Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to the Q3 FY 2025 Earnings Conference Call of Container Corporation of India Limited, hosted by DAM Capital Advisors Limited. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listen-only mode, and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during the conference call, please signal an operator by pressing star then zero on your touch-tone phone. Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Ms. Bhoomika Nair from DAM Capital Advisors Limited. Thank you, and over to you, ma'am. Thanks, Ruja. Good morning, everyone, and a warm welcome to the Q3 2025 Earnings Call of Container Corporation of India. We have the management being represented by Mr. Sanjay Swarup, Chairman and Managing Director, and his entire team. I'll now hand over the floor to Mr. Swarup for his initial remarks, post which we'll open up the floor for Q&A. Thank you, and over to you, sir. Good morning to all. I am joined by my directors. Director of Projects, Mr. Ajit Kumar Panda; Director of Domestic, Mr. Azhar Shams; Director of International Marketing and Operations, Mr. Priya Ranjan Parhi; and Director of Finance, Mr. Anurag Kapil. So I just would like to make some opening remarks, and then we can open for questions. I'm happy to inform that there has been a throughput growth of 7.8% in the nine-month period ending on December 31st, 2024, in which EXIM registered a growth of 5%, and domestic stream registered a growth of 7.8%. This is in conformity with India's international trade, in which exports have registered a growth of 1.6% to $327.7 billion, and imports registered a growth of 5.1%, that is $532.48 billion year-on-year. In Q3, our company registered a growth of 11.6% over the corresponding period of last financial year, which included EXIM growth of 8% and domestic growth of 24.7%. This has been due to, in spite of supply chain disruptions at international level, due to the various geopolitical reasons of which you are very much familiar. I am further happy to inform that we gained in EXIM market share also in pan-India basis by 73 basis points. In Mundra Port, we gained market share by 180 basis points, and at Pipavav Port, we gained market share by 278 basis points. This is despite our increasing the rail freight margin also. We did not sacrifice on any margins while gaining the market share. Our rail freight margin increased by 15 basis points year-on-year from 25.61% to 25.76%. Operating margin was flat, same year-on-year, more than 30%. The reasons for increase in market share is customer centricity that is being observed by all the officials of the company. Customers have repose faith in our company. And secondly, due to the operational excellence of Team CONCOR. Further, we had operating income growth of 4.23% and PAT growth of 3.6% despite challenges on geopolitical front. We also registered a growth of 11.25% in double-stack rakes. Last year, we did 4,142 double-stack rakes in the nine months, and this year we have done 4,608 double-stack rakes. For catering to our demand, which is increasing day by day, we have added infrastructure. In the nine months, we have commissioned four rakes. Now our total fleet stands at 382 as of December 31st. We procured 6,868 containers, and now our total fleet of containers in domestic stream owned by us is 51,236 containers. Then yesterday, Board of Directors deliberated the various demands which we are catering and future demand, which is very, very robust. And seeing into the demand, Board of Directors have decided that we will increase our CapEx by 40%. It was CapEx budget for this financial year INR 610 crores, out of which already INR 444 crores we have achieved. Now we have revised it upward 40% to INR 855 crores that we will be spending by this year end. And the company is going for a massive infrastructure creation. I'm happy to inform that by 2028, that is three years from now, we will be having 80 terminals, we will be having 500+ rakes, ownership by CONCOR, and we will be having around 70,000 container fleets. So this will be a massive infrastructure upgradation, which we are doing, keeping in the demand in the market. A lot of demand is there. We have to meet the demand, and the outlook is quite bullish by the company. I'm also happy to inform that we have declared an interim dividend of INR 4.25 on share of par value of INR 5. Till now, we have declared total interim dividend of INR 9.50, which is 190% of the par value here. As you are very well aware that the businesses in the logistics are deeply impacted by challenging geopolitical scenarios. There is international supply chain is adversely affected, erratic vessel schedules, there are congestion at transshipment ports. All these factors had led to a small dip in the month of December, and now it has fully recovered. In the current quarter, we are experiencing a double-digit growth. Even then, in the nine months, we have registered handsome growth in exports and imports. Exports in RMG, ready-made garments, increased by 92%. Export of auto parts increased by 21%. Export of food items 22%. Paper products 20%. Fabrics 