Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to the Bansal Wire Industries Limited Q1 FY26 Earnings Conference Call hosted by Anand Rathi Share and Stock Brokers Limited. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in listen-only mode, and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during this conference call, please signal an operator by pressing star, then zero on a touch-tone phone. Please note that this conference is being recorded. With this, I now hand the conference over to Mr. Parthiv Jhonsa, Lead Metal and Mining Analyst. Thank you, and over to you, sir. Thank you, Samir. Good morning, everyone. We at Anand Rathi are pleased to host Bansal Wire Industries Limited Q1 FY26 earnings conference call. From the company, we have with us Mr. Pranav Bansal, Managing Director and CEO, and Mr. Ghanshyam Dass Gujarati, CFO. We would now like to invite the management for the opening remarks, which will then be followed by a question-and-answer session. Thank you, and over to you, sir. Hi. Good morning, Parthiv. Thank you for hosting us. Good morning, everyone, and a very warm welcome to Bansal Wire Industries' Q1 earnings call. The results, earnings release, and investor presentations are available on the stock exchanges and our website. We trust you had an opportunity to review them. We are pleased to report a strong start to FY26, continuing the momentum from last year. Despite Q1 typically being a lean quarter, we have delivered a solid performance. This reflects the strength of our integrated operations, customer-first mindset, and constant drive for innovation. The current economic scenario in India presents unparalleled opportunities for the steel wire industry. India's infrastructure and manufacturing push continues to fuel demand for the steel wires. We are well positioned to ride this wave, given our scale, agility, and deep presence across the end-user industry. Now, let me take you through our performance in the Q1. On the volume front, we closed the quarter with 104,000 tons of sales, which is the highest we have ever done in any quarter, despite it being a lean period. This number was achieved at about a 74% capacity utilization, which gives us enough room for future growth. A major highlight this quarter has been our strong cash flow generation. We delivered over INR 100 crore in free cash flow from operating activities, driven by tighter management, better working capital discipline, and improved operational efficiency. This performance marks a turning point, and we expect it to only strengthen in the coming quarters. Now, looking towards a long-term strategic roadmap, our main focus will be on capturing more market share and continuous volume growth over the next three years. We are targeting a 30% increase in volume this year, and we are on track for that. Along with this, we will continuously be adding new capabilities to fuel growth for coming years. In order to achieve this, we might take a small decline in our margins till FY27, but this should normalize or, in fact, increase further from FY28 once the backward integration and specialty wire initiatives kick in. We are especially focusing on growing our specialty wire segment today, products like hose wire, IHT, and steel cord. These import substitute products have received an overwhelming positive response from the customer, further setting tone for the future growth trajectory. These products will significantly bolster our production capabilities and enable us to address the growing market demand more effectively, thereby reinforcing our industry leadership. We expect operationalization of these products within FY27, as in when customers' approval comes through, followed by a phased ramp-up between FY28 to FY30. We are also moving steadily on our Sanand project. Major equipment orders have been finalized with global suppliers. This facility will help us backward integrate our steel and stainless steel wire requirement, securing raw material supply chain and reducing input cost, further strengthening our margin. It will also reflect our ESG commitment through solar energy, rainwater harvesting, and a first-time acid-free pickling process. The confidence to continue with this growth momentum through these initiatives stems from the strong operational cash flow that we have strengthened our financial position with. We anticipate this situation to only continue and further facilitate us in ramping up production in the coming years by funding the majority of our CapEx through internal accruals. With this, I'd now like to hand over the call to our CFO, Mr. Ghanshyam Gujarati. Thank you, Pranav sir. Good morning, everyone. I would like to touch upon the financial summary for the Q1 for Q1 financial. Our revenue grew 15% year-on-year to INR 939 crores. EBITDA surged 20% year-on-year to INR 75 crores, and net profit for the quarter stood at INR 39 crores, up 24% year-on-year basis. As mentioned by Pranav sir, the total volume for the quarter stood at 104,000 tons, compared to 97,000 tons as of March 31, 2025. He has also mentioned that a strong positive cash flow of INR 97 crores in the Q1 of 2026, as against the minus cash flow which was generated in the last year of INR 150 crores. We now open the floor for Q&A. Thank you very much. We will now begin the question-and-answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on the