, I know you've touched on them. If you could just sort of highlight a little bit more on track-and-trace. I understand that we've built the technology in-house, and we've been working with some of the at least the pharmaceutical manufacturers, given the government initiatives on those 760 molecules that they wanted track-and-trace also. So where are we in terms of technology? Are you happy with where we are? Is there potential scope to continue evolving that? You spoke about a pipeline, but if you could just highlight a little bit more on sort of how that's panning out. So again, in the track and trace space, we are working very aggressively. I'm not going to talk about stuff that's in there because whatever we do with any customer is confidential. But we are working on some of those 300 drugs or the 300 brands, rather, that have been offered by the government as the top 300 brands in India. We're working with a significant number of them for implementing them online. So again, I'm going to say it again. Track and trace has gone through four phases. The first phase was there were specific export requirements where they required to put the 2D code or, at that time, a GS1 Data Matrix, not a QR code, as per the requirement of some foreign buyers for specific drugs. That was the first phase, and two companies in India were dominating. I think everyone knows the Associated Capsules Group, and there was another one that was there. So they sell vision systems, so they were dominating that market. Then the second phase came and more customers required it. And it stopped being a very niche product and expanded in size. And it was required in a certain amount of export markets like France, Turkey, and a few others that were specific products. Then the third phase came, which is right now, and it started being implemented within India itself. And 300 brands or whatever have been mandated by the government. And it could be that they might even expand it now that it's proven that it can work. So that's the third phase. Now what's going to happen is the fourth phase. And we're late because we won then the first two phases. The third phase also, we came in late on the day because by the time we finished our acquisition, we rolled out. A lot of those existing 300 brands had already tied up with specific people because obviously, if you have a deadline, you don't want to wait till the last day of the deadline if you're sort of a well-run company, if you will. Now, what happened is so now the fourth phase is where people are going to start consolidating various existing solutions and trying to start standardizing. The fifth phase is when they're going to start using all this data to actually improve their business. We're already focusing on the fifth phase. We are working on the third, fourth, and fifth phases combined. We have already generated a certain IP out here. Again, we filed three key patents on this. I'm going to talk about it here because it's quite technical, but those are patents that we are working with, like two or three. You can say we're going to three or four large pharma companies. We need to implement this and show proof of concept, and if they're going to get the type of benefits that we believe that they're going to get. The thing for us to, sorry, Martin. I heard something. No, no. Continue. So I think if we implement this and we show proof of concept, then it will be something for existing pharmaceutical companies to consider as they start wanting to consolidate their lines for ease of use in consolidating their software. Right now, again, like what I'm saying, the first three phases have been pure compliance. The fourth phase, which is consolidating, is also going to be compliance. The fifth phase is actually going to give the customer benefits. So we need to prove that path. We need to prove that we're in stage five, even as we're implementing stage three for customers. So if we don't do that, we're not going to be successful. Or we'll be successful because of Control Print and the distribution and the service and all the other things. But we have a strong tech platform here. So obviously, I know that if a company like ACG, for example, who's the number one in this business, they're good. I don't see there's nothing incompetent about them at all. It's similar to Domino, Videojet, and Markem-Imaje. So if we don't offer like 40% more, at least in terms of benefit to the customer, 50%. Then why someone is going to want to change us? So we're confident that we offer more than that. But we need to prove it. And each project out here is, I mean, honestly, this is like quicksand or something. So you just go in, and it just becomes deeper and deeper. So that's definitely an issue for us. That's why we're doing some projects which we've not been able to invoice as yet because there are many requirements and many types of automation that are happening. But I think once we have those types of references out, again, even the pharmaceutical industry, a lot of people know other people. And if there is a thing that we have resolved some of their actual business issues with our solution, then I believe that we'll get some sort of paperwork maybe. Market. So again, we're not hitting every company because there's a limited amount of installation, bandwidth, and proof of concept that we can do. It's something we need to improve upon. So we're going to work on that. That's also going to be part of that cost of that INR 8-10 crore increase that we talked about. But yeah, something we need to do. And we've got a good solution. And we've got about three patents filed around our track and trace division, and we think all of them are going to be very useful in the long term. No, I appreciate that. Just two basic add-ons to this. In terms of solution offerings, is it similar to Coding and Marking when there are a handful of solution providers, or is it slightly larger in terms of how many players are there offering track and trace in its various formats? And sort of the other add-on is pharmaceuticals, it's a critical need for that industry. But as we move into some of the other industries like FMCG, at what point do you think the cost benefit is there to those players that they want to start implementing track-and-trace in their systems as well? Yeah. So that's a very good point. So what I'll say is there's two or three elements to it. The first aspect is that where we were talking about if I'm going to use a question here. So okay, this is what it is. For the track-and-trace business, what's required, again, is that people are implementing the solution. And like I said, we've got a certain IP or whatever it is. Once we get that done, then we can look at what we're doing in other businesses outside of pharmaceuticals is going to offer a pre-packaged solution. And that's sort of easy for us to sell to other things because they're not going to pay the same amount of money that the pharmaceutical guys do. And the compliance needs are not there. So they don't need to, they're