37%. In imports, auto parts increased by 34% and raw cotton increased by 77%. Rail services, we have started export reefer containers from Sonipat to JNPT, and in which we have already done 442 TEUs of movement. One more thing is that we have brought Nhava Sheva on double-stack for North India. We are running double-stack rakes up to MMLP Varnama, which is near Baroda, just 400 km short of JNPT. Even DFC has not been commissioned up to JNPT, which will be likely to be commissioned by December 2025. We have already given the benefit of impact to our North India customers, and it's getting a very good response. From December, we have started these services, and we are ramping up very good volume in this stream. One more thing is that we have started new rail services at Gangavaram Port, which is in Andhra Pradesh, and already we have done 700 TEUs on Gangavaram Port. Focus area for the company remains customer centricity, total logistics solution to customers, business solutions, and green and sustainable logistics, which is a key focus area for the company towards fulfilling of our ESG norms. New initiatives which will be growth drivers in the coming months will be the very big growth drivers. It will be the bulk cement and tank containers. We are procuring 1,000 tank containers. Sorry to interrupt, sir. We just got a new call. So there is a lot of disturbance from the line. Hello? Yes. Are you able to hear me? I am able to hear you, but the disturbance is still there. Yes, a lot of disturbance is there. Ladies and gentlemen, please hold the line while we check the connection for the management. Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for patiently holding your lines. We have the management line reconnected back. Over to you, sir. Hello. I hope you have heard my previous whatever I have told about the opening remarks. Yes, sir. That was audible. Okay. Now, just I will take one more minute. The new initiative, which will be the growth drivers for the company in the coming months, will be bulk cement and tank containers, and we are procuring 1,000 tank containers. From yesterday, we have started receiving the supply of tank containers from our sister PSU, Braithwaite, and they have started supplying tank containers to us. In the coming months, this will be a very big growth driver in the domestic stream. Even our customers are eagerly waiting for this. Second will be double-stack to JNPT that I already told on DFC. We have signed various long-term agreements with our corporate customers and shipping lines, which will further push up our volumes. We have rice exports, which is quite robust now. So we are getting very good demand, very good volumes in EXIM and domestic both, and we are on the correct track to achieve the historic 5 million TEUs handling target that we will be having in this financial year. I am quite confident that we will be able to achieve 5 million TEUs, which will be the landmark for the company. First time we will be achieving that target. So this is all opening remarks from me. Now you can put up questions. Thank you very much. Ladies and gentlemen, we will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on the touch-tone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and two. Participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. The first question is from the line of Amit Dixit from ICICI Securities. Please go ahead. Yeah, hi. Good morning, everyone, and thanks for the opportunity. I have a couple of questions. The first one is on the CapEx. So while you highlighted that we will have 80 terminals, 500 rakes, 70,000 containers, is it possible to let us know a cumulative CapEx number till FY 2028, FY 2026, 2027, 2027 if I add all these? And this INR 855 crores revised budget, now we have already spent INR 440 crores, and just two months are remaining in the year. So are you confident that we will spend this entire amount or something will flow through in FY 2026? That is the first question. Now, actually, I am giving you an estimate about this financial year that will be INR 855 crores. All I can say is for the next three years also in the same range we will be spending. If you remember some four, five years back, we used to spend INR 1,000 crores every year. So figure will be remaining around this number. Exact number is not possible to give at this stage. Secondly, as I told you, INR 444 crores we have spent only till December 31st, and January is already now getting over. So that number I have already not told you. So for this quarter, we will be spending the remaining amount. We are quite confident. That is why we have revised the budget. We are quite confident of spending that much amount. Okay, sir. The second question is essentially on the growth. So given that January is already behind us and you mentioned that in January you have seen certain growth uptake, so what kind of volume growth can we expect in Q4 in both domestic and EXIM side? At this stage, I would not like to give any number, but all I can say is both EXIM and domestic. Domestic, of course, has done very well. They are experiencing double-digit growth, but EXIM is also having double-digit growth in the month of January, which I am quite confident is likely to continue up to March. I will not like to give any number at this stage. Okay, okay, sir. Got it. Thank you so much. All the best. I'll come back in the queue. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Lavina Quadros from Jefferies. Please go ahead. Yeah, hi, sir. So I just wanted to understand two or three things. Your depreciation is lower by INR 80 crores approximate run rate. INR 25 crores, I understand, is because of the depreciation policy change. What about the balance INR 50 crores? Is it a sustainable reduction because of a quarterly basis? Secondly, your realization in EXIM was down about 10%, right? I know you addressed it a little bit, but just a little more color there, please. Realization because of the actually volumes were down that I told you because of supply chain disruptions were there in the international movements because of geopolitical reasons. That is why we could not do very well in EXIM in this Q3. But now everything is back to normal, and in fact, we are getting very good volumes in EXIM. So for depreciation, I will request my ED Finance. He will explain the details. Yeah, good morning. You said that depreciation has come down by INR 25 crores. That is correct. This is for the quarter this reduction is there, but if you see for the period, the impact of the change in the age of our useful life of our wagon, the impact is INR 79 crores. So effectively, our wagon depreciation for the current quarter is INR 12.5 crores, and for the period, it is INR 36.7 crores. So this is the clarification. So you're effectively saying I should look at the nine-month depreciation trend, not focus so much on the quarter, right, for the trend ahead? Yes. Yes, yes. That's the way to look at it. Okay, just. Yes, and it's clearly stated in the note also. So if you see the note to the results, that has been clarified, the impact in the quarter as well as in the period. Understood. And sir, just one more thing on this realization. Would it be fair to say that because volumes were weak, maybe some benefits, some pricing changes were made, which should therefore be corrected as volumes gradually pick up ahead? Would that be fair to say? No, no, no. We have not done any pricing change. Normally, whatever prices we declare, we keep it stable. We frequently don't go for pricing change. So pricing changes were not done. It was purely as a result of volumes. Okay. And sir, lastly, if you ex- out DFC, right, I mean, if I look at a three- to five-year period, what do you think is the volume growth that you could see without DFC organically, and would that be different once JNPT connects? If I look out three to five years. Actually, whenever we make our assessment for the forecast, what will be for three to five years, we have to take DFC into the picture. Without DFC, making a forecast will not be realistic because DFC is coming in one year. So realistic forecasts can only be made if we take DFC into the picture. So with DFC, it's a very good volume growth. Numbers I cannot share right now. But all I can say is that the future is very good, and we have been talking to trade. Even running double-stack up to Varnama is giving us a very good response, and trains are reaching quite quickly, and double-stacking and evacuation from port is also very fast. So these benefits are going, we are seeing the benefits. If Nhava Sheva also gets connected on DFC and with the PSA second terminal also coming up, it will have a capacity of 10 million TEUs. Nhava Sheva can handle 10 million TEUs now. So there is very good growth expected in the coming months. Okay, sir. Thank you. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Koustav Bubna from BMSPL Capital. Please go ahead. Yeah, hi. Thank you for taking my question. So my question was regarding the DFC only. So could you explain to me a little bit about in how much of a detail you can provide in data points of your knowledge about the market opportunity that's opening up for your company as the DFC becomes operational over the next couple of years? DFC is going to be a game changer. I will just give you some data. Like Mundra Port, when it is now connected to DFC and feeder route, and our Dadri terminal also is connected to DFC. Now, from Dadri to Mundra Port, there is a distance of 1,200 km. Road is taking 55 hours to send one container from Dadri to Mundra Port. Whereas DFC, as a result of DFC, we are running timetable trains, which are called Freight Express. We are able to send the container in 38 hours from Dadri to Mundra Port. So containers are catching their schedule, and it is very fast, and we have tweaked our rates also. We are giving some commercial benefits to customers. So as a result of operational as well as commercial benefits, there is a sizable shift, almost 11%-15% shift from road to rail between Dadri and Mundra Port. Now, when Nhava Sheva also gets connected on DFC, which is approximately 1,500 kilometers from Delhi, that will be a game changer in logistics. As for the National Rail Plan