Good morning, ladies and gentlemen, and welcome to the earnings conference call of ICICI Securities Limited for the quarter ended June 30th, 2023. We have with us today on the call Mr. Vijay Chandok, Managing Director and Chief Executive Officer, Mr. Harvinder Jaspal, Chief Financial Officer, Mr. Vishal Gulechha, Head Retail Equities, Mr. Kedar Deshpande, Head Retail Distribution, Products, and Services Group, Mr. Anupam Guha, Head Private Wealth Management, Mr. Ketan Karkhanis, Head Digital Client Acquisition and Co-Head New Solutions Group, Mr. Nilotpal Gupta, Head Data Science Unit, and Mr. R. Balaji, Chief Technology Officer. For the duration of this presentation, all participant lines will be in the listen-only mode. I will be standing by for the Q&A session. Should you need assistance during the conference call, please signal an operator by pressing star then zero on a touchtone phone. Please note that this conference is being recorded. The business presentation can be found on the company's corporate website, icicisecurities.com, under Investor Relations. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Vijay Chandok, MD and CEO, ICICI Securities. Thank you. Over to you, sir. Thank you very much. A very good morning to all of you, and welcome to the ICICI Securities Quarter One earnings call for fiscal 2024. I hope by now that you had a chance to peruse through our investor presentations, which was uploaded after our board meeting late last evening. I will start with a few highlights on the industry and then take you very quickly and briefly through the performance of the company. When we look at quarter one for FY 2024, I think it's fair to say it was positive for most of the industry parameters. I'll take you through one by one. Finally, cash equity, retail ADTOs grew sequentially by 12%. This is after a gap of almost 4 or 4.5 quarters. Retail derivatives, ADTO grew by about 14% sequentially. The growth on retail derivatives continues. SIP momentum, which has been growing at a very healthy clip, over the last few quarters, continued during this quarter as well. Overall, equity capital markets saw an improvement in the activities compared to the previous quarter, and this improvement in activity was particularly visible in the later part of May and certainly in June, and we can see that momentum strengthening as we've entered quarter two. In the backdrop of this kind of an operating environment, we are happy to report a revenue growth of about 18% on a YOY basis, 6% on a sequential basis, recording INR 934 crores for this quarter. Simultaneously, profit after tax for this quarter grew by about 3% to about INR 270 crores. However, it was marginally down by about 1% on a YOY basis. When we look at the performance highlights, 3 points are noteworthy: We saw revenue growth across all business segments. Secondly, we clearly saw a gain in market share, or we held market share across almost all the revenue generating parameters that we track. We continue to see focus on the key business areas that are the growth drivers that we had articulated to you in the earlier presentations. With regards to the revenue growth, all our businesses saw an increase in revenue when you compare it on a YOY basis. We continue to trust on growing and pivoting revenue mix towards more structural opportunities, while maximizing revenue opportunities from some of the cyclical components, that's what played out in this quarter. With regards to market share, we witnessed steady growth in retail market share. As far as cash equity is concerned, you would have seen a reported number, which is up 253 basis points YOY to 12.2%. I would just like to point out this is not strictly comparable because NSE changed in the month of March, the series with which they are giving out data. When you look at the data, even from March, April, May, June, month-on-month sequential gains in market share is clearly visible on a comparable basis. As far as retail derivatives is concerned, market share increased by about 16 basis points on a YOY basis. Commodity market share started, which has also shown a healthy increase of about 280 basis points on a YOY basis, and recorded a number of about 7.2% for this quarter. As far as Margin Trade Funding and the mutual fund AUM is concerned, the market share remained stable at about 22%. We continue to remain market leaders on MTF, and 1.7% as far as the AUM on mutual fund is concerned. As we move forward, we continue to focus on the quality of clients, and that is precisely what is helping us gain or rather improve our market share in most of the revenue-giving parameters. As. I would also like to point out that the customer assets, which are an important source of overall monetizable AUM, continue to show an improving trust. Our AUM at a firm level increased by 17% on a YOY basis, moved and clocked in at about INR 6.2 trillion. In that the wealth AUM grew by about 25% on a Y-o-Y basis, came in at about INR 3.5 trillion. We continue to see strong traction in the wealth segment, which is one of our important growth drivers. As we look at some of the articulated areas of growth, we notice that we are seeing all the growth levers, whether it is wealth management, the derivative business, loans, and insurance, all of these are showing the growth momentum and details are available in the investor presentations. Just like to make a last comment on cost. Cost, you would notice, is up by 33% on a year-over-year basis. However, if you dissect cost and look at the components