touch-tone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and two. Participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we'll wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. The first question comes from the line of Pratik Singh from DAM Capital. Please go ahead. Thank you for the opportunity and congrats. You have a good set of numbers. The first question is largely 18%. The breakup of the 104,000 tons that we did this quarter, very ballpark, how much was high carbon, low carbon, stainless? Yeah, hi. Sorry, but we do not disclose segment-wise revenue on our quarterly call. Oh, no worries. Volume also? Volume is 104,000 tons for the quarter. I mean, the breakup of volumes, can it be expressed or no? Yes. That I do not have currently. Sure. Sure. Take it later. The second question is largely on working capital, and congrats on working the top on reducing working capital. So what were the key drivers behind reducing this, and how did you see it going ahead? What do you see the reduction in capital over the next few quarters? Yeah, sure. So I think one of the concerns has always been that we do not generate enough free cash, which is what we try to do within this quarter, and which is the target for us for this year as well as next year. What you've seen is about INR 100 crore free cash that we've generated this quarter, and we expect this to only improve further each and every quarter, each and every year from now. We have taken a lot of initiatives in this regard. Of course, we have tightened our inventories quite a lot, and we will see further tightening up of inventories as and when we go. Even after an increase of about 18-20%, we have still not increased our overall debtors by that much. So we have actually taken our overall debtor days down as compared to last year. This, coupled with a lot of other instruments that we've added within this quarter, have led to this kind of a result. Thanks. And the last question is on LRPC wires. If you could brief us that we are targeting 30,000 tons of LRPC wire production. So have we started producing LRPC wires yet, or is it something which is coming by next quarter and after this? So although the capacity is installed as of now in Dadri, we are not utilizing it because right now we are getting better margins than other products. And as you might remember, generally, the capacity that we always produce is fungible. So we have actually tried to shift that capacity to other high-carbon wire products, which are giving us better realization today. But as and when LRPC wire realizations improve, we will start production. We will start producing that. Thanks for this, Pranav. I'll join the team. Thank you. The next questions come from the line of Aditya Bhartia from Investec. Please go ahead. Hi. Good morning, Pranav. My first question is on consolidation of some of the group entities. So in the last couple of quarters, we have started seeing the benefit of volumes of Balaji and Bansal High Carbon coming into the listed entity. So just wanted to understand this volume growth that we have seen on a year-on-year basis, what proportion of that volume growth can be explained by just the consolidation of those two entities into the listed entity, and how much of that is happening on an organic basis? I would say the majority of the volume growth that you see has happened on an organic basis. As you might remember, we have consolidated most of the strength from those two entities also in the Q1 of last year. Whatever was remaining has been consolidated within Q2 and Q3. The majority of it today is organic. And in fact, what I would also like to add is that because of this consolidation, we've been able to really optimize a lot on our efficiencies and the customer branding, which has also helped us gain a lot of market. Even today, after trying our best to utilize Dadri, we are still short of production. Understood. Understood, Pranav. And Pranav, given that Q1 is a lean quarter, is it fair to assume that in every subsequent quarter, we should be seeing an increase of, let's say, somewhere between 10,000-15,000 tons on a sequential basis? So maybe the year-end run rate then becomes more like 130,000 or 140,000 tons of volumes? Is that how you interpret it? Last year, we closed at about 97,000 tons, being the last quarter, and yes, I am pretty confident that we will achieve a 30% kind of a volume growth within this year, if not more. So if we just do that basic math, I think we should be around maybe 1.2-1.3 lakh tons by the end of the quarter, by the end of the year. Sure. My second question is on working capital, wherein bulk of the improvement in working capital that we have seen this time around is on account of inventory, right? And as it is, I mean, if we look at last year, inventory, to a certain extent, had risen. What are the other big levers that we are having to bring down the working capital from here on? Historically, we have seen working capital operating at even lower numbers. So can we get to a similar kind of a run rate of, let's say, somewhere around 70-80 days, 70-odd days of working capital? I think everyone has been working very hard on reducing our inventory days and debtor days. We have already done something on inventory. Now, we are working on how to reduce our debtor days as well. I see no reason why we would not be able to go to that range