Good morning, good afternoon, everybody, and welcome to the VEF year-end and Q4 2020 results call. I'm Dave Nangle, I'm the CEO of VEF. I'm happy to have you all here with us today. What I'll do, as per usual, is a 15- 20- minute presentation update on the year gone by and what to expect in the year coming forward, more importantly, and then open up for any questions that anybody has, as per usual, at the end of the call. Our slide deck is online on our website, and it's also via the video chat that we're doing right now, the video bar. Highlights for Q4 2020. Getting into the key points on slide number two. I think what I'd say is we came into 2020 very optimistic for all things fintech, emerging markets, and at VEF, and we ended the year on a very strong note. There were a lot of movements in between, given the movements in COVID, into macro, into digital. What I'd say is Q4 was a very strong way to end the year. Across the board, us as a company and our portfolio companies through which we benefit, are really benefiting from the step change shift to digital financial services and a tailwind, which just goes with that to the emerging markets. That was obviously helped by COVID, one of the positives we saw from a structural change point of view. From a numbers point of view, NAV, share price, all at record highs at year end. NAV per share at SEK 3.83, at $0.47. It was a 24% year-on-year growth in our NAV per share. A lot of movement within that over the course of the year. I'll get into that. Also from a total NAV, we ended the year at $388 million, part of which was the Q4 capital raise, which helped to drive the total NAV higher. A lot of that was actually incremental value-added growth coming through. We're at the biggest size and shape that we've ever been. We continue to add value and grow in terms of NAV per share and share price. The highlight of driving that is our portfolio North Star, which is Creditas. It's now 44% of our NAV, some concentration there. We're very happy with that. They had a benchmark Series D funding round in Q4, $255 million, of which we took part with a stake of $25 million. That values the company now at $1.75 billion after that round. It's their first unicorn. Not that we like to use that word too much, but it's our first multi-billion-dollar company of note, having invested in its first back in 2017 and watching it grow into the size and shape that it is today. It's still at a very early innings in the story, which is probably the most exciting part for Creditas and for us as investors. The share placement was a first in Q4 since our inception back in 2015. With support of current and new shareholders, we raised just over $60 million by a directed placement to continue the mandate. It's been five years in the going. It's been working. We're creating value. We're in a very strong place to continue to do that, and we like the fact that our shareholders stepped up and supported us in this window, and was very gratefully received. The final point with the name change, it was a busy quarter on many fronts, but we changed our name officially from Vostok Emerging Finance to VEF, just shortening it up. Given the fact that we're a much broader investment company than our Russian history had us in its focus, VEF seemed more ideal and apt for this stage of our development. Looking at some of the numbers in a touch more detail. As I said, the NAV from a US dollar point of view, nearly $400 million, $388 million in Q4, up from $268 million in Q3. The NAV increased to $120 million, approximately half on half of that. Half was through growth in the valuation of the portfolio and half of that was through fresh capital coming in from the placement, which I mentioned. From a share point of view, or from NAV per share point of view, obviously, we focused on the SEK move and the dollar move because we have investors in both geographies. The dollar move was indeed stronger, north of 20% year-on-year from a NAV per share, where SEK on a year-on-year basis was 8%, quarter-on-quarter 6%. Obviously, the SEK has been strong vis-a-vis the dollar, hence the disparity in movement there. Then our share price was up nearly 40% in SEK. We were quoted in Sweden last year. A strong year, albeit a lot of movement in that as there were with a lot of our peers, given that the COVID hit early on into the positive trends through the second half of 2020. Maybe getting into that in a little bit more detail on slide four, just a slide which shows the evolution of our NAV. This is total NAV in US dollars since inception. It's a nice chart, obviously. Gradually growing and adding value over time. Capital raised back in 2015, the red part of the last bar on the right was capital raised in Q4 2020. Effectively, we've been adding 25%-30% NAV per share and share price value growth per annum over the last five years. The track record is healthy and strong and long may it continue. I guess there is a narrative, a clear narrative through 2020, which we've been talking to, and it's really played out in our NAV. As I said, we came into 2020 quite optimistic after