also, which was done by Indian Railways, they are expecting a rail coefficient of almost 40%-45%, which is at present 18%-19% at Nhava Sheva. So it is going to be a game changer in the field of logistics. Our company is also going to derive a lot of benefit from that because we have already commissioned five MMLPs, four MMLPs on DFC. Fifth one is under commissioning. So all these five MMLPs will cater to the growing demand in hinterland, and we will be running timetable trains in collaboration with DFC and Indian Railways, connecting our MMLPs to Nhava Sheva. So, because this predictability and transit assurance, this is a very big thing in logistics. Once it is given to customers, then we are expecting a very good shift from road to rail. Excellent. Thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Bhoomika Nair from DAM Capital Advisors. Please go ahead. Yes, sir, so if you could just share first the originating volumes for the quarter? Yeah, okay. Originating volume in EXIM was 975,243 TEUs, domestic 309,551 TEUs, total 1,284,794 TEUs. Sorry, this is handling. And originating is EXIM 525,812, domestic 117,644, and total 643,456 TEUs. Right. Now, so just to understand this drop in realization, while obviously volumes have been a bit of a challenge, particularly in EXIM, but the realization drop has got to do with some mix change, the distances falling, or exactly what has driven this decline in the realization? Because you said there has not been really any drop or any changes in our pricing strategy per se. The only reason is drop in volumes, and there is no other reason that comes to my mind because lead is also our lead in EXIM. There is a slight dip in nine months. It has come down from 708 km to 704 km. Only 4 km dip is there. Not much dip is there in the lead. So only the reason is drop in volumes. Okay, okay. So in terms of the overall, as we move ahead in terms of the volume pickup, you said that January has seen an uptake in terms of volumes. Now, for the full year, we were already looking at a much sharper growth. Will this now be kind of toned down, and what is your outlook, especially from FY 2026 perspective, that we could look at? FY 2025, I will not like to give any further guidance because now only one quarter is remaining. And whatever we were expecting because of the geopolitical disturbances, we could not reach that number in EXIM. In domestic, of course, we will be reaching that number. But FY 2026, let us wait for two, three months more. I will give you guidance in my next call. Sure. So sir, I mean, are we seeing an improvement in the overall EXIM cycle, and do you think growth can come back out here, and particularly, the road-rail share had gone adverse a little bit. Have we started to now start seeing volumes come back to rail in general? Yes, yes, sir. We are seeing a very good growth in EXIM also and domestic also. And there is a lot of demand, which is there in the market, and very robust growth we are expecting. That is why, keeping all these things in mind, the board of directors had decided that we will increase our CapEx spend now. And I think we will be able to sustain around this number only for the next two, three years. There is a lot of demand in the market. Sure. Sir, and lastly, may I have the MT running for both EXIM and domestic, please, for the quarter? Yeah, for the quarter. You want or for this nine-month period? Anything will do, sir. Yeah, nine-month period. EXIM was INR 89.70 crore. Domestic was INR 220.92 crore. Total INR 310.61 crore. Great, sir. Thanks so much. I'll come back and review. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Achal Lohade from Nuvama Wealth. Please go ahead. Yeah, good morning, sir. Thank you for the opportunity. Sir, can you help us with the market share port-wise, please? Yes, market share at JNPT, our market share is 58%. At Mundra Port, it is 38%. At Pipavav, it is 48%. Is it possible to get the market share for this? Is nine-month, I presume, right, sir? Or this is for the third quarter? This is for nine-month period. Nine months, okay. Okay. And in terms of the port mix, if you could help us with? Okay, that volume that we are getting from port? Yes, yes. Okay, JNPT, we are getting 33%. Mundra Port, 38%. Pipavav, 10%. Visakhapatnam, 5.5%. Chennai, 3.8%. Vallarpadam, 4.5%. I think that should be enough. Almost 95%, I have told. Understood. Sir, if I put the originating volume along with the revenue number, the segment revenue, I see that the realization for domestic has gone up from 56,000 to 69,000 quarter -on -quarter. Can you help us understand what has driven this? Is there a significant change in terms of the mix or anything, sir? Basically, it is because of the reduction in MT running in domestic. We are getting very good circuits and traffic on both the sides. And our domestic team has worked very hard. And one very good initiative that we took was the containers which were coming running empty in empty direction. We have given very competitive rates so that at least we get some money. So all these steps have really given excellent results, and you can see the realization