again, or maybe even better than in the near future. INR 100 crore of operating cash flow is just for this quarter. We have three more quarters, and we'll see much better results from here. Perfect. Perfect. That's great to hear. And just one clarification on that. We have certain levers, like let's say vendor financing or debt factoring. Have you started using them? Or those are the instruments which are yet to be used, and all the improvement that we are seeing is purely on the basis of efforts that you've been putting in? For Q1, I think it will be a mix of both of these. Of course, the majority has been in inventory, but we have also started utilizing a lot of other instruments, especially channel financing, which is one way by which we will be able to reduce our debtors in the coming quarter very much. Sorry to interrupt, but I think there is some background noise. Pranav sir? Sure. I'm done with my questions. Thanks a lot, Pranav. Thank you. Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Somil Mehta from Kotak Mutual Fund. Please go ahead. Yeah. Thanks for the opportunity. First question, in terms of while the operating cash flow for the quarter came strong at about INR 100 crores, if one looks at the cash flow basis in terms of finance cost, that has started to go up. So for the entire year, what kind of cash flow finance interest one should be looking at? And structurally, is there a thought process on the EBITDA to operating cash flow conversion any ratio we are looking at ballpark over the next two or three years on a sustained basis? Sure, sir. So sir, I do agree that financing cost has gone up. And of course, as our revenue goes up, this will keep on increasing. But with that being said, our cash flows would still further improve every quarter and every year because of these working capital initiatives and debtors financing and channel financing initiatives that we have taken. So I do not see any issue here. We have allocated about INR 600 crores for the Sanand project, which is one of the major investments. And we are planning to fund that majority through internal accruals through these additions and working capital. Okay. So fair to assume that obviously FY26 operating cash flow generation will be pretty strong, but going into 27 again, we should have a very high operating cash flow, and probably at a percentage of EBITDA, the number should start improving from what we have seen in previous years. Would that be a fair assumption, Pranav? Yes. I agree with you on this. Our company has honestly not been focusing a lot on free cash flow generation till about now. But now, this year and next year, this is, I would say, kind of a turning point for us, wherein our cash flow generation would improve substantially as compared to the past. Great. And in terms of ballpark FY 2026 and 2027, what would be the CapEx guidance as of now? Sir, our major CapEx has been the Sanand project, which is about INR 600 crores, and maybe another 100-150 crores on our regular maintenance and upgradation CapEx, and how we will keep on adding volumes, capacities to meet the growing demand. So I think it's safe to say about 700-750 crores of CapEx we're looking at this year and next year. This will be spent on a period of two years or three years? This will be spent within two years, so 2026 and 2027. 26 and 27. So in that backdrop, fair to assume that the leverage will go up given operating cash flow generation can be marginally short than what the CapEx guidance is for the next two years? Yes, sir. It would be. We would fund some of it through debt as well because we do not have much leverage in our balance sheet today. So we are comfortable with some amount of debt because this is for backward integration, which will really. This is a project which will start utilization very quickly once it is up and running. So we are quite comfortable with taking some amount of debt for this. Sure. And my last question in terms of the working capital, are there specific internal teams who are working on each of the line items? Can you throw some more light onto what are the specific objectives we have in our mind? I mean, Q1 operating cash flow reduction was, I mean, the working capital reduction was very heartening, but how sustained these trends are? Can you talk a bit more on that? That would be my last question. Sure, sir. So actually, one thing is that we have done a complete organizational restructuring within the last year. Now, we have a specific team looking only after raw material purchases, which is wire rod in our cases, and which is the reason why we have seen this kind of inventory reduction as well here. We have a 10-people team only working on reducing hours and days of inventories today. So this is the kind of tight control that has come in the system. Apart from that, in terms of debtors also, we today have a 75-people team in sales, including the credit control team, working on this right now. We have already seen some reduction happen. And although quarter one was majorly with inventory, the coming quarters, we will see a major change in the debtors ratio as well. Great. Great. All the best for subsequent quarters. Thank you. Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Akash from Dalal & Broacha. Please go ahead. Yeah. Thanks for the opportunity. Congrats, Pranav sir, on a good set of results. Sir, so basically, I was just going through the standalone numbers, and we have improved significantly on our standalone top line. It's improved from almost now INR 600 crore to INR 900 crore. So can you give us a bifurcation of volumes between BSPL and what we do under our standalone entity this quarter? BSPL, we did about 23,000 tons of sale from BSPL. Okay. Understood. Yeah, and so balance would be from Dadri or will have a certain element of job work as well? The balance would be, I mean, some of it would, of course, be from Dadri, but from other units as well. Other than BSPL, we have four manufacturing units. So from all these four manufacturing units, we will have some outcome. Although what I would like to add here is that Dadri has done a little better than the Q4. Although, as I said, Q1 is always a lean period for us because there are a lot of labor shortages because of which that impacts our production quite substantially. But even after that, we were able to increase our production by about 25% in Dadri as compared to Q4 of last year. Fair point, sir. So what utilization level would Dadri be at currently? Sir, the exit run rate for Dadri was at about 35%. Understood. And sir, by the year-end, so one question would be, what would be our volume guidance for next quarter? And by the end of the year, what utilization levels are we targeting? Sir, we have done about 104,000 tons with about 74% capacity utilization. And with this, we are already adding capacities. About 60,000 tons is scheduled to be added within the Q2. And now, on volume front, as I said, our guidance has been 30% for this year, and we are on track to achieving this. But of course, giving you a quarter breakup will be difficult because, again, it is very dynamic how utilization levels are, how fast we are able to ramp up in Dadri. It all depends on that. But for the full year, I think 30% is a fair assumption. Understood, sir. So, yeah, sir. I actually also wanted to understand how was the progress on our specialty wires front? So how many tons have we produced on that front in terms of hose wires? So hose wire, we have already done about 20% kind of a capacity utilization. Apart from that, steel cord, we have already sent samples in the Q1, and we've already received some positive feedback from customers on sampling, because of which we are now confident of operationalizing this capacity within FY27, of course, as and when the customer's approval comes. And after that, we are also planning for a phased ramp-up of production between 28 to 30. Great. So if any ballpark estimate you can give by when we can start commercial production of steel cords, basis what customer interactions have been till date? Hopefully by the third or Q4 of FY27. Okay. So till then, it will be more of hose wire only, where we'll see utilizations improving. And we have all the. We are also starting up IHT Wire soon. So we have all our approvals for hose and IHT in place with the relevant customers? For hose, we are still waiting on major approvals to come in within this quarter. For IHT, our production will only start from Q3. So after that, maybe one or two quarters, it will take us to get approvals there. Okay. So just if you could summarize, let's say out of a 20,000 tons specialty wire capacity, this year, 2026, 2027, and 2028, how do you basically estimate the utilization to scale up or volumes to scale up? Sir, talking about steel cord for 20,000 tons, we are looking at approvals coming in within 2027, Q3 and Q4. Therefore, 2028 will be a year where we will see a major impact of specialty wire coming in. If everything goes well, I think we should be able to utilize about 60%-70% of capacities by 2028. Yeah. But sir, till then, hose wires and IHT will anyway be doing, right? And even those are kind of very high-margin products. So what capacities are we planning in those two segments, let's say this year and next year, 2026 and 2027, till the time steel cords come live? Yeah. So till the time steel cord comes online, we will still have 20,000 tons of capacity that we can make into hose wire. We are looking at about 50-plus% utilization next year. This year also, we are looking at about 35-40% kind of a capacity utilization. Understood. And sir, my last question from my side. So I was just doing a calculation of our realization per ton this quarter and EBITDA per ton. So I think realization sits somewhere around 90,500 or 91,000, somewhere around that figure. And EBITDA sits around per ton, sits around 7,200. So any comments on these two figures, how they will map out in the, let's say, coming few quarters, two, three quarters, in which direction they shall be going? Sir, realization, honestly, is not in much of our control because it all depends on the movement in my raw material. We have a cost-plus model. So whatever increase, decrease there is in the raw material will be passed down. Therefore, realization will keep on increasing. On EBITDA front also, we have guided for a 10% increase of EBITDA this year. And I would like to stay with that guidance. Although I understand that we've already done a better EBITDA, if you just take the Q1, we will see a better result. But I would still like to stay with this guidance because, again, it is very dynamic. And this year and next year, we are looking at increasing market share. So I would not want to comment anything other than this on EBITDA. A 10% increase is what we are looking at. Realization should improve with the prices, right? Sir, that all depends on the raw material cost. So. Correct. Thanks a lot. Thanks a lot, Pranav. It increases, decreases. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Mayank Bhandari from Asian Market Securities. Please go ahead. Yeah. Thanks for the opportunity. My first question is on IHT wires. Could you give us any sense on the market size of IHT, particularly which are the players in this market? Sure, sir. So IHT wire is a wire that is used for suspension application in two-wheeler. Majorly, all the EVs today use IHT wire, which is why we are coming up with this product for all the EVs, two-wheeler EVs especially. Now, looking at today, the market size would be at about 15-20,000 tons. But it is growing very rapidly. As of now, there is only one producer of this product in India, which is Tata. Otherwise, everything is still being imported. So this comes perfectly under our specialty wire vertical, wherein we are trying to substitute imports, and we are only targeting high volume or high growth areas. Okay, and what kind of margin EBITDA per ton we make in IHT? We would be looking at about INR 15-INR 20 a kg kind of an EBITDA per ton here. Okay. And secondly, sir, on this volume guidance of 30% growth, we are currently at almost 74% capacity utilization in the Q1, as you mentioned. And if we go by our capacity expansion plan, our total capacity will become almost 6 lakh or 6.5 lakh ton, right, by the end of this year, including the expansion that we are doing? Sir, right now, we are looking at about 60,000 tons that we will add within the Q2, and after that, also, we can be very quick in adding capacity as and when required, looking at the demand. Okay. This 60,000-ton number was 1.2 lakh last quarter, right, as you had mentioned in your call? Yes. So 60,000 tons is what we were supposed to add within the Q1, which is what we will add now. Okay, so basically. A total of 1.2 lakh can be added quickly. No problem there. So by the end of Q2, it will be 60,000 ton added? Yes. Okay. What was the Capex for this quarter, sir? CapEx for this quarter? Sir, I do not have those numbers in hand. Maybe I'll give those details to you later. Thank you, sir. Okay. Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Rehan Saiyyed from Trinetra Asset Managers. Please go ahead. Yeah. Thank you for the opportunity. I have got a good set of numbers. Sir, most of my questions have already been answered. I have just one left. Sir, like you have mentioned, open 5 lakh ton market potential in specialty wires. So I want to ask, what markets are we aiming to capture in this segment over the next two to three years, if you can just shed some light on it? So specialty wire as a product, I'm not expecting something great to happen within the next one year because there's an approval process already that has to take place, which has already started now. So as I said earlier, 2027 will be a year where we will start getting some numbers with us. And 2028 will be a year where you will see full year kind of a result of specialty wire. From there on, we are targeting to add capacity. Our final project is a 2 lakh ton steel cord project, which we would want to start after 2028. Okay, so my next question is around the export side. How are we competitively positioned against China and Vietnam, especially in the stainless steel wire segment? If you can just put some. Sure, sir. So for export, sir, we have only targeted very well matured markets here, wherein the customer is ready to pay more for a better service and a better quality. Also, China Plus One has been something that has worked for us along the way. So even today, 75% of our export comes from U.S. and Europe, wherein there is a long approval process also and some specific types of customers, wherein we are able to get our margins. With that being said, also, one thing which is important for us is that our raw material cost is less than 50% of the total pricing. Therefore, our disadvantage to China is in less than 50% of the value. Sir, last one skipping question. What is the other impact on standalone? This is 51, 5.1 per hour, significantly higher than previous quarters. So what's driving this? It's treasury income, fair value gains, or a one-time adjustment that we have seen in this quarter? Sir, can you say that again? The voice was not very clear. Yeah. So sir, in this quarter, we have seen other income on standalone basis, 5.1 crore, significantly higher than previous quarters. So what's driving this treasury income? Fair value gains or a one-time adjustment that we have seen? You're talking about other income? Other income. Yeah. Yeah. Significantly higher, yeah, in the last quarter. I'm Ghanshyam Gujarati. There's the other income improved, that Forex exchange gain. That is around INR 22.82 million. That's it. No, no. It's increased like five. No, no, no. It is not increased. Actually, as compared to the last year, last year, it was 55.62. Now, the current year is 22.82 for the Q1 only. There's a gain in foreign exchange. Oh, okay. That's what I was asking. Okay. Okay. Thank you. Thank you for the clarification. And yes, thank you. This is from our side. Thank you. Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Samir from Diamond Asia. Please go ahead. Yeah. Hi. Thanks for the opportunity. Hi, Pranav. Just wanted to understand how should one think on the ROCE, ROE trajectory, especially with the CapEx coming up. You also explained the working capital changes and focus on cash flow. But once this CapEx hump is behind us, would you say that we will hit that 20%-25% mark over the next two to three years? Sure, sir. So one part of ROCE is already taken care of when we are trying to work on our inventories and details. And you will see a better result within this year itself in ROCE. Even after the CapEx that we will do, we will still have a decent set of ROCE by the end of this year. And of course, as and when we progress, our focus has shifted completely to ROCE, and you will see better results. The 25 kind of a range is what we are targeting in the very near future. Okay. Okay. And that's heartening. And secondly, how is the customer feedback on some of our tire cord projects and the product, if you can elaborate a little on that? Sure, sir. So in the Q1, we have already sent some samples to two of our main customers. And we have already gotten very positive feedback from one, and we are waiting for feedback from another customer. So from that particular feedback itself, we are quite positive of getting this done quickly. We are looking at about 12-15 months of an approval cycle, hopefully from one customer. And others could take maybe 15-18 months. But we are quite confident on the product quality that has come out from this line. Okay. Thank you. That's all from my side. All the best. Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Prakash from Anand Rathi. Please go ahead. Hello. Hello. Thank you for the opportunity. Yeah. Just wanted to check on financial plan. What are the benefits we can get from the raw material integration? Sure, sir. So sir, as I said, the next two to three years are years for us wherein we want to grab market share. To do that, we might have to sacrifice on our margins a little bit. But after backward integration kicking in, which is somewhere at the later end of 2027, we in 2028 should come back to normal margins, to the normal margins that you saw in FY25. So this is why backward integration is helping us. Although we will reduce our margins to grab market share, through backward integration, we will be able to gain back or maybe do something better than FY25 gradually. Okay. And other thing is, sir, as you have guided right now, for the 60K you are adding up at Dadri facility, before, you have told about 120KTs, right? Just wanted to check when we can say another 120 will be? Sir, 60 KT is something that we are adding within this quarter. And another 60 KT will be added by the Q3. So we were supposed to add 120 KT within the first half. Now, it is delayed by about two-to-three months. So second and Q3 is when we will add complete 120 KT. Okay. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Vidit Trivedi from Asian Market Securities. Please go ahead. Yeah. Hi. Most of the questions have been answered. Just wanted to know, and you have already mentioned that Dadri capacity at the moment is currently 35%. Just wanted to know, when do you expect it to contribute materially to the EBITDA? And what's the overall current share of exports? Sir, the Dadri facility is already contributing in our EBITDA and in our revenue. Even last quarter, we have done about more than 20%-25% of our revenue has come from Dadri. Although it is still less than our expectation, we want this to be ramped up quite quickly because our customer responses have been very good. But we'll see how it goes. Maybe in the second and Q3, we will see better results from Dadri. On the export front also, we did about INR 72 crores of export, which is about 7.5% of our total revenue. That's helpful, sir. Thank you. Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Jay Patel from Patel Equities. Please go ahead. Yeah. So Ghanshyam ji, my question was regarding the factoring that we are doing. So is it a recourse factoring or non-recourse factoring? Hello? Yeah. Yeah. From the payables side, it's on the recourse. And on the debtor side, it is non-recourse. Okay. So yeah. So just for the clarification, any default of the receivable would be borne by Bansal Wire, right? No, no, no, no, no, no. Sir, any debtor financing is on non-recourse basis. So any default will not be borne by Bansal Wire in terms of interest. Okay. So if we are confident of the receivables not going bad, there's non-recourse, which is high cost also. So why did we go for non-recourse? No, it is. What I said is debtor side is non-recourse, sir. Oh, okay. The cost is not higher. Cost is not higher, and that will be borne by the debtor itself. Okay. This Sanand and the backward integration that we are doing, so on the EBITDA per ton basis, how much would it be additional EBITDA that we could get from backward integration? Sir, for the steel and stainless steel project alone, we are looking at maybe INR 7,000-INR 8,000 of EBITDA per ton that will be added. On a consolidated basis also, if you look at it, we are reducing our EBITDA as per our guidance by 20% in 2026 and 2027. But this 20% will come back again from the Sanand project alone. Okay. Okay. And lastly, recently, we had been to Tire Material Conference. So how is the response of the customers? Are they willing to give us a chance? Because you see, our competition is from Bekaert and China. So how is the response? Anything you could say? Sir, the response is truly overwhelming. Our customers are today after us. It's not the other way around. We have to prove to them, and we have to submit them details on the timelines and what is happening on their various products. Most of the customer samples have already received by the customers, and we are waiting their results. Overall, it looks quite positive because, again, there's no other Indian company that manufactures it. This is the reason why we get such a positive response from the customer today. Okay. Thank you. Thank you so much. That's it from my side. Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, I request the participants to limit the question to one question per participant. The next question comes from the line of Jigar Jani from Nuvama Institutional Equities. Please go ahead. Hi, sir. Thank you for taking my question, and congratulations on what kind of numbers. My question is on the Sanand facility. I believe you guys have increased the CapEx because earlier about INR 600 crore to INR 650 crore. Just wanted to understand what led to this escalation. And also, what would be the full and optimal capacity that is on full utilization at Sanand, what kind of EBITDA? You're not very audible. Can you repeat the question? Yeah. Is this better? May I request you to use handset while asking a question? Is this better, sir? Yeah. Hello? Yeah. Yes, sir. Yeah. Yeah. So what I was asking was on the Sanand facility in Gujarat, we have increased our CapEx by about 50 crores from 600 crores to 650. Just want to understand what led to this escalation. And also, I believe on full utilization, what kind of revenue are you looking purely from the Sanand facility, and what kind of EBITDA per kg can we expect? And would the cash conversion cycles be fairly similar to what we have right now in our consolidated numbers? Yeah. That's it. Thanks. Awesome. Sanand, first thing is that we've increased our CapEx by about INR 60 crore for two reasons. One is that we are putting about 60,000 tons of wire facility, which was not the plan earlier. This is for stainless steel and low carbon wire. Second is, even in the equipment selection, we have tried to select such equipment that after some de-bottlenecking, we can increase our capacity from 1.8 lakhs to 2.5 lakhs very quickly. This is the reason for higher CapEx. Coming to EBITDA and revenues, of course, Sanand being completely backward integration for 1.8 lakh tons will not reflect on our revenue because we will, at the end of the day, consume the whole product that is coming out of Sanand. From 1.8 lakh tons, what we are looking at is maybe INR 7-INR 8 of EBITDA per ton it will add. Okay, so this 1.8 lakh tons is just the backward. Sorry to interrupt. May I request? No worries. I'll join back in a bit. Thank you. Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Prakash from Anand Rathi. Please go ahead. Hello. Yeah. Thanks for the opportunity. I just wanted to check over the volumes for the Q2, and what about the EBITDA margin and EBITDA per ton for the Q2? You mean for the upcoming quarter, sir? Yeah. For the upcoming quarter, yeah. So, sir, as I said, 30% volume growth is what we are targeting for the complete year. EBITDA also, we are looking at a 10% increase in our EBITDA. Of course, this remains very dynamic because we are on a journey where we have to grab a higher market share. So I expect this and the next year to be a little tough on our margins. Of course, we are already taking steps by backward integrating and by introducing specialty wire vertical to get back on our margins and actually improve further. But a quarter-wise guidance would be not possible at the moment. On a blended basis, anything, sir? What we can expect overhead? On a blended basis, we have already done about 104,000 tons of volume this quarter. This should only increase. Q1 being a lean quarter, we should see better results each and every quarter from here on. Onto EBITDA per ton. That much we're sure. EBITDA per ton? Sir, EBITDA per ton, as I said, we are looking at a 10% increase in absolute EBITDA. So maybe INR 6.5 a kg is the EBITDA per ton that we are looking at. We are at about 7.2 already in Q1. Okay. Thank you, sir. Thank you. Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Shweta Dixit from Systematix Group. Please go ahead. Hi. Thank you. Kind of just to reinforce clarity, when you said that you see a 20% decline in EBITDA margin, is this what you said, or did I miss something here? No, that is absolutely right, ma'am. By increasing market share within 26 and 27, we are taking provisions of taking about 20% decrease in our margins. Of course, this 20% is not actually just a decrease. It is also a difference of product mix. For example, in Q1, we have already done about INR 70-INR 100 a ton, wherein it was only a change in product mix that we have taken and not much reduction in margin to increase this market share. Okay, so kind of my question is that when we connected last quarter, your indication was around a 10% drop in EBITDA per ton for the next year, and then it would recover slightly in FY27 and then back in FY28. But now, if you guide for an EBITDA per ton reduction of 20%, what is changing on a Q1, Q2 basis that you see? No, ma'am. There is no change here. In the last quarter also, I guided