the back of 2019, which we thought was a banner year for us as a company. Two exits, one from Tinkoff, one from iyzico in Turkey, both at 60% IRRs. Creditas and Konfio had raised substantial Series C, Series D funding rounds. Our portfolio was in good shape coming into 2020. We were optimistic for the year ahead. Obviously, with the onset of COVID mid-Feb. The impact of that directly. I guess the forecast impact in March is what led us to take down our NAV in Q1, partly market-led with comms down, FX down. Also, our forecast is feeding into companies getting more conservative at the early part of COVID when one didn't know what was going to happen in terms of depth, longevity, and type of crisis that it would be. Q2 was the gradual return at some levels of confidence, and clarity, and outlook, markets, currencies, and then obviously the forecast of our companies. I guess through Q3 and Q4, it was almost back to what we would see or back to what we expect to see that we were predicting at the start of the year, strong growth across the board, whether it was digital first or digital first at a macro overlay, which is some of the credit companies in our portfolio. Strong growth coming through in NAV and NAV per share in the second half of the year. Moving on to slide five, which is a bit more detailed breakdown of our portfolio and the NAV evolution over Q4 and over year-end. What is of note here is versus the start of the year, you see the step down into Q1, but then the recovery throughout the year and in Q4 across the board, apart from Guiabolso, it was an up quarter-on-quarter for our companies. Creditas is obviously strong in size and shape in terms of the NAV, we'll see the concentration a little bit later on. Also, we're sitting on $52 million as of year-end in terms of cash. Getting into some of the portfolio names, because this is obviously an important part of what we are. We are our companies at the end of the day. We talk a lot about Creditas, we talk a lot about it for very good reasons. I guess one is it's our portfolio North Star. It's everything in a company that we want to invest in. Two, it's 44% of our NAV. If you understand, know, like Creditas, you know nearly 50% of what we're about, at least as we stand today. Also, Creditas is a company which has started to report quarterly information. We have a high or a growing degree of transparency on this asset versus some of our others, where we have less transparency. That's not by design; it's by default, the nature that we're investing in private companies. We see with the likes of Creditas, as they mature, get bigger, and they're starting to move towards IPO, and that ideology transparency comes with it, and they start to share numbers. With that sharing, we can then openly talk about those numbers. I'm very proud to talk about the year they had in 2020, nearly doubling originations, nearly doubling revenues year on year. That's despite Q2 almost turning off the taps in terms of growth in a wait-and-see mode. It's impressive to deliver that kind of growth in a year that we've just seen, and it shows how strong the second half of the year was in terms of originations, in terms of revenue coming through, which bodes well as we look into 2021. This is a company in the core secured lending against homes, against auto, against payroll. We would be expecting a 2x minimum growth in that originations into 2021. The company always pitches a tent higher and looks to achieve more. There could be a spread north of that, albeit we like to be logical, confident, but somewhat conservative in our forecast. I think 2x minimum will be the outlook growth for originations, all other things equal at that story. I think the interesting thing with Creditas is it's gone from this one-dimensional is a bit harsh, but very focused, secured consumer lending machine, which has a serious amount of growth to go in terms of the lending book today is still only between $250 million-$300 million and playing into a multi-hundred billion dollar opportunity. The ability to grow that monoline business across three pillars is very clear multiple years into the future. Now they're deepening into a broader ecosystem play across those three pillars, broadening the product range. They've moved the business into Mexico as a new, fresh growth driver. In terms of Creditas is a success, we would argue Creditas is only getting started. Probably the most exciting thing about Creditas is its getting started and compounding from a bigger base for us. The smaller end of the portfolio companies doubling from $5 million-$ 10 million- $ 20 million is all very good and welcome. Creditas is now $169 million of value in a portfolio of $388 million. You can see what can happen should it continue to grow, and obviously, market multiples valuation feed in and do their work thereafter. Maybe I'll just touch on the Q4 raising from Creditas. Emer spoke about it. It was after the last quarter results session. What I'd say is this is their Series C or Series E. We've come into the story since back in Series C, as you can see from the chart on