Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to Data Patterns India Limited Q4 FY24 earnings conference call, hosted by Go India Advisors. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in a listen-only mode, and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. If you need assistance during the conference call, please signal an operator by pressing star then zero on your touch-tone phone. Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Ms. Monali Jain from Go India Advisors. Thank you and over to Ms. Jain. We must remind you that a discussion on Go India's call may include certain forward-looking statements and must be kept in view in conjunction with the risk. Excuse me. Can anybody hear anything? We'll hand it over to the management, so you can go ahead. Yeah. We couldn't hear anything what Monali said. Thanks, Monali. Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. Am I audible? Yes, sir. Your voice is audible. You can go ahead. Okay. Thank you for joining us today for the Q4 and FY24 earnings call. I hope you had the opportunity to review the earnings presentation available on both the stock exchanges and on our website. To present the financial results, I'd like to provide a brief overview of some important updates and key highlights for this quarter and the financial year. FY24 has been another successful year for Data Patterns. Over the past three decades, we have strategically advanced the value chain by developing complex systems using reusable building blocks and leveraging our existing competencies. This strategy has facilitated our expansion in a small way into new geographical markets, including Europe and East Asia, where we have successfully competed with foreign OEMs. Our sustained investment in products and technology has positioned us at the forefront in our field. Over the years, our strong R&D capabilities have enabled us to undertake significant product development. We successfully developed and delivered nine precision approach radars to the Ministry of Defence for the Air Force and Indian Navy requirements. Delivered command and alignment systems as well as self-protection suites for land, mobile, and reconnaissance vehicles. Data Patterns has an order book of about INR 1,083 crores at the end of FY 2023/24, which has grown 13% year-on-year at a CAGR of 20% between 2021 and 2024. Our diversified order book has significant contributions to radar at 64% and avionics at 21%. Highlights our strategic positioning. While Venkat will discuss the results in detail, I just want to touch upon the financial performance for the year. In FY 2024, our revenue from operations witnessed 17% growth. EBITDA demonstrated a growth of 29% over FY 2023. EBITDA margins during the year stood at 43%. The broader context of our performance is shaped by the significant transformation underway in India's defense sector. Government initiatives such as Atmanirbhar Bharat and Make in India, coupled with increased capital outlay, are driving this change. These developments provide an excellent platform for companies like us to capitalize on substantial domestic opportunities in the defense sector. Having this sectoral tailwind in mind, we are committed to sustaining a revenue growth of 20%-25%. As part of this product development initiative, Data Patterns is developing complete systems in radar, electronic warfare systems, and communication systems in line with the in-house committed competencies meeting international standards. These products are expected to bring in revenue growth over the next three years post-trials. For FY24, the board has recommended a dividend of INR 6.5 per share and a INR 320 equity share of INR 1 each, which is subject to approval in the ensuing AGM. We are committed to maximizing value to our shareholders. At this point, I will pass the floor to Venkat for his comments. Thank you, sir. Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. We are happy to present our annual financial highlights for Q4 and financial year 2023/24. Let us look at an overview of our financial results. For financial year 2024, our revenue from operations increased by 15% year-on-year, reaching INR 520 crore. We maintained a robust gross margin of 68%. Development contracts contributed to 42% of our revenue mix, with the production at 54% and service at 5%, showcasing growth across all three categories. EBITDA of INR 220 crore witnessed a notable year-on-year growth of 29%, with an EBITDA margin of 43%. Profit before tax was INR 242 crore, while profit after tax surged by 47% year-on-year to INR 182 crore. In quarter four of FY 2024, revenue was flat at INR 182 crore. We had a better quarter-on-quarter performance in financial year 23/24, with Q4 contributing to 35% on the yearly revenue, up against 41% in the last financial year. Profit before tax was INR 95 crore, while profit after tax witnessed a 28% growth, reaching INR 71 crore. We continue to be a debt-free company. Our receivable days came down by 28 days, while inventory days increased by 32 days due to advanced procurement of materials and contracts deliverable in FY24, FY25, and FY26. As of March 31, 2024, we hold over INR 745 crore in cash and cash equivalents and liquid investments, underscoring our financial strength and liquidity. Overall, we delivered a strong performance in Q4 and financial year 24 and are confident of a steady growth momentum for the year ahead. We will endeavor to bring down the working capital base and sustain a margin of about 35%-40%. With this, we will now proceed to Q&A session. Thank you. Thank you. We will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on the touch-tone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and two. Participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. The first question comes from the line of Jyoti Gupta with Nirmal Bang. Please go ahead. Good morning, sir. And thank you. Congratulations for the set of numbers, something that I anticipated. Two things I would like to understand. In terms of revenues, what is going to be the percentage in domestic and exports? What's going to be the contribution of exports coming from the revenue side? Ballpark maybe in the next two years. What do you anticipate? Second is, do you expect your inventory base to go down from 187 in FY25? Third is, there's a decline in your raw material costs. Could you give some flavor on what are the key reasons for this decline in raw material costs? Okay. Let me take this question, last one first. There's no steep decline in raw material costs. Our margins vary with the contracts we execute. The gross margin varies with contract to contract. We had a good set of contracts where there's a lot of IP of ours, so the margins for the last financial year, the margins were better than the previous financial year. And most of the orders being single vendor, we had the margins available with us. So it's not necessarily that the raw materials have gone up. That is why our margins have gone up. Second is, on the export and domestic, the opportunity in India is very, very high. And we are trying to now go into Make in India solutions against traditionally importing defense systems and defense equipment from abroad. So this has opened up a lot of opportunities in India. The growth story has to be more in India today. Later, you have to look at exports. Having said that, so the large part of the business is going to be Indian, and the growth is going to be here. We have an order book of more than 70 crores from export orders, which we won against contracts. Some are single vendors, some are open competition for products designed and developed in India. These are offset contracts. This has been developed by us with local IP. So we expect that these will be exported during the course of this year. So if you look at that, it's going to be there. The third question, you wanted to know whether working inventory days will go down. Yes. It all depends on the set of contracts which we get. We had some large contracts which we have bought inventory, and inventory has gone up from last year to this year because we're holding inventory for execution for some of the contracts this year as well as next year. Inventory has gone up. So this is going to be more towards the kind of contracts we're expecting. Other than a full cost for inventory days, this business has a larger inventory days. Inventory turnover risk will be low for defense business because it's capital-acquiring business. Plus, there's a lot of acceptance criteria before the consent letter gets shipped. So there's a lot of impact on the government and third-party agencies. So inventory days become slightly longer. What we're interested in is to reduce working capital days, net working capital days, which we're working towards. The next two, three years, you will see a substantial increase in terms of net working capital days going ahead. Okay. Thank you and I'll come back to the Q. This question comes from the line of Abhishek Sundar from Naredi Investments Private Limited. Please go ahead. Hello. Good morning, sir. Can I have your name? Yeah. Please louder, please. My