of the increases, you will notice that the increase in cost is attributable to increase in employee costs, which is pertaining to annual increments, stock options and grants that were given. Some new hiring that we have done, specifically in the area of technology, analytics, wealth management, and what we call digital assist employees. All these costs, we believe, have a component of operating leverage because this is increased capacity, and the opportunity in the market is yet to be fully harnessed by these investments. The second component of cost increase is on franchise-enhancing technology. Again, many of which are improving customer experiences and giving us tools to increase operating leverage as market conditions improve. Finally, the third component of cost was pertaining to the cost of funds, pertaining to our margin finance book. We have been also saying that we had taken a very conscious call to not fully pass on the cost of these increases in the last year. We believe, as we move forward, some of the steps that we took in bits of last quarter should fully start, and this quarter should fully start playing out during most part of this remaining part of this year, as well as we are seeing costs in some sense, peaking out. That is, again, we believe, in some sense, an operating leverage kind of a cost increase. Efforts are on personalization and investments in technologies and analytics continue to yield results. Number of customers with two or more products increased to about 1.23 million in quarter one, compared to about 1.17 last year. This is also helping us in diversification of revenue. To conclude, I'd just say that we continue to believe in the medium-term story. As we've entered into quarter two, even the short-term story is looking quite strong. The environment is looking positive, we are strategically paced to harness the opportunities, by making all the relevant opportunities in the key focus areas of growth. I'll end my commentary and throw it open for questions and answers that you may have. Thank you. Should we open the floor for Q&A? Thank you very much. We will now begin the question-and-answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on their touch-tone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and two. Participants are requested to use answers while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. Our first question is from the line of Prayesh Jain from Motilal Oswal. Please go ahead. Hi, good morning, everyone. I have four questions. Firstly, on the cost that you mentioned there, do you think that this rate of employee cost will be sustained going ahead at this current absolute number, and the variable pay that would have been given in 1Q? Generally, this variable pay is amortized over four quarters, or is basically distributed over the four quarters for the full year? Is it kind of, you know, provision only, it's on a pay on a cash basis, wherein, in 1Q will have a higher variable pay, and the next three quarters will not have a variable pay component or high variable pay component? That is one. Second is on the Margin Trade Funding book. In the past, we recollect that, you know, you had mentioned that you will pass on some bit of cost to the customers, but, you know, we've seen that that has not come across. You mentioned in your opening remarks that you have taken a conscious call, but kind of that is impacting your profitability meaningfully, because that is a decent contributor to your revenues and profitability now. Third and fourth are primarily on distribution front. Firstly, on the life insurance front, we've seen your yield going up to 15.3%. This is, you know, so whether we can expect this convert, this yield to be sustained, or is there any some runoff out here? Lastly, you know, this has been my recurring question to you guys every quarter possibly now. If I look at your AUM or just, you know, flows, consistently declining, and even on the AUM side, your yields until some time have been declining. What's the key fact? What's the key driver there? You know, the mutual fund segment performance seems to be on the weaker side, in spite of the entire market doing so well. Yeah, those would be my four questions. Thank you so much. Hi, Prayesh. Good morning. I'll take a couple of them, and then I'll pass it down. The first question that you mentioned is on the employee cost. first of all, the accounting bit. The variable cost is amortized over four quarters. This is the run rate that you should expect over the four quarters. In variable, obviously, there'll be some correlation to revenue. As revenue grows, as a percentage variable might see an increase in absolute terms, but the percentage to revenue remains in a very narrow range, but it gets amortized over four quarters. That kind of leads me to your second question as well, that whether this level of employee cost will sustain. For this four quarters, as we had earlier also highlighted, that FY 2024 is a year that we are our investment should pan out. The increases that have happened are because of increases in headcount and obviously annual increments, et cetera. All that has already got factored in Q1. Materially, I would not expect things to be very different in the coming couple of quarters, 2 or 3 quarters, till again, we hit the next increment on employee cost. Hope that answers your first question. Your second question was on the Margin Trade Funding book. Yes, we have not been able to fully pass on. We mentioned in the last call as well, that