the right-hand side, and this is on slide number seven. I think what it also attests to is, this is very similar to iyzico in the past, where we always say we're true and fair with our valuations, but they always have a conservative hilt. When it comes to funding rounds or it comes to exits, there always does generally seem to be money on the table. That was again what happened in Series D. You can see the conservative nature of Q1 2020. We didn't know. A lot of uncertain moving parts. We pulled back valuation irrespective of Series D being valued at a higher level back in 2019. The uplift into Q4 was very nice to see. A very positive evolution in mark-to-model, mark-to-last investment round, and a very positive evolution in that story. There's a lot more to come in that. I'm going to touch on three other companies within the portfolio. Less in detail, less numbers given. That's today, but the story will be slightly different tomorrow. The second biggest name in our portfolio is Konfio, and this is evolving now into a digital bank or small business financial services ecosystem for the Mexican market, which badly needs one. They started with a credit-first offering. What we've shown in slide eight is something from their own board decks that they've allowed us to share, is the evolution of the strategy from, and how they're going about it from credit first and then they're doing credit as a service playing on their skill set, but bringing in tech or fee revenue generations. They're moving into the whole ERP space, accounting SaaS areas like Nibo's in our portfolio and Fortnox, just feeding the small business, they've done that by an acquisition, already bought last year. They're also moving into payments. The application for a full banking license is underway. You see this happening in many markets, whether it's Square in the U.S. iZettle, which obviously came out of Scandinavia. StoneCo is the benchmark in Brazil, where they come at it from other payments or some angle. It slowly evolves from that core hook product into a broader product suite for the small business, which has been fundamentally under or badly served by banks forever. That doesn't look like changing. It's these companies which are grabbing that customer, that market share, that grab that value. It's a company if we would say 2020 versus say, like Creditas, because this is a Creditas in the making story for us. 2020 was a sideways year in terms of numbers. A lot more conservative, unsecured lending, small businesses, Mexico. Mexico was worst hit than Brazil last year, at least from a GDP point of view. We're very conservative. It was a very strong crisis for the company in terms of managing the book asset quality. What we really liked is that they put the foot down on growing out their ecosystem, and basically, for the defensive management in a crisis, they were very much progressive forward managing in a crisis. Hence, the movement of the ERP and payments and other areas. I would expect +20% of their revenue base to be non-interest income as I look forward into 2021. Also, the growth in Konfio should be stronger than that, I would expect, versus Creditas. On a like for like basis, Konfio can grow anywhere between two to 5x in terms of their book this year. Given the opportunity, they're first out of the blocks. There's a lot of conservatism in Mexico from the banks and the opportunity is there for them to grow. Two other names, one is Juspay. We touch on that because it's our first Indian investment and it's our only new investment last year. A lot of work, but only one where we wrote the check. Mobile payments in India effectively. I think the chart on the right paints a clear picture on how it's like an index for what we look at or an indicator of where Juspay can go. It's the UPI government-backed, P2P bank backed payment system, UPI transactions in India. Obviously, the curve is very sharp up and to the right. It's an indication of the growth in digital payments in India. Juspay actually processes a lot of this for bank partners, it's actually directly linked to this chart and the growth in it. Also, its mobile payments infrastructure sitting inside apps like Amazon, Uber, and a lot of the big Indian ones like Flipkart, et cetera, where it processes payments or aggregates all the other payments, then takes a small clip, is obviously growing very fast. This is one we've broken off to mark-to-model from previously we've been mark to last investor round. We're still only at about 10x forward revenues on this, it's growing its revenues 2x- 3x a year. I think even though we moved up the valuation, I think conservative is still well baked in in that one. The final point is Nibo, our final company. I could talk about them all. With Nibo, on our recent marketing roadshow, we had a lot of interaction and debate back and forth with Nibo versus Fortnox because Nibo plays in the accounting SaaS space, albeit in the more sizable but less penetrated Brazilian market. We own 20% of that company. We're big fans of the management, the business, and where it can go. We've seen companies like