question currently: what is our order book today? And how much is the advance order, and what is our success rate? Recently, we have about 1,000 crores order book on hand as of today. And out of which, I think about 360-400 crores have been in L1 business. I think I'm not very sure. Exactly line item-wise, I don't have it in my mind. I know of two large contracts with the L1 business, so I'm saying around 35%-40% could be L1 business. The rest are all mostly single vendor business as of the order on-hand situation. On the order pipeline that you talked about, we are looking at a pipeline of more than 2,000 crores. But those pipelines when we predict to the market is all based on previously delivered orders or single vendor contracts expected. We don't talk about pipeline with respect to competitor business because competition can go either way, whether it's a zero or one. You may also lose the business. So I'm not predicting or forecasting numbers we give to you based on only Data Patterns products and single vendor or repeat business, fractional business, whatever we've delivered earlier to the DRDO. So sir, how much orders will you take in FY25? Order income in FY25? We expect another INR 1,000 crores order intake during the course of this financial year. Okay. Thank you so much. Thank you. Next question comes from the line of Dipen Vakil from InCred Equities. Please go ahead. Thank you so much, sir. And congratulations on the great margins. So my first question is on the line of, sir, you want a significant order from Make in India in this quarter. So can you give some more light into what form of product that falls into? I'm not very sure whether this Bharat Electronics order will come this quarter or next quarter. We're expecting some contracts with BEL, but it has still not happened. There's been a delay in that contract. Hopefully, we expect that in the next two quarters, we should get the order. But I think it's a bit preemptive now. We don't want to, since the contract is still not in our hand, we don't think it is appropriate to talk about the contract or the platform. Maybe once the contract is, we get the contract, maybe it's the right time to talk about it. That is good. I will ask the question because it was already made into a major order a few times this year. My second question is on your R&D plan. You plan to invest? Once again, there's one more order we already received last year. I was thinking you're talking about this year. Last year, we received an order. This is for a program called Arudra, where it's a radar. These radars were delivered by BEL, and we won some contracts as part of that order. Okay, okay. Thank you so much for this clarification. So the second question is on research and development and chemical and capability. So you foresee you will be including around INR 150 crores in the next two years. So can you give us some guidance in terms of where will we invest in that and what are the new projects and developments you're focusing on in the next couple of years? Basically, our CapEx is going to be two levels. One is in factory building and infrastructure, which is going to be spent in the next two years. Because expecting the larger contracts to happen, we have to create an infrastructure to deliver on those contracts. We've already got land, nearly about four and a half acres of land right next to us. So we expect to build some more factory infrastructure in the next two years and also some test infrastructure for the ensuing contracts to deliver. So that infrastructure will happen. Maybe INR 100+ crore will be spent over the next two years on this. We are making estimates internally. There should be more approvals before that is spent. The other thing which you talked about is product development. We have raised money last 23 March for product development during QIP. So, that already we have started spending money on certain areas of operation. The main areas we have spent is going on into radars, into EW, electronic warfare suite, and communication equipment. These areas where money is being consistently spent. A lot of development work has already happened. So in the next three to six months' time, some of the products will start coming out, and we'll start undertaking trials with the customer to see that acceptance is there. So this is the first area of investment we're making, and that will be around another INR 100 crore plus we'll be spending on these areas of development. Got it. So just a small follow-up. So what would be our R&D expenditure as a percentage of revenue for this year? Maybe around, you know, see, this is development expenses. We've taken a separate fund available from market for this. And so, but maybe if you look at 20%-25%, maybe about 20%-25% of our overall revenue, we will be doing actually product development this year. And we'll be doing all the next two years like this. Got it, sir. Thank you so much for answering my question. Thank you. Next question comes from the line of Hardeep Rawat with IIFL Securities. Please go ahead. Hi. Good morning. Thanks for the opportunity. Firstly, I wanted to understand what sort of R&D expenditure you're looking at, about INR 1,000 crores worth of inflows in FY25. I wanted to understand within just the Arudra execution, what should be the value of that of inflow from the Arudra program, and what would be the execution timelines for this? This Arudra, already we received the order as of last year, and that will be executed over the next three years as per schedule given by Bharat Electronics. That is not part of the future expected orders this year. All right. Another, I had a couple of questions with regards to the balance sheet. So there's a sharp jump in the other current liabilities, which has led to a substantial improvement in your net working capital cycle. Can you please explain what this jump is? What is the reason behind this jump? I can't answer this. Yeah. Other liability basically is because of advances received against contracts from customers. Last year, it was around 190 crores. It has gone up by almost 100 crores. That is reflected in the other current liability increase in the balance sheet. It's advances from the customers. For two contracts, actually, we have got additional advances. That is what is reflecting in the increase. Understood. And also, like you mentioned that you have an order pipeline of INR 2,000 crores for FY25. Is that correct, right? The pipeline is not just FY25 or 26. Pipeline, yes. We expect 24, 25, we expect new order intake around INR 1,000 crores. Understood. And sir, just wanted to understand lastly, your guidance in terms of revenue margins and net working capital cycle for FY25? It's going to grow the business 20%-25% in terms of revenue and with EBITDA margin of around 20%, 25%-40%. And bottom line growth of probably about 35%. And as far as the working capital days is concerned, can you give some numbers? We expect we are working towards reducing the working capital days. Actually, this year also, FY24, if you see, the achievable days have come down by almost 30 days. But still, the next cash conversion cycle is high because of the inventory. Inventory is expected to be high only. But we will, over the next couple of years, we will reduce the number of, I mean, cash conversion cycle days to about 270 to 80 days. That will happen over a couple of years only. But actually, for 24, 25, it largely depends on the inventory days. Got it, sir. I'll keep tracking. Thank you. Thank you. Next question comes from the line of Anvith Rai with Equentis Wealth. Please go ahead. Thank you for taking my question. Also, with respect to the outlook given on revenue, while we mentioned that revenue growth of 20%-25% for this year, and on the same basis, the slide also states a 25% plus CAGR over the next couple of years. I want to understand, last quarter as well, we gave a revenue outlook of 20%-25% from July to February, which came in at almost a 10% YoY. So what exactly should we kind of look even for going forward years? Should we take 20%-25%, or would it be 25% plus CAGR we're speaking of? Last year, we also predicted about 20% growth, but we could not. Our original plan, internal plan was about 540 plus to achieve during FY20. This is because two contracts, products are ready to dispatch. The inspection is getting delayed from customer. Still, the inspection is not, sir. One is finished. The other one is still to start, so we were actually close to guidance, but we could not do that because of third-party interactions. Those are products in reading. Second is, however, we are able to keep the bottom line growth because the particular contracts had better margins, so we could do this, and of course, this is also predicted by us in our budget towards growth. Coming to your second question is, this is the reason why the prediction was slightly lower. Actually, we achieved lower than prediction, though the bottom line was in line with expectations. If we did 20%-25%, I think we should be able to achieve this. Maybe even more than that, probably we can do it depending on how the delivery happens