out of the 250 basis point increase that we have seen over the last 5 quarters, we have been able to pass on roughly about 36% to 40% of that. However, I mean, if the yields or cost of borrowing starts softening up with no further rate hikes, we can see this stabilizing. It's already stabilizing at about 3% NIM. So we can see it stabilizing. Whether we'll be able to increase it further is something that we will keep taking a judicious call as we move ahead into the year. So that was on the MTF. Your third question was. Life insurance. On life insurance yield. Yes, we have seen some increases in yield for first quarter. There are two reasons for that. Typically, in the first quarter, the mix of new business and renewal is slightly tilted to new business, as seasonality is low. Second thing is that there has been an increase in run rates of commission as well. With more, with the new regulatory regime in IRDAI, there has been some upward revision. Yes, our belief is that it should be on a new business basis, it should be sustainable going forward as well. Your fourth question, I think, was on mutual fund, mutual fund SIP market share. Yeah. On mutual fund, you know, what we've seen is that we are able to maintain in terms of AUM, we have been able to maintain market share. In terms of SIP, we are not yet seeing any, I would say, improved option on market share front. We are dealing with the challenge of facing competition from the direct plan. You know, we continue to put our efforts there, but I think results are yet to play out there. Okay. Thank you so much. Thank you. Before we take the next question, a reminder to all participants that you may press star and one to ask a question. Our next question is from the line of Aejaz Lakhani from Unify Capital. Please go ahead. Yeah. Hi, gentlemen, good morning. My first question is on the derivatives segment. Now, for about four quarters flat, you know, in terms of growth has been, relatively, bunched or ballparked, when the industry, if you have been growing in, you know, double digits. Sir, as you mentioned, you know, in several calls that we've been investing behind this segment, and we have possibly the best IOs and tools available. Could you quantify the inability to, you know, gain market shares over the last couple of quarters? What has been the reason? Could you throw some more light on this segment first, sir? See, the way, we measure derivatives, performance, these are on four different counts. One is the market share, the second is the revenue, and volume, and the fourth thing is number of customers. We have been investing in modernizing our entire products and feature stake, and we see results coming in, but at a slower pace. However, we have kept pace in terms of the market, progression on all four parameters. Even the last quarters, which went, the number of customers, market share, revenue, I think we were almost close to our highs. The pace has been slow, but, I'll say that we remain very, very steady in terms of our positioning in the market. The new properties which we rolled out, we see higher engagement coming from customers on all those properties and features which we rolled out in last 18 months or so. The traction has been increasing, you know, with every single day. I mean, that's what I'll say, that we will have to just wait and watch this space. Otherwise, number of orders, customer engagement, number of customers. I mean, every single parameter has shown a year-on-year healthy growth. Ajit, I would just like to add, if you look at all the efforts that have been going in this direction, it would be fair to say investments, on many of the fronts are sort of done with. The areas that, you know, are coming in the way of increasing market share at a more rapid pace than whatever we have done so far, are, I would say, two. One is, intensification of marketing efforts, particularly below the line, in, into direct channels. The second area is, in terms of performance of our apps. We do notice that, you know, there are some performance-related improvements that we need to do, and that will improve the performance experience. I suppose that once these areas are fixed sometime during the course of this quarter. In marketing efforts also have been on an intense focus. We'll continue to invest there. Both marketing, product awareness, tool awareness, as well as performance of the tools. Very, very specific notified improvements on tools. It's not about adding tools, but improving the features of some of the tools we've added. All these have been notified. These are extremely, I would say, sharp, identified intervention. One by one, we are doing, and as we have been doing it, we are seeing upticks on those, each of those products. Our focus over the next, I would say 60, 90, 120 days, would be on these sharply identified areas. We have a great brand, we have improving customer. We just need to maintain consistency. We need to increase awareness, and that's what our focus is. We are optimistic, given where the market is headed, given what our positioning is, given what our proposition is, it's just a matter of time. We also believe that, you know, just like you've seen an improvement in market share with respect to equities, right? One of the reasons for that we've always probably maintained, is that there is an others component in this area, which we are seeing has possibly increased. If you look at the market share computation, and the denominator has got another component, which was much smaller