Xero, like freee out of Japan, like Fortnox out of Sweden. The comparison is very clear in terms of very similar-sized customer bases in terms of small businesses. Albeit the addressable market for Nibo, is 20x that of Fortnox, and that's no offense to Fortnox. Fortnox today has a market cap of $3 billion-$ 4 billion, and we're marking Nibo at $65 million. There's a very real reason for that, obviously, because of Nibo's traction revenues, and it's all cross-referenced against market multiples. You can see where Nibo can go versus where Fortnox has gone. We love companies like Fortnox, who provide a playbook for companies in our portfolio and an analogy and a crossover. We see the same very much with FinanZero, into what Lendo has done in the Scandinavian markets. FinanZero is the number one digital loan broker in Brazil, and even for Revo in Russia, and what Klarna has done. Those read acrosses are great. The learnings are great, and we do our best to connect these companies in for mind share and for upside. Coming back a touch to the portfolio itself. This is just to summarize. I said Creditas 44%. It and Konfio now are nearly 60%- 57% of our NAV. Top two companies are 57% and top five are 72% as of year-end, albeit there is a concentration hilt towards Creditas. As I said, we're very comfortable with concentration risk once it's the right kind of concentration risk, and it tends to be when they get to this size and shape. From a geographic perspective, it's still heavily weighted towards LatAm, and that is Creditas and Konfio, obviously, in a nutshell. We have seven of our 12 companies today in LatAm, albeit we've been very encouraged by, I guess, our early foray into India, and the trends that we're seeing in markets like Pakistan, Egypt, et cetera, which I'll talk about in a second. What's coming up? Pipeline. Pipeline is healthy. I'd say the first half of last year. We were more quiet than normal on pipeline because we were working with our portfolio companies through early parts of COVID, and the ideology of spending more dollar outside the portfolio just didn't feel or seem right with the lack of certainty in the market. We had a big push in the second half, back to business as usual, effectively. We turned over about 130 companies through our profiling and through our system and our playbook, as we do. We did one deal last year in Juspay in India. That said, the benefits of that work, and it's always ongoing, is and should play through into the first quarter, in the first half of this year. There's a number of deals that we're working on, albeit smaller in nature, across markets like India, Pakistan, and Mexico. I would be surprised if we weren't announcing in the near future some additions to the portfolio, given all the work we're doing. It's a good time in fintech, in emerging markets. There's a lot of opportunities that we're seeing in the key markets that we look at, and we kind of boil it down to Brazil, Mexico, and India at the larger end. Pakistan and Egypt, specifically in the frontier markets that we like. We have an open eye with markets that we know well historically, like Russia and Turkey. We're getting deeper into Nigeria. Those five are getting a lot of our time right now. By being focused, albeit it is quite broad, and having good partners on the ground in these markets and internationally, and a good track record of being good partners and adding value, that is coming to the fore and showing good opportunities to us at the back end of the pipeline. Into share price, NAV per share discount. What I'll say, we take care of the business, and the share price should take care of itself. It's just been good to see the evolution of the share price now catching up and moving north thereof to the NAV per share. It is an in-focus space, fintech, and obviously across emerging markets. The macro ideology of what we do is very good and strong, and it's in focus at the moment. You add to that our delivery on it, whether it's exits and real returns, whether it's mark to market, whether it's benchmark names like Creditas, and a track record of NAV per share and share price growth. There's a lot of micro-level traction to that. I guess what we're seeing now is the market starting to reward that and look through our NAV into the future and starting to price that at a premium. It's something we obviously would've argued for, but then we're biased in nature, and we know our portfolio inside out, and we're obviously big believers in what we're doing. When you do quarter-on-quarter of NAV per share growth, when you do five years of NAV per share and share price growth, the market starts to give more trust and confidence in what you are and starts to reward that, which we clearly like to see. Final slide before I wrap up is just on the ESG front. Personally, I'm a big fan and supporter of our ESG overlay to everything we do. We have a focus on sustainable investing. It's always been there. If it's not ethical, it's not scalable. If it's not scalable, well, we don't want to invest in it because it doesn't give a good return on capital. I think