this year because of the complex delivery. A lot of development is there. So that is why we are giving a range. In case we are able to go through the process, it's not just the company which is involved here. The third-party inspections are there. The customer is development-oriented, so there are likely to be ups and downs in this on quarter on quarter. So that is why we're giving a range. But I think we should be able to achieve whatever we are telling you now. 20%-25%, 25% plus, we should be able to do it. Okay. And on the margins? We have a lot of land, and some of the orders, extra orders also, we started advance work to see that we deliver on time with the customer expectations. So I think we should be very near guidance on what we think. Okay, okay. And with respect to the margin outlook as well, so while this was a very good margin at 50% plus, what I'm looking at, how sustained is that? While 40% is something that you have guided for overall in your PPP, while you gave your CAGR commentary, it was also given at 35%-40%. So I'm just trying to understand where does that sustained margin lie? I mean, from the companies that we saw during quarter four on the higher side of the plot, that we repeated during the year seven, and what brings in that? I mean, while you did mention that it was the IP and not more of the raw material, which brought in that expansion, could you just help explain that? Because while 45% is something that you've given your opening comments, the slide said that you should have a 40% sustained margin. So I mean, should we expect the upside that we saw during this quarter again to come during the year, or how frequently do you think that IP is now being leveraged? Sorry, I didn't understand the question. Last part? So basically, on the operating margin, you did mention that somebody did question that the raw material cost was one of the reasons for an improvement in margin. So you did mention that it was not exactly the raw material cost, but also the company's own IP that was used. So I just wanted more clarity around that, on how it can improve margins and going forward. I mean, should we expect more margin expansion as companies as we are picking up? What really happens if it's our product developed completely in-house and we sell it? I typically expect the margins which we have been reflecting on our various years in the P&L, which has been the last two years. What happens sometimes is a mix of contracts. It's not just our products. We also take some integration as part of the overall deliverable, in which case then when you buy products and integrate, obviously, it's not our margin. It's an integrated margin of the overall system. The margin tends to come down. So it's a question of the contracts we take, and depending on that, the margin varies. So coming back to the question of this year, what we do, why we are saying 35%-40%? The range is basically because the kind of revenue, which projects will get executed in the course of the year. That may vary. That is why we're given a range. But if it is only our products, it will be around 40%. But when you increase, when you try to integrate systems, it comes lower. So cumulatively, it comes to 35%-40%. So we are likely to do a better revenue, higher revenue, and if the range, then the margins are sometimes lesser. That's why we're given a range. But we're closer to 40% is what we expect. Okay. Thank you. Okay. So one last question. Primarily with respect to the order inflows that you spoke to, you did kind of put in at about 1,000 crores for the full year of 2025. The quarter three, we did mention about 56 billion or the next couple of quarters, which we did send you for around 300 crores. So I mean, I want to understand of the 1,000 crore order inflows that we are talking, would that be spread out across the year, or are we expecting in Q1 and Q2 of the data that we spoke in the last quarter, a major chunk of at least a third of it during the first half? I mean, just want to understand how the inflow would be there during the first part of the year. This is with respect to the year because the inquiries, some have come, some have to come. There may be delays in the inquiry and negotiations, and then the order happens. So I can't give you a quarter-quarter estimate at the present moment. In our own thinking, in our budget, we expect to not ship more than 10%-15% of the incoming order book for this year's execution. So it's all meant for next year and year after next execution. So the order inflow will happen over the year. I can't clearly specify exactly what it will happen. So we have an indication, but it's not possible to comment on that right now. Okay. That's it from my side. I'll keep asking questions. Thank you. Thank you. Next question comes from the line of Arvind Parija with ASK Investment Managers Please go ahead. I hope I'm audible. Yeah. Yes. So the first question is around the guidance that you've given. You're talking guidance to indicate about 20%-25% margins, outer limit of 40%, which is lower than what you've done this year. And yet, I think you indicated a profit guidance of 30%. So I'm just trying to reconcile. If the margins year on year are going to be slightly lower than what they have been in 2024, then why would the profit guidance be 30% or the sales guidance be 20%-25%? It depends on revenue growth, operating costs, and overall margin, and also the kind of products which we ship this year. So that is why I've given you the approximate guidance numbers. I think we should retain guidance. We want to retain the guidance of trying to somehow make the bottom line growth as important to our office for operations. So the focus is there. The focus is on margins. So there are some contracts we've taken up which have lesser margins. The revenue growth may be higher than what we've suggested. We managed to ship those revenues. But our mind is on the bottom line growth. That is why we've given you this and not given a complete three-segment correct representation, which is a mix of contracts, mix of deliverables. So I've given you growth numbers accordingly. So what you're suggesting is that either the top 10 can be more than what you are currently guiding? Can be more. We want to retain our guidance for the bottom line, so can be more, so it depends on how the year proceeds, so that is why we've given you a typical number range. Okay. And so you also somewhere in your PPT indicated that share of the R&D contracts will come down in revenue contribution and MOD will going up. Is it possible? I don't know. Did I make it in the PPP? I don't think so. I think I made it in the same PPP interview this morning. Maybe you listened to it. Maybe you're one of the listeners. I don't know. See, what I was asking, this question was brought in a very broad kind of perspective. There's a lot of different things in DRDO contracts now. Even today, we do a lot of DRDO business. And there is another contract which you get, based on which repeat contract comes from DRDO, BEL, or HAL, or the PSUs. This is how the line of business has been going. Except some few contracts like Precision Approach Radar, we've directly got a contract being openly in MOD tenders. What we did tell the CNBC interview here is that going ahead, we will continue to engage with DRDO in our programs. And they are very close these days. We learned our business. They learned our competencies. We continue to engage with them and try to do more with DRDO. But having said that, if you want to scale the company to a few thousand crores, it has to necessarily come from market which is MOD-driven. MOD-driven market is very large. So we need to address that market. We have to get the growth which we are planning to, especially considering that the competency the company has built over so many years. Also, that we have taken money to do product development from the market and actively developing products. So these have to finally go to MOD sales. So we are trying to engage MOD at a large level to see whether we can have products when the inquiries are coming in. Where most companies work with collaborations, we try to work with in-house IP. So that is where the development mode financing is coming into picture. Going ahead three, five years, I think scaling will happen with MOD business. That's what I said. All right, so I'm just trying to understand from a margin and working process perspective, are the MOD orders going to be different in their constitution compared to the DRDO orders? Again, it depends on whether the MOD contract is purely designed, 100% designed developed by us. But it also involves vehicles and other subsystems, generator sets, UPS, antennas, building. These are to come into the picture. There will be integration costs also attached to it. And the kind of contract, the margins will vary. If it is only our contract with IP, then we compare with foreign vendors. So the margins tend to be higher. Again, this is all we can't be clearly told year to year, contract, contract, contract, because we have to bid against very many companies and consortiums, and we have to get a lower score