several quarters back. We feel that if you really look at equity, our market positioning would be far better than what, you know, is getting reported here. We do measure it on some of the other parameters, and we can see that our market share continues to show an improving trend, which may not necessarily be as sharply reflected in the overall ADTV. Thank you, Mr. Chandok. That's very helpful. Just one follow-up on that. You know, you mentioned the F&O orders, lot sizes, customers groups, Y-o-Y, just sequentially, did they also, all these three parameters were higher sequentially or no? Could you quantify that? One thing, the quarter one was particularly impacted by number of working days, right? That was one factor which played out, and particularly in derivatives, this is a big lever. As and when we have, you know, full month to play, all the parameters will show a very, very healthy trend. As far as derivatives broking is concerned, because the lot per order size has increased, we, I mean, we are more flattish on that count. However, there are many other income associated with the derivatives. There we have seen a growth. Even within the quarter, if I see all three months, we have better than the previous month on all three counts, whether it is market share, number of customers, as well as volume. Got it. Mr. Chandok, my second question is regarding the MTF book. You know, here are, you know, very, you know, besides what you have already mentioned in your opening remarks, the strategy here was about client penetration, you know, from the 85,000 customers that you had. You've had a very strong market environment, but the average book has broadly remained, you know, constant. Is it that, you know, we've hit a wall in terms of our ability to penetrate or gain market share? Could you please comment? Yeah, I think that's a great question, and I'll take you back into our earlier conversation. As far as margin finance is concerned, we run with no targets. We believe it's a service and a facility which is available to the customer. We make it easy for him to access it, but we leave the kind of choice. We make it aware to a larger number of customers. We assist them in understanding it, but we leave it for them to take a choice. This specific quarter, if you notice, markets went up, and a lot of customers chose to liquidate their position, which we think is very healthy for the market. People should make money in the market. That's more important than anything else, and that's what we saw. A lot of our customers actually cashed out and then reentered into fresh positions. A lot of churn happened, a lot of profit booking happened, and that we believe is healthy, because that will encourage people to come back, and come back in larger numbers. That is what we are beginning to see as we entered into quarter, what should I say? Quarter 2. In the last 15, 20 days, we could see a noticeable surge in the numbers that with which we ended quarter on the 30th of this June. Got it. That's helpful. Sir, has there been an increase in the number of MTF customers? QoQ? Yeah. As the MD briefed, that we see more of unwinding in the current phase at this point of time. What happens typically in this kind of market, the small customers who have been waiting for long, sitting on the position, they exit and they wait for better times. However, on the other side, the matured customers who understand the market, wait for breakouts, et cetera, they increase their position. Exactly the same trend we noticed this time around also. We saw small investors exiting their positions at profit, and the matured investors increasing their position. Numbers in this quarter, MTF, and traded customers have not increased, but we are happy with the pace, considering the, you know, fact that there are many customers who have booked very healthy profit in this quarter. No doubt. Sir, on the increase in employee cost, could you quantify, you know, in any metric that you prefer, whether it is% or absolute numbers, how much was it on increase of new addition that you have made in the tech team? How much has come from the annual increments? Yeah. From the annual increments, between these two parameters, it should be roughly half and half, it is. In terms of the quantum of increase, the total headcount went up for on a YOY basis, I'm saying, from about 4,300 to about 4,600. This was the increase, which is a growth of about 7%, and roughly about 10% of the remaining would be on account of the inflation fee. Thanks, Harvinder. Sir, could you finally speak about the new initiative that we have, which is targeted towards the young audience? Where are we in that journey? It appears to us that there have been some delays from earlier calls, from a launch perspective. Could you just speak about where we are in that journey? Thanks, thanks for bringing that up. We have, you know, called this new proposition Mintr, M-I-N-T-R, by ICICIdirect. It has already been done a soft launch, available on the beta, in a beta version, test version, in the app and the Play Store. We have launched the Direct mutual fund version right now, we have not spent even $1 on the promotion or. We are just allowing organic embracement of this product right now. We are simultaneously building the equity stack. The direct equity stack should be in place during the course of this calendar year for sure. Once we bring the equity and mutual fund is already there. Once we add the, bolt on the equity stack to it, we've added actually three modules. Mutual