very much like fintech in itself, ESG is the way of the future. We marry those two forces, and that's only good for us, good for business, and good for returns on capital. We are capitalists at heart, and that won't change. We like to maximize returns, but these narratives go nicely together, so there's no conflicting forces here. It's a nice tailwind to everything we do. Then there's a number of our companies which effectively do a lot of the hard work for us on this because they are at the forefront of sustainable investing. We've got JUMO, which is bringing access to finance across Africa. A lot of people's first financial product is via JUMO. Creditas bringing down the cost of consumer loans dramatically in Brazil. Konfio, an inclusion on the small business front who aren't getting credit or financial services across the Mexican banking spectrum. Finja and its mobile wallet and small business loans is the very first in an unserved market en masse. Very proud of what these companies are doing. As I say, ESG, sustainable investing, and maximizing returns can and do go together. Final slide before I open up to questions. Just some points. I think our NAV, it's a strong basis for continued growth. We're very happy where we've got to over the last five years. We're now at a decent size and shape. We're very encouraged by everything that we see in the portfolio and in the pipeline ahead of us to continue that journey of value-added growth from this bigger base. Investment companies like ours have a North Star. It changes over time. Creditas is that, and the exciting thing for us, as I mentioned about Creditas, is that it's now starting to compound from a bigger base, and that obviously means bigger and better things for us from a NAV, share price, and market cap point of view. It's not all about Creditas, but obviously, it's the one that's the biggest and the most transparent. I think the most exciting name for us this year is Konfio. Partly it's because of the size and the impact it can have on our NAV and hence our market cap and share price, but also because of what we saw in Konfio and through Konfio in 2020, which was a phenomenal crisis, and now a company that's very well positioned for a much broader win across small business financial ecosystem in 2021. Names like TransferGo and Juspay, also at the upper end of our NAV, are in very strong positions to compound from here. It is an exciting time for the portfolio, and I don't mean to not mention names, but you have to pick and choose. It's towards the top end of the NAV that the ones will have more of an impact, clearly, going forward. The corporate activity in the market, IPOs, M&A, and just the amount of capital in the space, just breeds opportunity and transparency, and then focus for everything we do and the abilities to exit and raise money for a lot of our companies, which is all supportive of the mandate, so we welcome that. Then obviously for the pipeline. We've been very strict on what gets into the portfolio. Over the last two to three years, we have a benchmark; we have names in the portfolio that have been there before. The checklist is high, the bar is high. I would expect we're starting to make some smaller investments, some smaller tickets coming out. Expect some names to come through, and I'm excited for the year ahead about what can come through and then what we can add from there. I think that the key risks, as always, don't really change. It's more on the macro, on the market side. They bounce us around much more than anything we've done on a micro level, at least so far. I'll stop there. Operator, can you open up the call for Q&A, please? Thank you. If you have a question for the speaker, please press zero one on your telephone keypad and you'll enter a queue. After you're announced, please ask your question. Our first question comes from the line of Joachim Gunell from DNB Markets. Please go ahead. Thank you very much. Good afternoon, Dave. I have a couple of questions, and perhaps it's easier if you take them one by one. Yeah, please. To a solid net cash position here, obviously, that's a new dimension to what you can do with such financial flexibility. Can you provide just an update here on, say, funding needs of your existing portfolio, ex-Creditas obviously, for the coming year? In that question, I would also like to ask, because the new investment opportunities that you see, it seems like they are tilted towards more, say, frontier markets, slightly smaller ticket sizes than your average, say, SEK 10 million-SEK 20 million. Any thoughts there? Yeah, no. It's fair. Thanks, Joachim. Thanks for the questions. I think we're in a good place from a cash and capital point of view. We've always said we don't like to carry capital, both because it hurts performance, but we don't like access to capital. We only pull the trigger as and when we need it. Obviously, the markets were supportive of that back in November. We were quick to deploy some of that capital, the +$ 60 million we raised, albeit we had cash at bank, and we did deploy $ 25 million into Creditas and another