gaining in domestic. Right. Sir, just one question, if I may. Overall market share, would you have what was it in 2Q and what is it in 3Q, sir? Overall market share on the CTO basis, overall rail volume and. I got it. I have a nine-month period I can give. Yes. Quarterly, I don't have. Nine months period? Yeah, nine-month period, I can give our EXIM market share is 55.28%. And domestic, it is 58%. Total, 56%. Understood. And just last question, if I may, sir. You mentioned about Varnama, you started the train from JNPT. Is it possible to get some sense in terms of what is the benefit in terms of the operational side and the financial side? What kind of price reduction or cost reduction one can look at? See, it has both the benefits, operational as well as commercial. I will tell you in brief. Mundra Port, sorry, Dadri, from where we are running the service and Kathuwas. These are the two MMLPs in North India from where we are running double-stack service to Varnama. From there, if we run on double-stack, then the speed, which is because up to DFC, up to Varnama, it is going on DFC, which is giving a very good speed to us. And almost in Indian Railways, we are getting a speed of around 20 kms per hour. Whereas from Dadri to Varnama, if we run on DFC, then we get a speed of average speed of 65kms-70 kms per hour, which is almost three times speed. So it is taking one-third of the time in reaching Varnama. At Varnama, we split into two, and this double-stack is made single-stack. Our train up to Nhava Sheva for the last 400 km of the journey. So it is giving us the benefit in terms of transit time, number one. Number two, commercially also, we have not revised our tariff till now. So we just started in the month of December. So we have not revised our tariff. But because on the upper deck, we have to pay 50% of rail haulage to Indian Railways, so it is making a positive contribution towards my bottom line at present. Understood. And sorry, one more question, sir. Is it possible to get a sense as to how much of the JNPT volume is destined for North India and how much of that is going on rail? See, at this moment, it will not be possible for me to elaborate on this question, but I can answer you separately afterwards. Sure, sir. Thank you. I'll call back in the queue for follow-up. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Mukesh Saraf from Avendus Spark. Please go ahead. Yes, sir, good afternoon, and thank you for the opportunity. So you mentioned about the rail coefficients in this quarter, and what I see is it has largely stayed the same over the last few quarters, and when I look at the port volumes, the container volume for, let's say, Mundra or JNPT, it is up double-digit in this quarter as well. It's up 10% or so, but our originating volumes are flat this quarter, so just trying to understand, our originating volumes are flat, but the port volumes are up, and the rail coefficients are flat. This either points out to a market share loss, but you're clearly saying that you've gained market share or you kept it flat, so could you help understand the relationship between these three data points, sir? Yeah, actually, you are not comparing the corresponding data. The rail coefficient numbers that I told you, that are not for the quarter. That are for the nine-month period. And market share also, I am telling you for the nine-month period. And there has been a drop in volumes in the third quarter only. If you see nine-month period, our volumes, in fact, have increased. And so yeah, that is the reason. So if I look at, I mean, obviously, you're not given this quarter numbers, but this quarter, probably there would have been a drop in market share, sir, then? Not exactly, because actually volumes were in this quarter, the volumes were not very good. So everybody has experienced a drop, not only CONCOR. So market share drop is not there in this quarter. Okay. There's a rail coefficient drop in this quarter, basically? No, no. The inverted support also comes down. Can I look at? Inverted support will also come down. Okay, okay. All right, sir. I'll probably try and ask this question later on so that I'll be able to understand that. Separately, yeah, separately because we had discussion quite detailed. Sure. Thanks a lot, sir. That's it from my side. Thank you. Okay. Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, to ask a question, you may press star and one now. The next question is from the line of Sumit Kishore from Axis Capital. Please go ahead. Good afternoon, sir. Over the past three quarters, we have been listening to your commentary around drivers of volume growth around the Varnama double-stack trains, NCR to Varnama. We have been hearing about the transportation of cement and tank containers and the pickup in rice exports. So exactly how much volume in these three buckets are you likely to clock or expect to clock? Could you give us some sense in terms of TEUs in these three categories would be very useful. Say over the next one, yeah. At this moment, I don't have the numbers with me. I can share with you separately. Thank you so much. Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, you may press star and one to ask a question now. The next question is from the line of Achal Lohade from Nuvama Wealth. Please go ahead. Sir, can you help us with the rail coefficient for each of the ports? Already I have told you in the earlier question. The port mix, I think you had said, sir. I can tell you at JNPT, the rail coefficient you want, okay? Rail coefficient at JNPT in nine-month period was 15.7%. Mundra Port, it was 24%. And Pipavav Port, it was 58%. Understood. And how about the land license fee? Because I remember last quarter we had some reversal. That's why the number was lower. This quarter, the number is a little higher QOQ, but it is still lower than what it was last year. So if you could help us, what is the number as an expense we can look at as a land license fee expense in the P&L for full year FY 2025, sir? See, land license fees, as I told you, for the terminals that we are operating on railways, it is increasing 7% every year. But we are taking steps, and whatever terminals are not useful to us, we are surrendering. So that is stabilized with the railways. There is no issue on that. So it will be around the same in the same direction it will move. Like 7% increase, and maybe it may not increase every year also. Like in this, you have seen from INR 287 crore, I think it has gone to INR 262 crore. It has reduced in this financial year. [crosstalk]. For the quarterly, Q1, Q2, December quarter, 2023, it was INR 71.95 crore. And in the current quarter, we have booked INR 89.42 crore. The adjustment, whatever we did earlier in the current financial year, this quarter there has not been any adjustment. So is it fair to say that this is the run rate one could expect and see a 7% acceleration? This is the trajectory in which we are going. We hope to close by INR 350 crore in the current financial year. Right. But in the next financial year, there will be 7% escalation to that, right? We are looking at some surrenders, some adjustments. So let us see. Right now, yes, 7% growth will be there in the next financial year. But still, we want to contend that. So we are looking at some other options. So far, they have not materialized. But if they materialize, we may have a little less growth next year. But 350 for this year, you can take. Understood. Any update on the TKD? We were looking at switching under Gati Shakti policy. That, so far, is a discussion stage only. That discussion has not concluded with Ministry of Railways. So right now, we are paying the LLF. But we have surrendered 60.10% land. So that surrendered part, we are not paying. So we have contained that expenditure by surrendering partially from 1/4/2024. And as we go forward, we'll look at alternatives. It's a dynamic thing. Every year, there will be some small developments in some place. So that way, and we are trying to contain that expenditure as much as possible. Understood. And just last one, in terms of the volume of our total existing volume, let's say if I were to ask on our originating volume basis, how much would currently be in the regions where the DFC is going to be operating in, like the northwest pocket? You mean to Mundra, Pipavav, and Paradip, Nhava Sheva? How much volume we are doing? No, no. So of the northwest volumes, which is NCR, Punjab, part of Rajasthan, etc., which would potentially be catered by DFC once it is fully operational, how much volume? Okay, okay. What kind of volume we are doing right now out of our total volume? Is it 50%? Is it 60%? 40%? It is around 60%. 60% of our volumes are from these areas. Have I understood right, sir? 55%-60%, yes. 55%-60%. Understood. Understood. And if you could comment, sir, in terms of specifically Ludhiana, Punjab market, or NCR market, how the demand is shaping up? You give some numbers with respect to imports and exports commodity-wise. But broadly, are you seeing a pickup in terms of the inquiries, etc., from these particular pockets, or things are still weak? No, no. This is actually the demand is already there. A lot of demand is there in imports. A lot of demand is there in exports. There is a continuous exercise. And it is actually international trade dynamics. When, suppose, for example, iron scrap rates, suppose internationally they increase, then iron scrap imports will come down. After some time, it is a cyclical thing. After some time, international rates become less, it becomes competitive. So iron scrap imports will increase. So these are the market dynamics. All of you guys are very well aware. So at present, that I was telling you in the opening remarks, we are getting very good demand at all the places. Around the country, we are having the demand in domestic existing growth. So that is a general statement I was making. Across the country, in all the sectors, there is a very robust demand now. Got it. And just a clarification, the 4Q double-digit growth, are you also meaning on the originating basis or just the handling basis, sir? And was it an aggregate or just the EXIM part? Both. 4Q volume growth, you said double-digit in your opening remarks. Yes, 4Q. 4Q