fund is there, the learn module is there, we are shortly bringing the social module. We will add the next module, which is the equities module. That is when we will start the promotion and the, you know, popularization of the product. This calendar year, you will, you should definitely see all of this completed. Got it, sir. Thanks. My questions are done. I'll follow up. Thanks. Thank you. A reminder to all participants, you may press star and one to ask a question. Our next question is from the line of Kunal Shah from Carnelian Asset Management. Please go ahead. Hi, hi. Thank you for the opportunity. Sorry if I have, if you've answered this question, you can ignore. I got in joined a little late. I just wanted to understand on this mutual funds piece, right? On a quarter-on-quarter basis, the yields have kind of come down. Also, the SIP flow market share, I mean, it could help understand what's happening out there to get a better sense. That was the first question. Second question, just wanted to understand, I know bank has taken the call to kind of, you know, yield, but wanted to have your thoughts again, this when the market environment is improving and we are starting to see the results getting reflected in the numbers as well, in terms of market share improvement and all. What's your, as management thought on the same, if you would want to highlight the same? Thanks. Your first question was on SIP, right? Yeah, mutual funds and, SIP and yield, both. Yeah. Kunal, on market share, yeah, we did answer this question, but quickly, we'll brief you. Yes, we have faced a bit of a challenge on SIP flow market share. Two reasons. One is, we've seen an increase in proportion of direct plan, that has grown at a higher pace. Within the regular market, although we don't publish it like that, we don't see it also like that, because it's the entire opportunity that we're trying to target. Within the regular plan, the market share has been largely stable. However, with the increasing proportion of direct plan, the flows have kept on coming down. Although, just to highlight, we continue to hold our position in terms of the count of SIPs in terms of rank and even the rank in terms of the flow. However, the share has gone down. Also, on a overall MF AUM market share, that also on a YOY basis has been flat at about 1.7%. Broadly these are the parameters. So your second question was on? Yeah, your first question, earlier, you know, so, what you mentioned, kind of gets reflected in the numbers, but if you could share a little bit on the qualitative aspects as to why this has happened, would be really helpful. You said that you are facing some challenges, but what exactly challenges would be really helpful? I think it's been two quarters now, even in the last quarter, I mean, the management mentioned that, you know, we are taking action and we should see improvement. If you can share specific factors that are kind of impacting, would be really helpful. Hello? I mean, there are two, three reasons which we are still struggling with to get incremental market share. If you really look at the SIP book that is getting added, A, it is at the lower ticket size, and the longevity of that book is hardly three, four months. A, B, the mutual fund partners who are bumping in SIP books are directly acquiring clients, whereas we are actually looking at quality client acquisition, and on those quality client acquisition, we are also selling SIPs. Technically, that book is growing slower than the market. If you actually compare our SIP book growth with the bank-led partners or the distribution-led partners, we are on par. If you compare it with the digital distribution partners, then it is visibly falling, and we have to work on that vector very consciously. Okay. Okay, thanks. Yeah, you, your second question was on. Mm. On the planned intervention happening on the delisting side, I think. That was your second question, right? Yeah. Yes, that was. Yeah. This was, this is an action, you know, sort of, from the shareholder side, so, you know, they would be the right people to comment on this. I mean, I really don't know what really you're expecting me to speak on this. Okay, fair enough. Just wanted to understand your thoughts, if you would want to share anything or if you would like to share anything. I understand that they are the shareholder and they've taken this call, but anything you would want to share on this particular aspect? No, I think we've clearly explained the rationale why that is being done, the methodology in which that is being done, and the process that is being followed. I mean, beyond that, there's nothing more that one can add on on this. Okay. Thanks for your time. Okay. Thank you. Before we take the next question, a reminder to all participants, you may press star and 1 to ask a question. Our next question is from the line of Dipanjan Ghosh from Citi. Please go ahead. Hi, good morning. Just one question from my side. you know, you mentioned on the increase in realizations on the insurance policies for the new circular. just wanted to get some sense on whether it is equally spread across life and non-life? I mean, which of the manufacturers were relatively more, you know, interested in increasing the realization? Is it the incumbents, the larger players or the smaller players? If you can give some color on that. As of now, the health insurance players have jumped up the commission because they pay commissions every year, and hence it's more tangible for them. Because of the