half a million on a small ticket into Finja. Entering the year with $ 52 million. Now we're looking at about $20 million. It could be more ±, that we will put into the portfolio this year. That's at this stage. Obviously, things can change, parts can change. I guess Konfio is a classic case in point, a name that we like a lot. Depends how much they look to raise this year, and then us wanting to take our rights, plus and minus, depending on the valuation and the partners. I think we've earmarked about $ 20 million of that $ 52 at this point for current portfolio needs. Outside of that, the nature of what we do is we could find a great company, and it could be a $30 million ticket. That could happen as soon as April or May. There's nothing in the pipeline right now that fits that bill. That can happen, and if we have conviction, we will definitely go at it. If we need more capital for it, there is ways and means to do that, obviously. I guess 52 leaves us comfortable. 52 with the follow-ons for the companies that we have in our portfolio, very clear, and it's there to be supported. On the smaller side, yes, we have a number of small investments. Say a number up to three small investments coming through the funnel or the pipes right now that we've got a decent level of conviction will close in the near future. Some are small because they're just in smaller countries in the earlier stage. Places like Pakistan, it's actually hard to spend money, and you shouldn't be writing, at least in fintech today, $10 million tickets, because the country isn't there yet. Others, it's just we found a way to get into some very exciting companies, but in a smaller stake than normally. We target 10%-20% stakes on average. If we get an entry ticket that's smaller to a company that we really like and we can work from the inside to build that position as and when they prove themselves out a bit more and get more performance, then we'll do that. I guess we're slightly opening the strategy a bit from being tied to we ought to get 10%-20% in our first ticket so we can take a smaller ticket and then build up. No, that's clear, Dave. Perhaps a follow-up on that. Can you talk a bit about what you're seeing, say, regarding later-stage deals? In Creditas, it was quite obvious here that as the fintech ecosystem matures in emerging markets, funding seems to go that way. With a lot of, say, money-chasing assets, can you comment a bit on, say, exit opportunities for some of your holdings? There is a healthy amount of capital in the venture world and private equity world for sure, that's coming locally in markets from funds, internationally from funds like us. Obviously, the U.S. has a lot of capital. Then it's corporate VCs. Every corporate in financial services, whether it's PayPal or Visa or Mastercard, Citibank, have their own venture arms and are writing their own venture tickets. There's a lot of capital going around for every stage of investment, albeit some countries are less hot than others. You put the Pakistans and the Egypts versus like Brazil and India in that category. Then some stages are less busy than others. We always said this, the Series B into C is generally less busy. Early stage is busy locally. Late stage is busy because everybody's picked the winners and the valley comes en masse to write big checks and SoftBank and Tencent and all their friends. The Series B to C is generally a sweet spot we've continued to find quite nice. Then on exit, Joachim, it's just a good time to exit. What with IPOs, Russia's a market that I know well, but we're seeing IPOs in Russia, Ozon, the e-commerce company. We're seeing IPOs in Kazakhstan, Kaspi.kz. Never mind Brazil and some of the more expectant emerging markets where true to cycle you see IPOs, and then there's M&A as well. We're seeing a lot of M&A from, I guess we're getting breakout winners in fintech in a lot of markets, and Creditas is a case in point in this. They've made two acquisitions in the last year. One was Creditoo in the payroll lending, and this year it would be CrediHome in the home equity lending. Some of the bigger, I think the winners or breakout names in fintech are mopping up some of the smaller names to add on product and function as they go. No, thanks for that, Dave. Final question from me, then I'll jump back in line. Okay. Or two. Just finally, did I hear you right that the ambition for Konfio is to grow 3x-5x in 2021? Yeah. Look, what I'd say is broadly didn't grow last year in terms of origination. It originated the same in 2020 that they originated back in 2019. My apologies for not being able to share too much information, and I'd like for that to go that way with Konfío like it is with Creditas. Given what we see with Konfío, or its position, given where we see with the Mexican market, where a lot of the banks and entities sitting on their hands and not large parts of the small business, the better part of the small business community needing credit, it seems like a great window for Konfío to grow this year, credit and beyond. We have a number of models which we've laid out with the company, and