than get be there. So there'll be a mix of both. I don't think it is a clear-cut answer. But what is the important thing is we want to scale the business multi-fold in the coming years. We want to be profitable in the coming years going ahead. We want to see that sustained bottom line growth is happening over the many years. This is the idea. Obviously, some contracts, the margin levels will come down because there is competition, and we are integrating. That we have to be very clear about. These are all contribution margin pricing, which we need to do. As long as they're able to handle the overheads and ship the consignment, that's what we look at. The size of the business is very, very large. The focus is going to be to build products to address the size of business. That is going to be the not that we will not make any bottom line. That is not the kind of business we're looking at. I appreciate that. From the working capital standpoint, my question was simply that while new guidance. Coming guidance. I can give you on that. See, we also get advance against every contract. And in a MoD contract, typically what happens is it is not a contract which is one-off shipment. There is going to be, during the course of a few years, there were multiples of orders. The shipments happen for various stages of the overall cycle of production on the overall project life cycle or the program cycle. So there is cash inflow coming in together, and we have advance also ahead. So we should be able to manage the working capital with non-fund limits, non-guaranteed limits. We should be able to do that. I don't think we'll be very hard-pressed for working capital going ahead. We're also generating a lot of cash ourselves. I don't think we're particularly worried about it now. Of course, we need to do the cash conversion cycle, reduce net working capital, bring it down. This is mostly happening not in MoD contracts or product production contracts. It happens more to development contracts. Extensions and so many other things happen. As long as the production contracts become larger in the size of the overall percentage which we have, the working capital cycle will come down. We expect it to come down going ahead, not go up as a percentage of the contract. Optimally, how much should it come down by? I mean, what could be a stable, sustainable working capital in days sales for? I think Venkata just said the next two years will come to 80 or 200 days, and going ahead, we probably, given the nature of the contract and business, we try to bring it down consciously. Okay. On the BrahMos seeker, what's the status of development? What is the order pipeline for BrahMos as a company? It's very large, more than 30,000 crores. Between you and the Electronics Corporation of India, the seekers have to be supplied. Is the qualification for that already done? We have to fly it as a missile. That is getting postponed for various reasons. So as and when the company retires, we should get the contracts. So today, we are not projecting the contract in internal. Maybe it will happen during the process this year. Is this for the BrahMos NG, or is this for the current version of BrahMos? BrahMos-NG is still not a product which has been launched. It will be for the current BrahMos. Okay. And what would be the possible timeline for getting the approval? I'm not able to comment. You should ask BrahMos that. So long as I've got to comment on that, they have to do the pre-trials and then come back to us. But they are showing urgency and maybe three, four months because next month it starts raining. They won't do the trials. So maybe after the rain comes down immediately, the trials will happen. We're talking about some orders for production. So this all has to happen. Hopefully, over the course of this year, this should convert. That's what we are hoping. But we can't say for sure. Thank you. And HAL now has clearly indicated that LCA Tejas money, 16 per year assembly and delivery is already scheduled, and with the Nashik facility coming on stream towards the second half of this finance year, probably 24 a year. So from that perspective, perhaps with some visibility over and above that, they also indicate that for the next three years, they have a pipeline of almost 160,000 crores between helicopters and aircraft. I'm presuming that from an avionics standpoint, you are very much there in both the platforms and rotating. Can you give some idea? I mean, does this visibility coming from HAL give you some sort of a line of sight for the next three, four years on some work related to that? It's a bit too early for us to comment on it. These are internal programs and projections of HAL. Unless we get the indicative RFQs from them on timelines on delivery and whatever we are developing in some of the aircrafts which you are talking about, I won't be able to comment. We've taken a very small percentage, very small contract value compared to the numbers you're talking about for this year. They have reported. So the contract, once it comes, we will deliver probably this year depending on their schedule. The rest of the things, the inquiries have not come. So as and when it happens, we'll be able to take it. They're not projecting it in this year's order intake. So, I'll make that sense. And my question is that if HAL gives the visibility of 5-7 years. They have not given us any visibility for us to comment on it. I mean, they're talking on their investor calls. So I'm presuming that there is a good reason they would come. I'm just trying to understand and assess what your opportunity value is from that. We can't comment on it because we don't have any visibility there. So we don't want to comment and then get into another call which says why this and which happens. So I'm only commenting on what I have knowledge base about. And what may happen tomorrow, we'll be very glad to obviously participate. We're looking forward to such a comment. But at the present moment, we can't comment because trials are on in some of the aircrafts. And after trial completion and acceptance, and then how Air Force and HAL views this, then only contracts can be happening. So it's a bit premature for me to comment on those things. Okay. Thanks. I'll send him back to you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Next question comes from the line of Abhishek Poddar with HDFC Mutual Fund. Please go ahead. Hi, sir. Thanks for taking my question. Specifically, margins. Sorry, one question on this. We have about 50% from development contracts and 50% plus from production. Would the margin be very different in these contracts? And also, as your production contracts increase, as the revenues increase over the next three, four years, would we see a mix on the margins because of this happening? And the reason I'm asking this question is because your peers are there. Their margins are much lower when their production is a major part of their revenue mix. Okay. See, this question I've answered many times. What happens is margins are not, depending on whether development or production contracts, especially when it comes with DRDO-driven programs, they remain static. It is what it is. What really makes the difference in margins is what is the competitive scenario and at what cost we got the product? Is it L1 business, etc.? Some portion of the L1 business, obviously, the margins become lower because we buy, integrate some of them to make the systems. Some of the other contracts which are developed, everything in-house, our margin becomes higher. It depends on how much we contribute towards the product on the final delivery. So that is how the margins vary. It has nothing to do with development or production. And that's one method. That's not also true when you look at another perspective. Suppose MOD business comes and we are competing with so many people. We need to compete and get contracts. So obviously, subsequent margin will suffer. But again, supporting 50 crore contract, 20 crore contract, 150 crore contract is where we go. Contracts like 1,500 crore, 2,000 crore, 3,000 crore, 1,000 crore kind of contracts in MOD. So obviously, we may not be able to keep the same kind of margin percentage because a lot of bottom comes and integration happens. The margin comes down there. But overall revenue will substantially go up, pick up multiple times higher. So this is the business to be in. In those businesses, what we try to do is wherever electronics is coming into picture, if we can develop the electronics in-house with our own IP, rather than relying on foreign IP and foreign products and do manufacturing alone for them, our margins then become necessarily higher. And once the margin is necessarily higher, it also gives us a leverage to say, if we need to compete with reducing margins, can I quote be an L1 business? So this is a leverage for me to win more contracts and also support the products for the next 20 years of lifecycle support with local support without going to costly support from foreign OEMs. This is the name of the game, as I see it. People work out differently. Product companies who don't have a local