you for a 10% increase in EBITDA, which is the current guidance that I'm giving you today as well. In terms of EBITDA per ton, there will be a 10% decrease straightaway in margin and 10% decrease because of product mix that you might see on a blended basis. Okay. As I said earlier, 30% is the volume growth that we are targeting this year, and 10% is the EBITDA growth that we are targeting this year. This remains on track. If you look only at Q1, we have done a little better. Again, I do not want to commit specifically on the second or Q3 because it could change. There could be a little bit of an up and down because of grabbing a higher market share. Okay. Understood. And lastly, Dadri capacity was at 35% utilization. Ma'am, sorry to interrupt. May I request you to come in the question queue for a follow-up question? Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Somil Mehta from Kotak Mutual Fund. Please go ahead. Yeah. Thanks for the follow-up. Sorry. This EBITDA per ton, which is about 7.2, which has been the range of seven, seven and a half, should we see that number improving in 2027, or it will be more of 2027, 2028? Sir, I would say 28 would be a better year for you to see improvements here because backward integration will kick in at a later end of the FY27, but again, one or two months here and there, and it might reduce, so 28 would be a better year for you to see EBITDA improving. So just to understand, this current year would be more like closer to INR 600 since there will be a decline. Next year, we'll go again back to INR 7-INR 7.5, which is what we are reporting. And then 2027, 2028, we should see an improvement from those couples. Yes. Absolutely. Okay. This is only with backward integration. With specialty wire numbers coming in, they should increase further. For sure. For sure. Thanks for the clarification, brother. Thank you. Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Mayank Bhandari from Asian Market Securities. Please go ahead. Just wanted to understand on LRPC wires. I think I alluded to that you're in the process of getting the certification for the same, and volumes will start kicking in. So could you please give some color on that? And also, how is the market doing for LRPC? Sure, sir. So we have gotten some approvals. We are still waiting on BIS certification to start a majority of our suppliers, which should be coming in maybe anytime now within this month or next month, after which we will see a better utilization level. In terms of the market for LRPC right now, we see a sluggish demand because there is excess capacity. So margins have reduced substantially. But of course, this is, again, a product on which we are not very dependent on. And most of the equipment used for LRPC is also fungible. So even today, we are utilizing that capacity to make other high carbon wires. What kind of margin do they make in LRPC? LRPC, our expectation was about INR 5 a kg kind of an EBITDA. Currently, it is a little lower than that. It is about INR 2.5-INR 3 a kg today, looking at the market price, but this should hopefully improve further. Okay. And, sir, one more thing. I'm just checking your 30% volume growth guidance on last year, 344,000 ton volume. It gives me a capacity utilization of almost 60%-65%. So isn't it a bit conservative given that we are expanding a lot? So I mean, our capacity seems to be expanding at a much faster rate given the growth we are targeting. Utilization remains lower than what we anticipate. Sure, sir. So as a company, we have always been at about 85%-90% kind of a capacity utilization. I understand last year was low because of the Dadri facility, which has doubled our production. So this is one of kind of a case where we are doubling our production within a year. Therefore, you see a lower capacity utilization. This year, one of the reasons for us to also delay a 60,000-ton CapEx by about one quarter is so that we've always maintained a decent level of capacity utilization so that we do not take our hit on margins because of additional costs. So which is a mix that we will keep on following gradually over the quarters. Utilization will be optimal? I mean, how much optimal utilization you project in 27 then for 27? Sir, for our company, the optimum capacity utilization is always more than 80%. 85%-90% is the right number for us. This is when we get the best margin and best utilization. So we would want to operate at the same pace. But again, because of the substantial increase that we are targeting every quarter, there could be a quarter wherein capacity utilization is lower, and the next quarter, we add more capacities and more volumes. But I think, sir, 85% utilization means you are growing by more than 40%, I guess. Okay. Fine. Thank you, sir. Thank you. Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, we'll take this as the last question for today. I would now like to hand the conference over to Mr. Parthiv Jhonsa, sir, for closing comments. Thank you all for joining us for the conference call today. We at Anand Rathi would like to thank the management of Bansal Wire Industries Limited for giving us this opportunity. This concludes this conference. Thank you, everyone. Have a good day. Thank you. On behalf of Anand Rathi Share and Stock Brokers Limited, that concludes this conference. Thank you all for joining us, and you may now disconnect your lines.