Thank you for joining us at the Needham Growth Conference. My name is David Rold. I am the sustainability technology analyst here at Needham. For this session, we're gonna be hosting Altus Power, and chatting with Lars, their co-CEO and co-founder. So Lars, tell us about you guys and what you do at a high level. Absolutely. Thank you, David, for having us here. It's great to be here. We've met with investors this morning, some of who have covered the renewable energy space for ten years, and more, and some who've just started looking at it. Obviously, our mission is to communicate with all of them, and with you, and explain what it is we do. If we can move to maybe the slide deck? Is the slide deck loaded in any particular way? We can start high level. Sure. while they're loading the slide deck. Absolutely. So what are you guys doing, you know, for customers? Yes. We'll explain what the slide deck says. Altus Power serves its enterprise and homeowner clients... Here we go. Awesome... With clean electric power that we sell them at a discount. This picture is meant to say more than 10,000 words, and based on experience, we think it does. We own and operate large commercial rooftop solar arrays across the country, and solar arrays that sit in parking lots. Thank you very much. Thanks, David. And solar arrays that occasionally will sit on brownfields and other ground locations. These arrays or assets are meant to serve our customers under long-term contracts that we have with them to produce and deliver clean electric power. Our most standard contract format, or most common contract format, is to sell that power to them at a discount to what they pay the grid. If they're paying utility bills $0.14/kWh, or $0.15/kWh, or $0.10/kWh, we'll be 10%-15% cheaper than the grid price for power. So the rationale, David, for clients, is that they get power that they know is made locally, that they can observe and know doesn't have any carbon emissions associated with it, and it's cheaper than what the grid can deliver them electricity at. So you're buying a bunch of assets, you're stacking up the cash flows, and offering power to your customers from renewable sources, and despite that, it's still 20%-30% cheaper- Yeah ... than what they would've been consuming otherwise. Yes. Okay. Okay, so two streams involved there. One of them is financial, one is energy related. The former, they're a little more complicated. So talk about the major steps in the financial chain of how you guys come to buy these assets, and, you know, who's paying who in the relationship, the term of the relationship, et cetera, and how you guys are funded. Sure. We normally come to the client with the proposal to build solar on their site. We present to the client the economic benefits, the carbon reduction benefits, and otherwise explain to them what would come if they allow us to build a solar system on their property. In many cases, David, the client, who is the tenant/power consumer in that particular building on the picture, is not the same as the who owns the building. So we basically have to approach two entities. We have to approach both the tenant in the building, who's going to consume power that we make, and the landlord, who owns that building, and create a contract that is long term with both landlord and tenants. With the landlord, to make sure that we can be on his roof or her roof for 25 years, and to the customer in the building, that we can sell them clean electric power. We then go through the motions of developing that solar system or asset, if we call it that. We engineer it, we seek permits, both from the utility, for what's called an interconnection, and also from the building department, so that we can go and build the solar system. We procure material, transformers, what's called inverters, that make direct current into alternating current, so that you can send it into a building, and of course, a lot of solar modules. We pay for all those components. Many of them, we keep in warehouse in anticipation of building more solar systems, but some are actually built to spec. We have to know beforehand that we're gonna use a transformer of some certain size and make sure that we place an order for that, so that by the time we need that on site, it's ready to be delivered. All the money is effectively spent or invested by Altus, and the client only has to buy the power that comes out of that solar system. Now, they have to agree to buy that over a long period of time. The solar system is a long-dated asset, but because we're selling it to them at a discount to what they pay the grid, most clients or all clients that we talk to are very happy to engage on that basis. Okay. And so 25 years, that's a long duration. Talk about the counterparties to, to that transaction. You know, where is the funding source coming from for you guys ultimately? Absolutely. So one important part of being a clean energy company that has its own assets and that generates clean electricity that we deliver to clients, is to respect the fact that that's a long-term asset. And when you've spent some time, either in equity markets or fixed income markets, you tend to start thinking that long-term assets should be held with capital, that itself is long term. And so one of the very, very, intense efforts that we undertook at Altus... We started the company in 2009, so we've been around now for 15 years. We basically spent the first nine or 10 years of Altus working very hard to compile a certain quantum of assets like this before we could go to the rating agencies and get them to rate-... the collateral pool that we had assembled. The rating agencies needed a certain amount of assets and a