IP depend on foreign OEMs to provide the IP. So they become costlier. But still, they have been the order because their margins can be very, very low when orders. So this is the game which is being played. Today, India doesn't develop full systems. We are one of the few companies who are trying to say, "Why don't we develop the full systems here in India rather than doing collaborations?" So this is how it goes. Our future, what we're looking at is develop products ahead of time, build the products in-house, either when the new inquiry comes in Make-I, Make-II, or buy and sell, whatever opportunities come from MOD. We position our products with IP and product tested here to give a better winnability and scale the business substantively. That is the game which we're trying to play. So, sir, regarding the order book that we have and the kind of 2,000 crores that you mentioned, should we assume that the system integration contract and what can be margin relative? Those are very limited in those. For a contract on HAL, there are two contracts where there is a lot of system integration or bottom-up way building, land and building, all of this coming into picture. One or two contracts, the margins are lower. But the rest of the contracts are our exact development on IP developed there. So it remains the same as what we've been doing all along. Going ahead in the next 1,000 crores, we talk about these are not contracts which are going in for multiple vendors and mix of contracts and integration is not there. So there, the margins are likely to remain as we've been doing the last so many years. Sir, I understood and just one more question on the BrahMos seeker. Sir, ECL's product was tested in 2018, and now it is yet to be tested. This confidence that we have that we should be getting orders, is this due to product quality or what has management said so far, sir? If you can give some more color on this. Oh, product quality is very good. They just said they have not taken it for flight trials for a long time for various reasons. The moment we take it for flight trials and it passes the flight trials, we should get an order. This is what they have been telling us. I have no control over when they will test it. So we are also the impatient waiting like you when the trials will be finished. We have trial. See, one difference is our seeker, whatever you say, like I've always told you, is that we design everything in-house. The vehicle is designed by us. The motor control is designed by us. The material substances are designed by us. The transmitter is designed by us. The seal process is designed by us. The blowing power is designed by us. Everything is designed in-house. We don't buy. So obviously, the quality is in our control. Understood, sir. Thank you, sir. All the best. Thank you. Next question comes from the line of Renu Baid, IIFL Securities. Please go ahead. Yeah, hi. Good morning, sir. Two quick questions from my side. First, just want to pick up your input in terms of, again, in terms of guidance. Sorry for this. You mentioned about 2020, 50% revenue guidance and 30% margin guidance despite different operating margins. So is it that you're expecting a sharp jump below EBITDA when it comes either in terms of other income or sharp shrinkage in the finance cost? Any big change in the tax rate that you're expecting? Just trying to understand the math behind this. Okay. There's no very elaborate math. The guidance is conservative in terms of revenue. That's all I can say because depending on the deliveries we do, we don't expect a substantive increase in other income because it remains whatever it is. Maybe the marginal increase may be there. We don't know. It depends on the facts of the year. The other budgets, we think it will be remaining around similar or slightly more. It's what we expect, and operating costs also, we have done the budget and very clear by board. We have an idea of what the costs are. The idea is to keep the revenue growth, the bottom line growth. We'll try to deliver some products to see that the bottom line growth continues to happen. That's all there is. Maybe the profit may also go up. We didn't want to give guidance on that because numbers are getting multiplied by market. So we don't want to give the multiplication and then fall back later. Sure. Secondly, if you look at the backlog, closing backlog, especially for production orders, now we are nearly back to INR 500 crores kind of out of the book. As in another clearly INR 40 crores kind of enclosed this year. So of these 50 or 80, INR 490 crores of order backlog for production orders, what proportion should be executed in 2025? The transfer you mentioned, Arudra, would be over two and a half, three years based on BEL's execution schedule. Yeah. I think a large portion will get executed the coming year on the production contracts. I don't want to give a commencement date, but it will be over 60%-70% will get executed this year. And some of the development contract will get executed this year is what we're thinking. We're also putting a small portion of the new orders coming in this year to be executed this year. So that is how our budgets internally have been made. Sure. And in terms of investment and projects, how are you looking at spend for fiscal 2025, 2026 in terms of expanding capacity, capabilities for new projects? Over the next two years, we're planning to spend some INR 100+ crore on CapEx, and so it all depends on when we start the CapEx, the purchase order, and how long the buildings and other things, equipment come in, so whether everything will get through this year or it will be more to go the next year is something we have to commit to working on, working with the proposal for the board to clear. But over the next two years' time, we should be able to spend that because we need the infrastructure for the future growth to put in, so we bought the land already for this. So this will start, and some contracts will be placed over the next week or months to see that infrastructure is getting created. This is one part of the CapEx we'll do. The other is our development. Continue to develop products. There also will be a larger part of the spend happen this year over last year. Got it. Got it. And lastly, within the 2,000 crores order pipeline that you have highlighted, are there any notable large projects or orders which you would want to highlight that would be helpful for us to track in terms of progress, in terms of investments and awarding? No, this is a bit too early for us to say. It will just happen. Let it all come up to the open, and then we will implement. Sure. Yeah. Any input in terms of where are these large projects like Ashwini, LLTR, etc., which we were given a reasonably large part of the pipeline? Where are they in terms of pipeline? Is it a part of the pipeline or still not in the foreseeable future? And how could you have behaved? It is part of the pipeline only. It is not part of the INR 1,000 crores I'm talking about revenue or ordering this year. The inquiries have come. They'll all be quoting. We do not know who will get the order and what percentage will get. We'll wait and watch the next two months to see what happens. Got it. Got it. Sure. That's helpful. Thank you, Manoj. Thank you. Thank you. Next question comes from the line of Uncertain Name with Invest Analysis Advisors, LLP. Please go ahead. Hello, Manoj. Welcome. Yeah. Good morning, sir. Congrats for the good test numbers. Just two questions. One is on the industry perspective. So are you people witnessing any kind of potential risks on the supply chain or demand side that could lead to a slowdown in near to medium term? Additionally, is there any emerging competition that might be capturing the market share or therefore impacting our order flows? We don't see any company changes recently. We have no problem in the industry here. So we don't see that. So that's not the problem. The second thing is you're saying there is a risk from challenges. Emerging competition or any demand slowdown? Competition has always been there. But I'm not seeing any particular risk which has to be considered. Obviously, obvious risks are always there because the products that are going to Europe are already available abroad. So people do buy and bring the products here. That risk has always been there and continues to be there. The other risk is our new order contracts we get with the DRDO competition. This is always there. This risk continues to be there. So the idea is what we are trying to do is try and build ahead of time to meet the requirement early and do an early mover kind of an advantage we have. Since we are developing in-house everything, we are trying to invest ahead of time to build the product to address the competitive risk which we are talking about. Is any demand slowdown expected or near to medium? No, no. Demand is fairly high. We are looking at a number of opportunities going ahead. A number of opportunities. It all depends on how we build products and whether we are competitive and the opportunity arises. So this is how and the other thing is bring bandwidth internally