we generally have two or three, and with most companies, low, medium, high, to be quite basic. It would be a year where we would be expecting, at a minimum, 2x, but it could be 3x-5x in terms of growth of a loan book that's about $100 million today. It's still small, given the $16 billion-ish small business lending opportunity in Mexico. It could be one of those big years after a sideways year, last year. Will do that. Well, just a final one then. This is perhaps an old question, but if we just look at the fintech ecosystem, say, Alipay in China, you alluded to the fact that okay, we are seeing a number of players also in Brazil, et cetera, adding pretty extensive product suites around a super app where you can do everything. Say in the U.S., obviously, PayPal is doing something like that with its wallet. On this, when you think about Brazil, where do you see, say, the consumer ecosystem going in the next, call it five years, and if there's a risk here that obviously Konfio and Creditas have different, say, target customers with consumers and SMEs, et cetera, but can these types of separate ecosystems start to collide even more? Look, I think there's going to be lots of collisions, lots of value creation, and lots of value destruction over the next 5- 10 years. Digital is the way of the future, that's for sure. The fintech companies, the new economies are coming at this with a digital, online-first mindset and skillset. The incumbents are struggling with that, albeit when talking banking, they have the capital, the regulatory support, and they have the customers on average today. They're going to struggle, and they continue to struggle of moving to digital as much as they try and shadow over it. I guess within fintech, every country's different, we always say this. There's no one rule of thumb, but the bigger entries, I think, [the great plan of this year], and everybody else. They were a monoliner, a credit card, consumer loan lending monoline, and look at what they are today, a multi-product financial services and beyond financial services ecosystem with daily active users. A financial services firm with daily active users, never mind monthly or weekly or monthly. The Chinese have done the same obviously. There is a playbook out there, and we're seeing entities coming out of, whether it's Southeast Asia with ride sharing and Brazil, MercadoLibre is doing it very well coming from the e-commerce point. Obviously, there's Nubank, and there's other entities doing it as well. A lot of these entities are going from their strong, and I love companies that focus and get a strong monoline business built on customers, equity, franchise, branding, and then they expand from there, like what we're seeing with Creditas, like what we're seeing with Konfio. Specifically, with Konfio and Creditas clash, less obvious small business Mexico consumer Brazil, albeit Creditas is touching into Mexico. You got the crossover that these are massive markets, there are going to be many winners of different types and shapes. I think the incumbents have the most to lose. You got, unlike developed markets, these are growth markets as well. There's so much upside in the pie as opposed to taking of the pie from one part to the other. That's clear. Thank you very much. That's all for me. Super, Joachim. Thanks a lot. Just as a reminder, if you do wish to ask a question, please press zero one on your telephone keypad now. Our next question comes from the line of Herman Wartoft from Pareto Securities. Please go ahead. All right. Perfect. Good afternoon, Dave, and thank you for this presentation. Just a couple of questions from my end. I think I have one on Creditas and one on Juspay. First off with Creditas, great to see some actual KPIs released from the company. I think it's very much appreciated from my side and also from the VEF shareholders for sure. If I'm just looking at these historical KPIs, it seems like the overhead costs and taxes, so basically, I'm talking about the difference between the contribution margin and the net income. It seems like that cost base sort of reached a plateau during 2020. If I just look at Q4 2020, I think it's actually down a little bit since Q4 2019. I was just wondering if you think that this sort of flattening out of the overhead costs during 2020 if it's sustainable in 2021, or if you think that there's something in there that was maybe related to COVID or something that we can't see from the outside. Just wondering kind of what you think about the costs in going forward, and maybe also if you have a view on when you think that credit risks could reach breakeven on a net income level. Yeah. Yeah. That's my question. No, no. Super. Thanks, Herman. I appreciate it. Let me share what I can. Look, with this, I think what's more forecastable at Creditas is definitely the balance sheet side of it, the originations. That's gonna be easier to guide and then see, and they deliver. They either miss or they beat on that. That's gonna be a clear indication. I think what feeds nicely from that is obviously the revenue number, which is there in a