not being forced to invest in the same level of system. Is that right? I don't know. The same level of system that the pharmaceutical guys are doing. So I think there's a clear breakup. Obviously, for us, pharmaceutical is the bigger business right now. So that's what we're focused upon. But definitely, as we can scale it up and if we can approach other with a sort of more pre-packaged solution to other types of industries, there could be a pickup and a takeup that we can have. There was one part of the question that I'm missing. If you can just repeat that again. Yeah. It was just around how many participants are there in track and trace or the various solutions. Is it similar to Coding and Marking, or is it just a slightly larger? No, so there are more players, but we are the only integrated player from end to end. And that's our advantage. So we make the software. We have the vision systems. We have, obviously, the printing. The printing is, I mean, so that's a very strong integration that we're doing that nobody else can do at that level. And of course, we have the entire downward integration and the sort of integration with their ERP systems. So there's multiple things we're doing out here. And that is where we expect that the customers to get a major benefit compared to our competitors. There are more players, but then again, everyone is in a different part of the business, and they're making some sort of software. What I can say is the amount of sophisticated guys who have a really good software, which is integrated well, will still be like about four. Understood. Understood, and just sort of reminding you. Yeah. I just had one more. Sorry, Awanindra. We are running out of time. Sure. Sure. We'll take the last question of the day from Ashutosh Khetan. Ashutosh, please go ahead. Yeah. Hi. Thanks for taking my question. I just wanted to know the numbers of printers sold in this quarter and the current capacity utilization. We've sold 762 printers in this quarter. Okay, and the capacity utilization for the quarter? We are roughly about 60%-65% of the capacity utilization. Okay. Thank you, sir. Thank you. Yeah. Thanks, Ashutosh. I'll hand over this floor to Vinay. Vinay? Yeah. Thanks. Since that was the last question for the day, we have one more request in the chat from Bhavesh Rathore to ask one question. Bhavesh, you can go ahead and ask your last question. Yeah. Thank you so much, sir. So my question regarding was about the industry. So industry, as in we have different segments and different printers. As of now, we and other peers as well, how does we create more? Like everyone outsources from China and assembles here or their specific regions. Yeah, definitely, service is the main key. But apart from the how Control Print differentiates from others? Yeah. Shiva, you want to take this question? No, no. Sorry, I was on mute. "Can you repeat that question again, please" is what I was saying. Okay, sir. I'll resume in short. So I was asking how Control Print creates some more apart from other peers since everyone outsources it from China and assembles in their specific regions. So what does Control Print do different from other peers and what they will do to execute in a better way as well? No, so like I said, I think that in our Coding and Marking business, it comes to uptime. It comes to different types of technologies. And we've got some technologies where we believe we've got a significantly better offering than our competitors. So I think definitely there's a big uptake of this. And I think we've got some competitive advantage. I think some people have asked that question. Like I said, our entire service, our technical aspects, the product range, the depth of certain products especially are a competitive advantage. And like I said, I think not only that, like I've always mentioned in the past, I think all three competitors, Domino, Markem-Imaje, and Videojet, also have good solutions. So we've all proven the test of time. I think if you ask me personally, that's what I believe. I'm not a customer. So every customer is always the correct person to ask. But I think we've proven that we have something extra compared to the existing of the other service providers who are smaller or something. And that's the reason we've been able to continue growing over a more extended period of time. Okay. Okay. So just last follow-up question. So recently, one SME company got listed. That is, I guess, Aztec Machinery. So any positive or negative impact which can Control Print face for them? I think this exact question was covered by someone earlier. I can't remember who it was. Bhavesh, this question has already been answered. Yeah. Okay, sir. We'll check in other calls. Okay. So that brings us to the end of today's call. Shiva or Jaideep would you like to give any closing comments before we end the call? Yeah. Thank you so much. Thank everyone for joining. And thanks everyone for their time. If we got three or four questions by email, if someone does it, I've got one question on the chat also about some things about the bankruptcy of V-Shapes and other things. So I'm just like, again, I can't answer confidential individual questions. I think I hope everyone respects that. I don't take that many one-on-ones with any investor either. So really, I prefer that everyone sends their questions if they have any in advance. We'll definitely try to address them or put them in the presentation itself rather than giving privileged access to some people. There are a couple of questions about Christian Burattini and some. So again, if you want, we can just post those questions in general. We'll definitely answer them. If anything is non-confidential, we do not have anything. The shareholding pattern is not being disclosed. I don't know if someone can answer that. I think this is a regulatory disclosure. This is standard, so I don't know why that would not have happened, it must have happened, so yes. Just if anyone puts those questions, we'll do it. If someone can send any questions you have in advance, whether it's related to the specific quarter or a general business, then we'll try to address that in the presentation and the questions to the extent possible. I hope everyone gets their questions answered, and if people can read some of the previous con calls and presentations, then what happens is I think sometimes there's some repetition. So, I would like that if you have that one, one and a half hours, then it's not just repeating stuff that we repeated in the same convo or in the same past, whatever, transcripts, if you will, at least in the last two, three if possible. Thank you, everyone. Thank you for joining. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you Thank you to all the participants for joining on the call. Yeah. Thank you, everybody. Thanks. And thank you to the management team for giving us their time. This brings us to the end of today's conference call. You may all disconnect. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you so much.