to the office to see that we address the opportunities. So we have seen those issues. We are addressing them presently. Yes, sir. Regarding the utilization of QIP funds, so could you provide an update on the current status, specifically how much of the QIP funds have been spent so far? And when can we expect to launch any significant new products financed by these funds? On the development, we have recorded in the balance sheet also seeing over INR 40-odd crore that we have spent over the last year. But largely, out of all the INR 40-odd crore, there are INR 30-odd crore of the materials we have procured for the products. And the people cost about INR 7 to 8, 10 crore or something. The overhead costs will be there on the development. We will continue to spend a large portion of the development funds this year. And the products, at least the products, will start coming out in the next 6 to 10 months. They will start coming out. And then we have to go through trials, flight trials, ground trials, whatever trials are necessary. We pass the trials. We are not able to clearly determine the timeline for trials because it is a multi-agency system. The government has to get involved in all the trials. So we are trying to see how best to address that and how quickly we should do it. And that is going to be a work in process. On our end, the development we will finish. The further, the product, we have to spend money on actual trials. And then only the contracts can happen. But we are confident the products will meet the requirement. And it's world-class, today's generation products we're designing. So they're second to none world-class products we're designing. So hopefully, customers like it and allow us to do the trials and take it further. Fine, sir. And sir, you mentioned The QIP is funded already. Out of INR 500 crore, we have raised. So what is the expected timeline for full utilization of these funds? See, INR 500 crore comes in various things, working capital. There's a lot of classifications. Development funds at this time is INR 160-odd crores. The development fund which is taken. Of course, there are so many also available for development because it's all available as cash in our office today. So we keep the money now. We create opportunity and spending it. As the market turns, what are the areas where the market requirements are large and which can address? So we're trying to deploy that money to address the market requirements without actually spending all the money and then see the markets are moving slowly. So we are taking a cautious outlook how to do this. Wherever we think there are immediate opportunities and there is unaddressed by anybody in the market, we're trying to invest money there and see that the unaddressed market is addressed by us. So this becomes easier and also a world-class product for them. So we are doing that effort in-house. And I think it's a two-to-three-year kind of a program. And the idea is we are able to get some orders for the products against development we do today. We want to keep the developed money in rotation so we can continue to do further investment going ahead to spend the company to many thousand crores turnover. This is what our intent is. So let us see how it goes. We have the money now, so we are carefully spending it. Hello? Hello. Yeah. The last question is on de-risking for defense sector. Last time, you mentioned about the negotiations happening on other industries other than the defense. How do you look at it? How do you see the other industry's contribution to our pipeline in the next three to five years down the line? No, I didn't understand the question. What is that? I didn't understand the question. Can you repeat, please? We have lost the line. We'll send it to all the participants if you may press star on one to ask a question. Next question comes on the line of Jatin Jadhav. Sahasrar Capital, please go ahead. Hello. Good morning. Am I audible? Yeah. So sir, basically, my question was pretty much answered, but I just want some clarity from you. This question is regarding your competition. So based on your competition, your EBITDA margins are around 50%, and others are slightly on the lower end. So I wanted to understand since you are saying that you will maintain these margins, is it because of the IPs we have developed in-house and the products we are making in-house and integrating them as well? That's why we have a higher margin compared to the competition? There are two reasons for it. One, we started developing the products ahead of competition years back. So we have built, as we see with the DRDO, we do parts of the product. Over a period of time, we have started building a large part of the product with the DRDO. We have designed ours. There are other things we made with developing a small part of the product. So with the maturity now, we are probably getting repeat business from whatever we did seven, eight years back. We have started coming in and taking it. So that automatically. And second, we never recovered development costs. We never recovered from all those products. So we invested over the last 15, 18 years. We've been investing on product development and competing with OEMs and selling those products in India, absorbing the costs. So we've been doing incremental development with our own money. We've written off all the development costs as part of every expenses. We never capitalized it all through our life of Data Patterns. So those are all kicking in now. When you get repeat orders and numbers are coming, and your cost model is different because you don't these are supposed to be buy and integrate with others. Since you're not buying anything, maybe the bottom line is better. We don't know. Maybe that could be the reason. The second reason is probably some of the requirements are urgent, and some customers feel that we are in a position to deliver against the urgency and meet the requirement. So we get a lot of single vendor orders. So other people have to design and develop. We probably have a design in-house. So maybe we get a lot more single vendor orders than other companies. And here again, since we've done a building block kind of a development all through our life, we tend to use the building blocks rather than redesign from scratch. Those are tested. So the timeline to deliver is far faster. So this could be a second reason. I can't exactly comment on other people's business, and it's right in my part to do that because I don't know the strategies what they employ. But what we are doing is what we think is right for our business. Excellent. One more follow-up question regarding this is, so as we eventually will, as currently also we are into system integration. Do we supply a complete system? So as and when, whenever we need a complete system, we command a higher margin? No, again, that is currently said. There's no zero answer to this question. It depends on what the complete system is. If it is going to be a lot more details, you understand, no? I really don't know. But see, what we are trying to do is maximize Indian content or in-house content in a contract. If we do this, I have a bigger edge in the competitive situation. That's all I'm saying. We're trying to put our money and build this and so we can scale the business. India doesn't have products. We rely on DRDO today, building products. There's only one design agency in India. So the rest of us are in the private sector are doing collaboration with certain OEMs to build the product here and then do a work share. So when you do a work share, obviously, you have to share upfront margins also, right? What we have to do is the opportunities are now really big opportunities. If we can address the portion of the opportunity in Indian systems, design in-house, I have a better P/E, and hopefully, we'll have a better bottom line. This is not one without the other. But the scale has to happen. The scale happening, we'll all grow because the requirements are so large. All right, sir. And what is the? We are seeing greater growth. We're not looking at a quarter-to-quarter scale. Sorry. Hello? Can you ask me? Can you audible? Yeah. Yeah. Sorry, one follow-up question regarding the market size per se. Regarding the data systems that you are providing, how big of a market do you see growing or growing up to in the next four, five years or three to four years, wherever as far as you have visibility? I think market size is very large, but it's not addressed by us everywhere because you make a close-in weapon systems, for example, L&T gets an order. The radar gets deployed. Something comes out of the weapon. So there's a big system. When an integrated system comes, radar becomes a portion of the integrated system. And it is not accessible to us because we don't have the weapon. So what really happens when all this happens in India starts collaborating in-house in India, equal systems start developing, we combine our strengths together and address the opportunities, then you can say the market is bigger for us. So not all opportunities on radars are addressable directly by us. It still comes from