certain amount of diversification, by state, by region, et cetera. I'm gonna flip forward just a little bit. As you can see from the map on the top left here, we now have a nationwide portfolio. It tends to be more heavily, for the moment, focused on the coasts, because the blue states and the coasts both have higher power prices and have had more solar programs, that we've come in, to build in support of. But this long-term nature of these assets meant that we needed someone like a rating agency to opine on the credit risk of all the assets that we've amassed. In 2019, Altus was the first entity to conduct a securitization of commercial-only solar assets. We got an investment grade rating, a single A and a triple B, and these ratings allowed us to go to long-term capital, like insurance companies. We now have this unique facility that Blackstone runs for us. Blackstone is one of Altus' partners, that we can effectively raise 25-year debt out of. We come to this facility and the rating agencies with a long-term contract to sell power to someone like Home Depot or T.J. Maxx T.J. Maxx or some high school, and we take this 25-year asset, and we put it into a 25-year funding facility. Now we have a matched book, which is very important. Talk about how that differed to previous models and what the problems were between matching those previously? Yes. When we- What about changed? ... when we started Altus, you know, we had this idea that we would seek very hard to undertake this effort of creating basically portfolio funding for a series of solar assets. And those of you that have some background in energy markets will recognize this. Many of the energy bankers that we spoke to said: "You can't do that. Everybody knows that energy is an asset-by-asset funding market, where each asset is completely unique. There is nothing between this solar system over here and that solar system over there that's similar enough that you can put them in a pool and get funding on it." And we thought to ourselves, "That can't possibly be true." We recognized that this solar system is a little bit bigger than this solar system over here. This one's in Virginia, and this one's in Maryland, but they're not that different. It took us 10 years to convince the participants in the market that we were right and they were wrong, but ultimately, we won. And so historically, the market has been funded asset by asset, and in many cases by bank financing. And banks sometimes are happy to lend, but very often they're only happy to lend for, say, 4 to 5 or 6 years. And so sitting with a 25-year long power contract in an asset that produces that electricity in a 5-year funding structure provided by a bank is scary. 5 sets of reinvestment risks. Absolutely. Okay. What do you think is going on right now in the market with respect to those entities that have that bank financing? It's very difficult for them to roll that or to renew that financing. So Altus, we need to do a better job highlighting how difficult it was for us to get into this long-term funding facility, how unique it is, and how competitive it makes us when we go and compete for assets with, with others, that we have this funding facility that we can put our assets into. And so just to recap the flow, you were borrowing from this facility at X? Yes. You're offering a yieldcos. Yes. That's still cheaper than the utility- Yes. and you're taking that spread between those two? Correct. Okay. Sounds like a fairly simple business model. Sounds like, you know, one that doesn't necessarily match the risk profile being priced in by the equity market. So what is the disconnect for you, as you see it? We need to go to more conferences and meet with more audiences—like, like this, and be interviewed by more Davids—to get to the bottom of this. If we were to venture some guesses, you know, we're in a sort of category of one, David. There definitely are many residential solar companies that have been in the residential solar market for a long time. There are equipment manufacturers who make gadgets and widgets and transformers and inverters, and all these things. There really aren't any other public commercial solar scale companies. We need to highlight the relative simplicity of our business model. Now, in fairness, in equity markets, the concept of owning a lot of very valuable assets might be a little scary to some. Perhaps they feel like we're rather asset-heavy at Altus. We agree with that. We think that so far through the explanation, an asset-heavy company needs to explain to its audience how those assets are not a risk, how they're being held in a funding structure that doesn't have this real risk or refinancing risk that you were mentioning. We have that, we feel quite confident in our long-term funding facility, and so we need to make sure that we get that message out there. Because we've been profitable since 2017, we're cash flow positive, I should say, and it used to be that that wasn't very impressive. Growth was more important than making money. And now all of a sudden, being cash flow generative is a very, very impressive thing. And so we feel like our time is now, and we just need to make sure that we get this story out. And so, these are recurring payments, recurring cash flows. Market generally likes those. Talk about... Let's take a single contract or a single asset, what could go wrong for you and therefore for investors, over that duration? We have credit risk against our power buyer. So if somebody, if some big entity signs a 25-year contract, pursuant to which they will buy power from us for 25 years, we need to underwrite that entity and make sure that we think that either they will exist for 25 