regulation change, their commissions have gone up substantially. Life insurance players are still figuring out because they have a long duration paper, and some of that commission comes upfront, some of that commission comes as trail. There, as of now, the growths are relatively lesser, but it is across all partners that we have. General insurance is somewhere in between life and health insurance, because on many of the general insurance products, actually there is no likelihood of growth, and on health, et cetera, they have given same sort of growth as the health insurance players. Sure. We will see substantial jump in the revenues that we make, very clearly from next quarter. Just one follow-up on this. I mean, I would agree that a major proportion of this increase is on the new business? That is correct. The increase would be, on the new business. Any increases in renewal, obviously, will start following through, from FY 2025 onwards. Got it. Just one question on the cost bit. Now, you know, you had earlier guided that your cost strategy will gradually even over the next four quarters as and when. Because again, you mentioned that in one quarter, most of manpower already shared and, you know, some of these costs have already been incurred. You know, from a relatively longer perspective, you know, I have been asking this question sometimes. Do you see some pressure from a, from a cost rate, I mean, retention, customer retention cost perspective, given that, you know, most of the other players or platforms will gradually over a period of time, try to scale up to a similar sort of a proposition in the marketplace? Maybe you have a head start today, but maybe five, four, five years out, that can get kind of absorbed by the other players. We just want to get some sense of that when you kind of budget your little medium to long-term cost. Sorry, your question is what is the outlook on cost over a slightly longer term? Yes. Yes. On the customer retention part, I mean, I would believe that over a longer period of time, for a retail customer and even affluent customer, the switching cost tends to become low as the product availability or the service availability on some of the other platforms broadly become similar to what you have been offering today. Today you have a head start in terms of your wealth strategy, but others will gradually also try to scale up, is my understanding. Yeah. From a cost outlook point of view, what we have sort of guided is that our cost-to-income ratio, as you know, was somewhere around 45% last year. This I'm talking about FY 2023. If you trace it back a little bit into the past, it was much lower at about 39%. The reason why we started going through this increase in cost was because we could clearly see frontloading, you know, just after COVID, of the digital opportunity. We could see improving macros, et cetera. We felt the market is going to throw an opportunity, and we said that we should be ready to take advantage of those spots that come up. That was, and also make our company future-ready. That was the intent with which we started scaling up in the areas of growth, which is reflected in the improved increase in cost-to-income ratio. As we move forward, our intent is to demonstrate operating leverage. You know, if you trace our last 4 years' history, you will see that we have demonstrated operating leverage. We have increased the cost structure to prepare for the next wave of growth, which is what we are going through. I think by and large, this year we'll be done with our cost increases. Thereafter, we do not anticipate too many, you know, sort of disproportionate increases to cost structure. We are wanting to bring this down, and we are hopeful that in the next couple of years, we should start seeing the trajectory keeping downwards closer to, you know, I would say sub-40. Got it. Our idea is to bring it down actually to the mid-thirties, as close as possible to that. Just one strong question on the wealth bit. I mean, what proportion of your wealth clients, I believe a big proportion of your wealth clients will be organic. Maybe, you know, developed through the funnel from the broking to distribution to wealth. Do you also do open market sourcing? If so, you know, what is the strategy around that? Yeah, hi. For us, you know, our single biggest, really strength, I would say, is we have access to clients. We all understand that business is all about clients and, you know, access. We have a very large pool of customer base that we've acquired over the last 20 odd years. What we've been able to do of late, and, you know, it is reflected in some of the strong numbers that we've been able to show on growth in the wealth side, has really been able to identify, you know, large pool of gold mines to wealth market, and really, kind of do a more sharper engagement with that client base. For us, we strong growth in clients, almost 90% of it is through the, I would say, internal base, where we are able to engage and really take them to a logical share of wallet, and 10% is really the open market growth. Got it. Do you expect that ratio to remain similar or kind of change? Yeah, I believe so, because that's really our strength, right? The access to clients. Finally, it's going to also see the products that we have. Finally, what we are giving our clients is really the access to India opportunity, right? Most of this wealth is new wealth, the wealth that got created, first-generation wealth, and all of them are very keen to invest into the Indian