abroad, either in technology transfer or joint production or something of the sort. What I am seeing on addressable by us in the next four, five, six years is upwards of INR 20,000 crore, which we can address. So we are working towards that. That is the first thing we are doing, putting our own products. Again, we are also doing the product development, which is not even addressed by us, get the products out. Then maybe we can collaborate with the OEMs in India to see why are we importing this when India can offer a solution. Look at an ecosystem we built here. So it's a very long-term play strategy. We're starting from scratch in India now. So the field is very open. It depends if it can be competitive with world-class products, different customer requirements, different timelines. So we have something going, and we need to collaborate with people in India also. So we're looking at all opportunities. How is the long-term game? And that is why we need the bottom line to scale the business because we need money to scale. We're going to put a lot of money in development. Looking at a three- to five-year kind of horizon for whatever we are trying to do. We're not looking at year-on-year horizon at all. All right, sir. That's pretty much it from my side. Thank you so much for your valuable insight and all the questions. Thank you. Thank you. A reminder to all the participants, please press. Please stick to the questions. Next question comes on the line of Manish Kumar, an individual investor, so please go ahead. Can I audible? Yeah. Hello, so most of the questions have already been answered, so I'll just skip them, I have one last digital question, and this is in terms of the human resource employee cost, which is what I'm looking at quarterly basis, and I'm looking at employee cost as a percentage of the expense that you've got, so what I saw is there's a little bit of a... I'm not able to hear your audio. Is it clear now? Is it clear now? Yeah, yeah. Talk a bit slowly so that I can put the pieces together. Sure, sure. All right. So my question is in terms of the employee cost as a percentage of the expense that you have quarter on quarter. That is the context. So what I saw is that there's a very continuous growth, right? This is always the percentage number, which is the employee cost as a percentage. It's always the highest in quarter one, and it gradually reduces to quarter two, three, and four. And this has been a constant phenomenon during the last three years. So I just could not put my head around as to why it's getting so critical, the employee cost. This has been happening for almost the last three years, I think, what I want to go for. So if you could give some... You are commenting on employee cost as a percentage of revenue? Expense of expense. See, what happens is our traditionally government business is a year-end business. If you look at 2017, 2018 balance sheet of P&L, you will have seen that almost 80% goes to last quarter, and first three quarters, we used to be cash loss. It would be difficult to manage it to see that our quarterly revenue is also managed properly, and we went public once we knew that there will be some reasonableness in our quarterly work. And then on-hand contracts are there, which we can deliver on a quarter-on-quarter basis. So the employee costs are not varying so much on a quarter-to-quarter. On a percentage of revenue, it will be higher in the first quarter, going down the second and accordingly last quarter. The last quarter tends to be the largest revenue quarter for us. This is also last year we managed to contain it, bring down the last quarter to only 35-40%, as against 50%-55% we would say previous year. So that is the ratio you're seeing. And another is maybe we have increments also coming in April, so maybe that pushes up. We recruit through the year. We're recruiting a number of fresh engineers and even lateral recruits through the year. We have recruited. Our number of employees is going up substantially, about 20% year-on-year, because we are building competency for tomorrow. And all the people we are building and training so that we can do large systems tomorrow at various levels. So we are continuously recruiting. So that also could be, I don't know exactly what the numbers are, but I think this is what is happening. All right. So my concern was that I was thinking that I might be thinking wrong, that maybe we are hiring only for specific projects, and when the projects are getting older, maybe we're having people leave the organization. In that case, my concern was that how we are retaining the knowledge and the expertise that we have built over the years. In one of the slides, I saw that some of the board members have stuck in the organization for almost two decades, right? That is what was referred to. So I was trying to relate if this in the employee cost in the later quarters is because of any churn which is happening. Look to the answer is no. Can you please confirm that? So we are managing our employees really well. Of course, there is a people need because they get very well trained in Data Patterns when they go and join multinationals. We are aware of that because the training level here is very, very, very high. We're unable to get lateral recruits. So we recruit from college directly. So GET was started from college 35 years back. Most of the people who are 20 years plus are all state employees who are coming directly from college. So we take a lot of people from direct college and train them at all walks of life for testing, development, software, hardware, mechanical, everything. But that is not the reason. We're not losing very many people. Compared to multinationals and other IT, I think our attrition ratio is far, far lower. And also, we have some 100 people as shareholders in the company. Thanks a lot. Thanks. Thank you. Next question comes from the line of Vishal and Individual Investor. Please go ahead. Am I audible? Yeah. Sir, first, I would like to place my congratulations to you for such a successful number and the value addition, value creation you have been doing to shareholders. Thank you very much for that. And my question was, if I look five years ago for Data Patterns figures, so can we assume because if we compare back time to current times, what we have achieved today is the back time is the profits out of current time. So can we, are we looking forward to repeat the same thing maybe in the next five years or earlier than that, or even earlier also? Vishal, we have the intent. Great. Let's go and do it. Sir, can you throw some light on what would be our general execution rate and percentage as a percentage of the order backlog? I would not comment on that because it depends on. It's not only left to me to execute the contracts. It's also the timelines which the customer wants execution done. Okay? More often than not, we find that in the production contract, we can execute in one or two years everything. When we will give you 1,500, we will execute it as long as already development is carried out. All I have to do is set up a line, and I can execute it. So we have all the competency. We have an SMT placement machine. We have automated test equipment. We build our own automated test equipment for production line systems. We do everything in-house since the process definition is our lines are defined by us. Electronic contract manufacturing, EMS line, we have two lines in the house already. We have ATEs in the house. So everything we have in-house. So we can execute. But what happens is, sir, don't want everything scheduled overnight. You give me a quarter-to-quarter turnover, but then we have to stick to it. Second area where the concern is where large development happens, the development cycle takes the time. You can't execute a development program in three months and six months because not only do we design and produce, but all certification agencies get involved. The flight safety and flight certification takes time. Documentation and process. So that really limits us, not on just the capacity what we have in terms of delivery. We have finite capacity of development, but on production, we increase capacity very fast. So you say we cannot be any specific percentage from the complete production percentage as well? We have. For example, we say INR 1,000 crores, what we can do, INR 2,000 crores, how can we deliver? But we are matching. That is what we're doing is we're trying to enhance our capacity in terms of infrastructure. We're creating additional infrastructure because we think we need to scale three years from now. The order will happen two years from now where I go for external testing, and we have a delay in delivery. So we're creating the test standards and equipment in our office. We get large contracts for integration, and we don't have factory space. So we're enhancing factory space to see that in anticipation of contracts happening two years from now, we're starting investing ahead. We're also expecting growth, substantial scaling happening in the next three to five years. Our competency building, mentor building, management