years, and if they don't exist for 25 years, somebody else comes into that building, occupies it, and is willing to buy power from us at a 10% or 15% discount. We have production risk. It's important that our solar systems are working. All the equipment has to be maintained, TLC'd, tender, love, and cared for. We have to make sure that, you know, weather patterns remain the same. We're protected to some extent from the geographic diversity of our portfolio. So if the weather is horrible in California, it's often better in Georgia and vice versa. And so because we've had a chance to do this now for 15 years, we've seen periods of, you know, different weather tends to snap back to the mean a little bit. And so weather risk is maybe not the most pronounced one, but we need to make sure that these systems are up and running and that our clients are paying their bills. We've designed Altus and our business model to tolerate clients not always paying their bills, but we've never had a default in our 15-year history, so. Very impressive. Talk to us about your eye-popping margins on paper. You see the valuation disconnect. Usually, that means there's a lot of you know, profit dollars that are either non-cash you know, non-GAAP. Talk to us about the quality of your earnings and EBITDA, I guess. Absolutely. So, the example that we left off with, when we had built a solar system using these components, starts making electricity. We made electricity yesterday, the day before that. We're making electricity today in 25 states in the country, and God willing, we'll make electricity tomorrow as well. That power is our great—you know, number one source of revenue. So we sell power to a couple of hundred enterprise clients, around 400-500, and we also do something called community solar. So we have 20,000+ community solar customers, which are basically households who are also buying power from us. So the greatest source of revenue, if you will look at our income statement, is the sale of that electricity to each of these clients, billed on a monthly basis. So we think, and we need to do a better job explaining this as well, that in a world and a peer set that sometimes includes some rather complex accounting maneuvers, Altus's revenue is exceedingly simple. We just sell electricity to a whole host of clients and, and charge for it every month. Cash basis, money in the bank- Yes. - No accretion over time. Nope. Okay, my apologies. Questions from the audience, if any? You said you're cash flow positive...[inaudible] Yes. What is the use of cash..l[inaudible] Can't hear. Absolutely. So we'll- So, the question was, you mentioned being profitable, cash flow positive, assuming that the audience member is assuming that that means cash flow from operations. Did I get that? Yeah. So when does the CapEx...r[inaudible] Yes, it's a great question. So we, as we were just talking about, our assets at rest generate revenue, and we have OpEx, so we basically have to pay insurance, we have to maintain. We then have staff associated with maintaining the client contract and so forth. After that, we're making money. So we have EBITDA beyond that. Last year, 2023, by the time we're done counting, we probably added something like 400 MW of new solar. All of that, of course, took massive investments. And back, I'll show you in a second exactly how the investment is made up, but it's this funding facility that we talked to, and then cash on balance sheet. Once we look at the CapEx, then what was a positive revenue number or positive EBITDA number becomes negative again because we invest so much that it basically takes away the cash we generated and then some, which is cash on balance sheet. We suspect that for the next foreseeable future, the growth opportunity in front of us would cause our investors to want us to find ways to fund that growth and continue with the CapEx as long as there's attractive clients, attractive contracts, et cetera. But at some point, we will have so much assets that our capacity to build more assets or buy more assets might end up being self-funding because we basically get enough money thrown off our existing portfolio that once we put funding facilities in place and tax equity, et cetera, we're effectively self-funded. We don't know when that's going to happen. Is there a size or point of scale when that could happen? Yeah, I think that's a good question. So we have scaled our platform, relatively rapidly in the last two years. The question might be: how big is the opportunity set? Should you just keep adding staff if you're profitable, or is there some golden moment when the cash that you generate from your existing systems is enough to build an impressive amount of growth in, in that particular year? We don't quite know what that is. We, we happen to be market-leading right now. We're the largest commercial solar company in the country, and yet, depending a little bit on how you measure, if you include solar systems that, building owners have built themselves, we only have around 4%-6% of the market. So our market share would not strike you as being particularly big, and yet we're the leader in that market. We would love- The largest commercial solar portfolio is still just 4%-6% of the market. Yeah. Yes. Okay. We are very happy with that market leadership position. We think that our destination probably is to become a dominant company in this market. What is that? Is that 15% market share? Is it 20? And what does that mean for your CapEx? As long as the market, David, and you're in touch with the market, votes for Altus and joins us in this amazing opportunity, we could probably issue stock and grow along those lines. It's a little bit a