equity market, so to say. Whether it's access to the capital market, equity research, all of those, I think all those wealth, it all has to kind of come together to kind of see the success that we're able to see today. Sure. Thanks for the clarification on all of it. Thank you. Thank you. Our next question is from the line of Digant Haria from GreenEdge Wealth Services. Please go ahead. Yeah, good morning, everyone. My first question is actually a little bit more of a macro question that, see the cash ADTO, you know, India in general, and for us, we peaked in, say, you know, 2021. You know, the index is up reasonably high, and, you know, we've still not seen those levels in the cash ADTO, despite, you know, these new products like Stock SIPs and smallcase and Stock Baskets. Just any comment on, you know, like, why this is so? You know, like, what do you see especially, is this equity baskets and smallcase, are they contributing in any meaningful way to the cash ADTO for us as well? Yeah, I think that's a great question, Digant. What we have observed in the market, one of the biggest drivers of participation is liquidity. You know, the more the margin, the more difficult you will find volume growth. If you notice, you know, you referred to the highs of the past, right? At that point in time, the extent of margins that were there for cash was much lower than what it is now. Today, there is no difference between, you know, intraday, overnight, et cetera. Margin increases is one of the reasons why there has been a kind of a weakness relative to the past peaks in cash market, and on the contrary, it has given an impetus to F&O. Because it's much easier in terms of, you know, your own wallet contribution to participate in the F&O. There is a number of expiry increases that you would have noticed in the past. Every time there's an expiry increase, it just throws open a much lower cost, entry cost, opportunity for retail investors. On the 1 side, there is everything which is, you know, increasing the attractiveness and the ease of entry into the F&O market, and reducing the attractiveness of the cash market. Given this kind of a macro development, we are seeing the, you know, industry trends play out in this kind of a fashion. Your questions around, you know, Stock Baskets, et cetera, et cetera, these are things which people find it very attractive, but have they sort of moved, you know, set teams on fire, probably speaking? The answer is really no. They interest, you know, young investors, but revenue, volume, participation, et cetera, if that is what you're looking at, then most of that will be coming from the, you know, F&O opportunity. All right. All right. Thanks, Vijay. That's a very good explanation, that India is always gravitating towards the intraday and option, you know, the very, very short term, low capital requirement kind of trading. Yeah, thanks for that. Second question is, you know, slightly, you know, we've never generally discussed much about the investment banking division, right? You know, we've seen so many IPOs coming and so many more in the pipeline. You know, ICICI was always amongst the leaders, you know, in the last decade. You know, now in this whole new startup ecosystem, which is going to IPO over many years, you know, from now. You know, how... You know, can you just explain the last four, five years, like, in terms of leadership and in terms of what, you know, how has ICICI, probably, I wouldn't say changed itself, but, you know, made itself very relevant even in this whole new ecosystem? Yeah. Again, thanks for this question. I think, let me explain to you know, how things have changed, what kind of strategy pivots we have made here. If you look at, let's start in the last 7, 8 years time horizon, you're right, we've always been amongst the top 3 players in the Indian market. If you look at what happened in the last 3 years, we have moved away from the top 3 position to the top position. If you look at 2021, we have decisively, you know, been the market leader there, as the number 1 player. We got the Asiamoney Award 2021, 2022, we've just got the Best Equity House Award again from Asiamoney in 2023. One of the reasons why this has happened is because we took three, four important calls. Number one, we massively strengthened our research capabilities. We hired the best people, we eased out the sort of the method in which we compensate people there, and we got the best talent in the industry. Our research team, which was not necessarily, you know, considered the absolute benchmark today, we have very, very good research team strength. The second is we have, you know, strengthened our sectoral coverage, sharpened that a lot more. If you look at some of the sectors where we have a, I would say, not a strong, but a dominant position, one of them would be BFSI. BFSI, we have a market share of 90%. 