FY 2025. It is both. Okay. Yes. Originating as well as handling on an aggregate basis, right, sir? Correct. Okay. All right, sir. Thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Akash Mehta from Canara HSBC Life. Please go ahead. Hi. Thank you for taking my question. So basically, I just wanted to check in terms of if the geopolitical issues kind of get resolved to some extent, what kind of growth we could see in terms of EXIM? And are you seeing anything, I mean, in the near term that is happening on that front? So yeah. See, geopolitical, if it is stabilized, then it will be very good because the vessel schedules, which are quite erratic now, and sometimes vessels will stop coming, then after some months, suddenly a lot of vessels will be coming. So all these things, uncertainties will be over, and vessels will be running as per schedule. Secondly, for catering to the same volume of traffic, less equipment will be required because now transit time is more. So more equipment has to be deployed by shipping lines. Then thirdly, there will be a correction in the ocean freight also because now they have to take a longer route, and when the geopolitical issues are resolved, then they don't have to take that long route. So they will charge less. So there will be very good growth in the market. How much growth? It is very difficult to predict. When it will be resolved, that also I cannot predict right now. It is dependent on so many factors. Sure. That's it from my side. Thank you. Mr. Mehta, does that answer your question? Yes, yes. Thank you. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Priyankar Biswas from BNP Paribas. Please go ahead. Thanks, sir. Most of the questions are answered. Just one follow-up question here. So since we were discussing Gati Shakti in that, so if some of the key terminals were to shift to Gati Shakti, so can you just quantify for us how much can be the LLF-linked savings, especially particularly ticketing was there? That's all I have to ask. See, at present, our management has taken a decision that we will not be going for that option because there is a lot of uncertainty involved. If brownfield terminals are migrating to Gati Shakti, then there is a big element of uncertainty. So we have decided that we will not be using that facility provided by Indian Railways. But for greenfield projects, we are going for Gati Shakti only. Sir, what's the competitive intensity in these Gati Shakti bids? I mean, what sort of TSE shares people are typically bidding? If you can shed some light. What is your question? What is the TSE? Can you please repeat the question? What is the TSE share that people are bidding in these Gati Shakti projects? If you can share some light. Is the bid's accuracy valid? Yeah. It depends on the terminal where they are getting catered. I cannot speculate how much they will be bidding. That is not within my ambit of discussion. Okay, sir. Thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Prateek Maheshwari from Treeline Advisors. Please go ahead. Hi. Thank you. Actually, I had two questions, but I have another one just to clarify. You said we are not going with the Gati Shakti bidding process for Tughlakabad and the other terminals which we have on the railway line. Is that right? Yes. The brownfield projects. For the brownfield projects. I see. Okay. And also on the EBITDA, if I just look at the EBITDA levels for this quarter, right? If I understand correctly, if I look at EBITDA per ton, excluding the other income, it looks like it's dropped by almost 18%-19% year -over -year. So just trying to understand what has happened because I understand lead distances have not come down, pricing has not come down. So any light on that? What number are you talking? EBITDA per ton? Yes. Just looking at our EBITDA per ton overall. EBITDA per TEU or EBITDA per ton? Sorry, sorry. EBITDA per TEU. My bad. Sorry. EBITDA per TEU you have calculated. Okay, okay. Yes, yes, yes. You have taken originating TEU or the handling? It's only handling volumes. Handling volumes. No, you should take the originating volume, actually. That is a clear indicator because handling, if we do double stack, then the same containers will handle two times. So I will request you to take the originating numbers. Then it will not be so much drop. I see. Okay. And just one final question, if I may. So on the depreciation front, right? I think this was already asked earlier. But just to clarify, I think if I understand correctly, depreciation this quarter was about INR 86 crores. And I think last quarter it was about INR 166 crores. And I understand that INR 25 crore drop can be explained by that wagon life extension thing. But I didn't really understand the explanation that you gave earlier. So if you could please clarify again, that would be really helpful. Thank you. Yeah. If you see, what we are requesting is that in this financial year, this calculation of life of wagon, there was some anomaly, and the anomaly has been removed. It has been brought in line with the actual life of the wagon that are being used in the railway system. So now you should see the depreciation figure for the nine-month period, not the quarter period. Because once the adjustment has been done for the full year, the booking may look a little more in the first two quarters and less in the third quarter. But if you add all the three, then the correct picture emerges. There will be a drop in the depreciation figure for the nine-month period. So you kindly see the nine-month period. Oh, I see. I see. Understood. Okay. Perfect. Thank you very much. Thank you. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Vaibhav Shah from JM Financial. Please go ahead. Yeah. So just to continue on the depreciation part, so if you look at the nine-month period, it is INR 408 crores. So going forward, quarterly number should be INR 130 crores, INR 140 crores per quarter? Yes. Like that. Yes. And so secondly, if you look at the volume growth in domestic, in terms of handling volume, it is 25% up. While in terms of the originating volume, it is only 7% growth. So there is a sharp increase in the handling factor on the domestic side. So what could be the reason for that? Or is it just a sharp variation in the growth numbers? My Director. I will request my Director, Domestic, to explain. Actually, in handling, some of the containers' volume we have taken from our PFT, whatever PFT rakes we are handling, we have taken those volume also. So that is the reason that the handling figure has gone up very sharply, and the originating is only TEU volume, whatever we are doing. That is the main reason. You know that at Paradeep, we are handling around 50-60 rakes for railway wagons, and at other PFTs also, we are handling one or two rakes. So that rake we charge when access charges and then handling charges also. So we have been adding those volume. So that is the reason, basically. So for Q4, the growth, if you look at the originating, the handling growth in Q3 is 25%. So if we assume that a similar growth comes in Q4, so the difference of the perception Q4 as well on the originating side, or it will minimize? No, no. Actually, originating, we are going to increase from 7% what has been there to keeping in the volume and all those things. The originating volume will increase. Now the handling volume will depend on how many rakes we handle in our PFT location. That is the theory. This quarter, the number has been quite good. So that's why our handling number has gone up to 24. It may come down also, and it may increase also, keeping in view the number of the railway rakes we handle at Paradeep and then Kathuwas and all those PFT locations. Okay. Okay, sir. So lastly, if you want to look at the Q4 numbers, so in terms of volumes, so if we are guiding for a 10% growth in terms of a double-digit growth in terms of EXIM, so it should be both in EXIM originating and handling as well. Assuming a similar handling factor would be there. Exactly. Exactly. Exactly. And similar could be the case for domestic as well? In domestic. Just for the originating part? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Actually, domestic in originating and handling, both will be double-digit only. We are quite confident on that. Okay. Okay. Thank you, sir. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Amit Dixit from ICICI Securities. Please go ahead. Now, sir, just one follow-up question, if I may. Now, since this particular quarter's numbers and segment have been adjusted with the depreciation, is it possible to give the unadjusted EBIT number segment-wise for this quarter? See, but why do we want those numbers? These are the actual numbers which have been approved by CAG auditor. Why do we want? Comparison purpose. Because these numbers are not comparable with the earlier numbers. No, but we give only one set of numbers. We don't give two sets of numbers. In the nine-month period, it's there now. We give only one set of numbers which have been approved by our auditors. We don't give two, three sets of numbers for your analysis. Sorry. Okay. Okay. No problem. All right. Yes. Thank you. Participants who wish to ask a question may press star and one. The next question is from the line of Sandeep Shetty from HSBC. Please go ahead. I'm audible? I'm audible? Yes, yes. Yes, please. Thank you, sir. All my questions have been answered. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, to ask a question, you may press star and one. The next question is from the line of Bhoomika Nair from DAM Capital. Please go ahead. Yes, sir. Sir, just one data point that I just wanted was the lead distance for the domestic side, if I could get that, please. Yeah. For domestic, for nine-month period, lead distance was 1317 km. Okay. Okay. Great, sir. So I think there's no more questions in the queue, so we can end the call. Thank you so much to all the participants and the management for giving us an opportunity to host the call. Wishing you all the very best, sir. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you very much, Bhoomika. Thank you. On behalf of DAM Capital Advisors Limited, that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us, and you may now disconnect your lines. Thank you.