bandwidths, everything on a top-to-bottom level, we are scaling our competencies and bandwidths. We have a very active HR team which is looking at all skill development from bottom to top and mandatory training programs to do this. So a whole lot of things are happening to see that we are not caught wrong-footed when we scale. We expect to scale because the market size is so big. So we are very bullish on the market and our competency to deliver on the market. So we are actually investing ahead of time, not only in product development, but also for delivery and manpower. Okay, okay. So thank you very much, and sir, I also pray for best of luck and you keep achieving such great value additions for yourself, your team, and for the shareholders. Thank you very much, sir. Same for us, Vishal. Thank you. Thank you. All the participants, please restrict yourselves to one question. The next question comes from the line of Devansh Aggarwal and Indri Jelunesh. Please go ahead. Hi, sir. Can you hear me? Yeah. Yes, I can hear you. Sir, one very specific question. The Arudra Radars, in some corporate communication, it was mentioned that they've got the order of INR 22 crores for Arudra Radars. However, in our presentation, it shows around INR 180 crores of order for Arudra Radars. Is it not possible to directly take order from MOD, or why is there no discussion in the quantum? This is what I'm trying to understand. See, these are all both the traditional way. DRDO has their own investment money. They develop Radars acquired by Air Force later. And they finished development about seven, eight years back, and they bounced it back to MOD and Air Force. And it was approved. Then the transfer of technology went to Bharat Electronics as a nominated partner. See, the process in India all along is that once development gets done, it is transferred to production agencies, which is BEL, BDL, HAL, etc. And as of then, the services want to contract more products. They then get the revenue approval from MOD. And once the approval things come through, they place a single vendor order on the PSUs. And during development, if people like us have done the product development for parts and subsystems, the transfer of technology agreement with BEL plans includes our name. So the idea is to see that that is being qualified. So they will back to back place the order on us. So whatever we have designed, we just part. That is the way the whole business is done. Today, it continues to happen like this by DRDO-developed products. But in MOD tenders, this is open to all of us. We are free to do whatever we want. We build subsystems. So this comes in various kinds of categories. So Make-I, Make-II, and other categories of MOD tenders. We're also participating in those categories of tenders that we can build our own system, our own radars. Not only us, a lot of companies in India have started saying, "Let us do this and look at the opportunity ourselves, either by themselves or in collaboration with foreign vendors." This is happening. So as more and more of this starts happening, then we'll start building the full system ourselves. So this is the way it's going to be. Got it. Got it, and just a quick question, sir. Sorry, I'm not saying. We saw on your webinar presentation that there's an increased focus on the offset. Is there any action going on? The reason I'm coming from is recently Azad Engineering announced some kind of offset with Rolls-Royce, and it saw great momentum in the market, at least. So we've never. I don't think here in the presentation we talked offset. We are not in the offset game. We build our own IP. We have not done any manufacturing for any foreign OEMs today. We are not really an offset partner for. We do have partnerships with various companies, but that is on product development rather than offset. The offset is a low-value, low-margin proposition normally to be manufacturing alone in India. We didn't want to get into this long back, though we had the capability to do it, because our focus and IP development will grow. So we really try to build products rather than focus on our offset. So we're not daily recipients of very large offsets. Got it. And all the best for a re-appointment like that. It will be a good moment to see the stock price running. Thank you, sir. Thank you very much. Thank you. Next question comes from the line of Parth Pathak Galaxy, Indri Jelunesh. Please go ahead. Hello, sir. Good morning. Just wanted to know about any R&D feats we have achieved in this year. Given the fact that the way I- I don't hear you. Your voice is breaking. Hello? Hello? Just give me a moment, sir. Mr. Parth Pathak, please go ahead with your question. Mr. Parth Pathak, can you hear me? Please go ahead with your question. Yes, I'm able to hear you. Just I believe that when it comes to Radars, it's a very complex process and it requires a lot of technical knowledge. I just wanted to understand how our R&D team is doing. If you can give a share in such a story that we had in the recent past, I don't know how do you plan on upskilling for the development roles that we receive? Do we have collaborations with foreign universities, foreign businesses? We started building radar components and parts with DRDO over the last 20 years or 18 years. Then we started building upgrade programs. We get the competency of IP and software and domain, other than just electronics. We started contributing towards upgrades of radars for the tracking radars. We delivered about six tracking radars upgrades for them. Our operation was in 10, 15 years with Sriharikota and Thiruvananthapuram. So this is where we started learning. Then we started building our own surveillance radar, again, open data with ISRO. And ISRO allows us to build a full radar. So we started learning outside. We're doing very modern systems with DRDO on the subsystem levels. But the domain, etc., we've started doing outside. So we started actually putting non-different radars where we learned our competencies. And those are installed and working for seven, eight years now. When the opportunity came with MOD tenders, representation for this radar, we decided to develop the radar from scratch. We were lucky that we could master the radar in 18 months from scratch. We won the contract for about INR 380 crores. INR 250 crores to be delivered in two and a half years. We delivered last year. Last quarter, we delivered the full system. We expect some more orders if at all, if it happens with customer request. We'll get more. This has been a long journey and putting products. We have a domain team continuously engaged in development of radars. We're now participating in making programs in MOD. We have a couple of export contracts for radars, which we're developing for one European country as well as a South Asian country. We've got some few radars orders. We're developing and probably execute this. This is our IP and our Radar, so we are investing continuously in Radar development and IP development, not only in Radars, but also in electronic warfare. We are fortunate to work with DRDO for many years now and learn with them and build products for them and, in the process, learn domain and competencies and capabilities so that we can address the future requirements of India on the EW program, which also is exportable, so it has been a continuous journey. It's not an overnight thing, and we don't have foreign collaboration. It's all India and DRDO, what we've done, ISRO, and other areas where we've studied books, go implement, study, trial, correct, learn. It's been a process. Thank you, sir. The research team worked very well. Thank you. Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, we have reached the end of the question and answer session. I would now like to hand the conference over to the management for closing comments. Thank you, everyone, for attending this conference. Thank you for all the very interesting questions about our company. We are interested in scaling the organization as we go along. It's been a long journey for Data Patterns. It's not a startup, though we behave like a startup within the organization. We've built up competencies over many areas. Process, infrastructure, all of them done. The markets have opened up largely. So we are developing products for addressing the market to increase our total address to market. We are in line with whatever we are doing. We are in parts of underdevelopment. We expect that we'll scale the next three to five years. We need to substantially scale the organization. We're giving infrastructure to meet that expectation. And the government is very motivated to do more in India. That is the right kind of, that's the right thing for us because we've always been seeing made in India with pride. We hope to do a lot more and scale the business. If you have any further questions, kindly address the questions in Go India. You'll be free to, we'll be very glad to answer those questions. Thank you very much. Thank you for the call. Thanks. Thank you. On behalf of Go India Advisors, this concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us. You may now disconnect.