question of where the stock is trading. We have no intention, by the way, of issuing stocks at levels that we view as being diluted. Okay. We have made a point about that. The cash generation we talked about now. We made a point about explaining that many companies in our peer set, residential solar companies and others, are sort of forced to issue stock because they have a burn rate. We do not have a burn rate.... So we only will issue stock if we absolutely have to. And for the moment, we don't think the level is at where we'd like it to be, if we are to sell common. And, that's actually a perfect segue. So you're talking, you're talking about the traditional residential, structure and, and their burning of cash. net metering is a topic that's coming up a lot in the industry, and risks to, companies such as yourselves, or perceived risks to companies such as yourselves. You guys, though, are somewhat unique in having— you know, you talked about the 20,000 consumer retail customers that you're exposed to, but, talk to us about your risk, from net metering or any changes down the road. Absolutely. So net metering in California is a good example. Everyone's been focused on NEM 3.0, et cetera. At the beginning of this discussion, it's interesting to point out, David, that commercial solar has a production curve that's copacetic with the consumption of power in the commercial arena. So solar is made during the day, because that's when the sun is up, and many people are in their offices or in their distribution centers or in their warehouses or in their cold storage facilities during the day, because that's when they work. And so the power is being consumed while it is being produced. Out of the gate, a commercial solar system has much less of the net metering logic around it, or maybe problems around it, that are causing some grid operators to start protesting and say, "We can't take more power when you're making it at your homes," or wherever it might be. Because they weren't selling a whole lot of it back to begin with. Because they weren't selling it a whole lot to begin with. Okay. And so, shall we say, our impact on the grid tends to be a much lower one than the residential solar systems, where their solar systems are producing a lot of power when the homeowner is not there, when they're actually at work. And so this sort of coincidental production and consumption saves us from a lot of the headaches that would otherwise befall us. That being said, of course, there's gonna be moments on a Sunday when our particular warehouse might not have staff in it, and we are making power like crazy 'cause it's the 15th of May, and in that particular case, we might also need to send some power back into the grid, and in the case of California, we'll be compensated less for that power than at a retail rate. So you have to model around it. It's very important to point out that our unit economics, as a commercial solar company, are higher for each of our systems than what the residential unit economics are or the utility scale unit economics. So we have sort of more to pour from when we approach the idea of having to make some cushion around it. And what is sold back goes, that's revenue to you? It is revenue to us. Okay. Got it. So, you know, if you guys were king for a day, and you could wave a magic wand, change, you know, how many couple things about either the U.S., regulatory policy, you know, you name it, what, what, what would they be to really accelerate Altus to, to what you think it can be, as fast as possible? If we were king for a day? I think we're in a pretty good spot, right now. We may not be the king, for the moment, but we feel like we're definitely a dominant force in commercial scale solar. France, who offed their king a while ago, but France have made a law that if you have a certain parking lot, I think it's above 70 spaces, you need to have a parking lot solar canopy in that particular spot. So that's a situation where legislation, by effectively building departments, are suggesting to commercial roof owners or commercial real estate owners that they need to have some amount of on-site generation for clean energy. That would be the ultimate sort of Altus act. If that happens, and we don't have to come into clients and explain why they should want to do this, they come to us and ask for- Saying, "We have to. Yeah. That would be cool. Okay. Questions for... Go ahead. So, yeah, it appears to me you're really highly dependent upon the cost of debt capital, long-term debt capital, and I appreciate you imagining length of term, okay? But isn't that a risk if, you know, long-term rates go up higher? They may have peaked, maybe not. So does that add cyclicality, or can you lock in a return, and what does that mean on the line of investment required? Yes, that is a great question. So if we take out the question of refinancing risk in the existing facility, that's already sort of put to bed, if you will, your question is: What if rates were to go to 8%? Doesn't it destroy the whole, the whole thing? So this is one moment when it's crucial to point out that because we sell energy at retail prices, we think it's very unlikely, based on our 15 years of operating history, that inflation is at 8%, but power prices are going down. Oh. Power prices tend to move along with inflation, and so more likely than not, when inflation is at 8%, if that were to happen, power prices are going to be going up by 14%. Because, of course, the retail price of power has not only the cost of energy in it, but also transmission, delivery, the cost of telephone poles, the cost of bucket trucks, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. And so