percentage of average credit or average origination, part of which is fees and part of which is the interest overlay and their share of it. Obviously you're getting five numbers, which is welcome from the analysts and from the investor community. The more you get, the more you want, and the more questions you have on the data that you get. I fully respect that, being a former analyst. What I'd say is under the revenue line, it's gonna get a lot more complex to give understanding and guidance for. What I'd say is, what's the movable feast in that? There is SG&A, which has been obviously consistently invested in. That's gradual over time as they expand. The biggest movable feast probably in that is the marketing expense, the CAC, and that's something that they wound right down. Obviously, that's acquiring customers, acquiring flows of loans, of revenues for into the future. They wound that down in Q2 aggressively and then ramped that right back up in Q3 and Q4. Sometimes they ramp that up in a quarter, and it benefits the top line in the proceeding next two quarters, and they ramp it down again. It's not consistent per se as a cost item, and that obviously affects the net income on a quarter-by-quarter basis. Then it's probably easier to look at it on a year-on-year basis. 2020 was an exceptional year in terms of plans at the start of the year. What happened in Q1 into Q2, and how Creditas reacted to it. The biggest movement, they slowed down all aspects of cost in the early part of the year and ramped them back up in the second half of the year. The biggest moving part on that was the CAC, the customer acquisition, the marketing cost, versus anything too dramatic in the other areas, albeit cost of funding maybe pushed up a bit in the early part of the year and then came down, which is all above contribution margin level. Asset quality would've got slightly worse and then better, and that's also above contribution margin level. That's a bit of color. I guess what we like about Creditas on the profitability question side is the fact that they've proven it out. With the onset of COVID in March, Creditas, on a monthly basis, went cash flow positive as they just basically eradicated CAC or new customer acquisition and lived off the existence of its portfolio and the revenues feeding in. It was a great stress test and proof point that should they want to go profitable, they can almost in a heartbeat. In terms of forecasted profitability, the aim for them on the current models, and there's a couple of them, is more towards the back end of 2022 at this stage. All right. Perfect. That's very clear, I think. All right. My second question is on Juspay. I was just wondering if you can maybe just give an update and maybe touch on the recent developments regarding this data breach that some media outlets have been reporting about, and what you think about that. Yeah, no, it's a fair question. Alexis, one of our investment partners here, is on the board there, and he's very close to the management on this, and he's been living and breathing that data breach and the communication around it. Obviously, it happened as a fact. I think all these companies in this space, whether it's financial services, social media, e-commerce, has their data breach moment. Not that it's a welcome moment, but it's more how you deal with it when it comes. It seems so far that it's being dealt with and that it's not an issue that's gonna extrapolate into a bigger issue. It is a data breach. They're talking very closely with the RBI. That's the central bank in India. Very close with them on just a full review and analysis. External tech has come in and counseled to have a look through everything to do a report for the RBI, as far as I'm aware. So it's a process and a learning, that's what I'd say at this stage, as opposed to an issue that's fundamentally gonna affect the business. I'll probably stop there, though, on it, Herman. I'll let you speak. I'll get Alexis on a call with you because he's living and breathing, or has lived and breathed the details on that one. We get these hiccups in our companies a lot. They're still early-stage private companies. When you get the first iteration of the news, it can be quite dramatic, and then you deal with it, and then these companies, on average, move on. This seems one of those situations where it's being managed, and it's not back on the front foot. I'll get Alexis on a call just to get a bit more detail on that front for you. All right. Yep. That sounds good. I'll speak to Alexis. Okay. That's it for me. Thank you. Super, Herman. Thanks. As there are no further questions, I'll hand it back to Dave for closing remarks. Super. Thank you. Thank you, everybody for joining our call today, for supporting and following our story. Look forward to many more quarters and years of continuing growth and delivery. If you ever have any questions about our company, what we're doing, or any of the details, feel free to reach out to myself or Henrik Stenlund, who's our CFO and Head of Investor Relations. Thank you very much for your time today. Take care.