9 out of 10 deals that have happened in the Indian market has happened through us. The second space we are quite very strong, I would say, is on the infrastructure, the InvIT REIT side of it. We have a market share of 9 on 10. The third sector that we are I would say reasonably strong, is on the tech side, the fintech side, where most of this new age guys, you know, we have a market share. It's again a very, very high market share. The other thing noticeably about ICICI is that our approach to this market has been that, you know, you look at the whole life journey. It is not about only the IPO. It is before the IPO, during the IPO, and after the IPO, because there is a whole monetization capability, before and after, that for the investment banking team. It's a journey with each client. It starts with the IPO preparation, it then goes to left lead, where we get extra sort of revenue. Most of these deals, actually, we started becoming left lead now, which was not the case in the past. There, which is, which includes liaising with SEBI, doing the documentation, et cetera. Then, if you are entrenched into the IPO, then you get an opportunity for doing blocks, because all of these are held by private equities, and many of them want to monetize after listing as well. It throws open block opportunities. That's the approach. It's a lifetime approach. It's a sectoral, sort of a focus approach. It's about strengthening research and sales capabilities and coverage capabilities, which is what we have done. As we speak today, you would have noticed, once again, market has, you know, sort of started strengthening. The demand for participation and new issuances has increased. Likewise, this quarter, we have won about 17 mandates. Most of the mandates that we pitched in, we got. The pipeline is built up quite strongly. The processes with the regulator is what is being sort of pursued. As these processes get sort of approved, in the form of DRHP, et cetera, you'll start seeing issuances coming to the market. I would say that we are pretty well positioned. Our approach is like, you know, end-to-end kind of approach. Approach is to focus on sectors which we believe will keep giving us some opportunity or the other. It tends to smoothen out, I would say, the episodeness of this business. For example, when I say BFSI, it's not just about IPOs, but most of these people follow it up with QIPs later on. Invariably, if you are in the initial relationship with the client, then you keep getting QIP opportunities. That's what we thought. During COVID, we saw almost every bank, every NBFC, raise capital, and you would have noticed we are present in about close to 8.5 to 9 out of those 10 deals that have happened during that period. It's a opportunity to smoothen out. It's an opportunity to penetrate. It's an opportunity to monetize even post, I would say, IPO listing. That's the approach we have followed. As far as coverage of sales is concerned, we have looked at moving more and more strongly into the flow side of business. Our market shares there have also improved. We are in the ballpark of about 7.5% market share range as far as the, you know, institutional side of the business is concerned. A lot of it attributable to the flows business. Again, the flows business tends to be a lot more, you know, predictable and somewhat secular compared to episodeness that otherwise marked in this kind of a business. That's broadly the approach. I think we are well-positioned. This team also, I must say, works very closely with our wealth team. What Anupam drives, you know, both sides. Sometimes, the wealth team refers the IPOs, sometimes it's the other way around, the IPO team, the investment banking team refers wealth customers, not just the owners, but also the larger senior team. There we have an, you know, sort of a beachhead entry into these customers. That's how we are, you know, sort of symbiotically trying to build, the investment banking side of the business. Perfect. That's really detailed, thank you. Just one thing, you know, you mentioned that this business, the episodic nature, should reduce versus last decade. That's what you are also saying, right? That probably this next 5, 6 years, it should be a little more consistent business than what we saw in the last decade, though we were always number 1, 2, or 3, even in the last decade. Yeah. One of the reasons for that is that, number one, the supply side should keep increasing. I think market, the capital markets have started, accepting new companies start up a lot more than in the past. Simply speaking, you for that reflected in, let's say, a number of unicorns, if you were to believe whatever numbers are put out in the chart. The number of unicorns, the number of potential unicorns and so on and so forth, there's a large pipeline already existing. This kind of an, you know, sort of entrepreneurship supply never existed 10 years back. Given what, you know, is there on the table today, assuming that, you know, this fabric does not change, it only intensifies the interest towards India, intensifies more and more, in, you know, foreign investors, domestic investors want to participate in growth of the country. Supply of capital is there, and the availability, मतलब absorption capability is also getting built up, simultaneously, which was not necessarily the comparable case a decade back. Perfect. Perfect. Thank you. Thank you so much. I think that's it from my side. Wish you all the best. Thank you. That was the last question of our question and answer session. I would now like to hand over the conference call over to Mr. Vijay Chandok, MD and CEO, for closing comments. Thank you very much for your participation. I know it's early in the morning. Really appreciate your presence, your questions. I hope we've been able to answer all your questions. In case there are some more follow-ups that are required, we are always available. You have our IR team ready to respond to you. Thank you once again for all the support you've been giving us. Good day. Thank you. On behalf of ICICI Securities, that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us, and you may now disconnect your lines.