what we've seen so far, at least, is that the price pressure on retail electricity, which we sell against, if you will, tends to go up and down, or up really mostly, faster than the cost of capital does to us. That being said, we do want to have a certain spread between the cost of funding and our funding facility and the raw, unlevered return of our solar assets. That needs to be 200 basis points for us to feel good, because we have to service these things. We take some weather risk, we take construction risk, et cetera. We need to be paid for that. And we haven't entered into a period yet where we don't get paid for that. So for the moment at least, this sort of setup is working well. ... maybe just in that light, maybe mention how the Blackstone facility helps on that- Yeah. what it does for your cost of capital, what it doesn't do in terms of locking in, if anything. So, So, yeah, maybe expand on that. Absolutely. So the length of time that it took us and Blackstone to get the Investment Grade Rating on our funding facility was really quite long and onerous. And we think it's very difficult for others in the market to replicate this, and as a consequence, they tend to sell their assets a little quicker. We held on to our assets. We never sold an asset during the history of Altus effectively. And holding on to them allowed us to go in with a diversified portfolio and get this coveted rating. Now that we have it, our window for financing is effectively open. We've done two draws in, like, the last three to six months against this facility, at a moment when others are having great difficulty getting their bank to return their phone call. The last couple of draws have certainly been at a fixed coupon of, you know, one around 6%, one slightly above 6%. We do, we are subject to the benchmark rate plus the credit spread, but the mere fact that we could add debt in a moment like this, we think is a testament to the sort of moat, if you will, that we've built around ourselves a little bit. So, what is your ROI longer term in your model with this? Sure. So when we look at all assets that we build or purchase from others on an underwriting basis, first is unlevered, to make sure that everything is apples to apples. And just because you asked the question, it's important to highlight that this market is one that includes a lot of assumptions. Assumptions about how much energy will come out of the solar system, assumption about what the price of power will do in the next 5, 10, 15 years, assumptions about what the power price will be in the market, 5 or 15 or 20 years out. And so you can, you know, go absolutely crazy with all those assumptions, and we choose not to. We act, we think, as a principle, and so we're very conservative in the moment when we underwrite this base case unlevered return. Once that comes out in the high single digits, we then put it into our funding facility, and we would expect to see sort of mid-teens to maybe high teens returns on that particular asset after it's been levered. And that's before we've taken a chance to further build on the client relationship, if it's a high school or a water district or TJ Maxx or Home Depot. What about charging? Would they like some charging for their fleets of vehicles? Can we do clean charging? What about storage? Should we add a battery to their facility that works almost like a generator would, so that in case the grid goes down for eight hours, they have resiliency in that facility, continue to operate? All those products are possible add-ons for Altus, under the contract that we sign with the client. Great. I think we have one more in the audience. What prices are the...?[inaudible] Yeah, it's usually some discount. Just for the mic, the question was: what are you offering compared to what the grid would be offering in terms of price? A very common contract proposal will be some power to the client at a 10% or 15% discount to what they pay the grid. So if they pay the grid electricity at $0.14 per kWh, or New Jersey, we might sell energy to them at $0.105 or $0.11. The reason I ask is, some of the things we're hearing is, this huge capacity into the data centers.[inaudible] Yes. AI...[inaudible] Yes. The biggest constraint to building up these data centers is actually power. Yeah. But can you go back to your customers? Can you talk about that as an opportunity?[inaudible] Absolutely. I don't see anyone.[inaudible] Absolutely. So we have two amazing strategic partners at Altus. Blackstone is one of them. We talked about Blackstone, and the other one is CBRE. So Blackstone and CBRE both own stock in Altus. So when you invest in our company, you invest alongside of them. CBRE is the world's largest, by far, manager of real estate or services company for real estate, and they have a devoted data center group actually out of Virginia, where many of the data centers started. And the trick for them has been that building-sited solar is only really able to knock out, say, 4%-6% of their consumption. And so it's been viewed as being perhaps a little bit needless or something that they don't focus on because it's such a low knockout. We're gently trying to persuade these data centers that everyone's decarbonization journey should involve some amount of building-sited solar, and then they should do other things on top of that. But data centers is somebody who is placing a great demand on the grid, and because of it, the grid is quite happy to have Altus come in and put solar systems around the data center. And so maybe in the most amazing, speaking of being king for one day, a world where there's a data center surrounded by big distribution centers, that's a really interesting setup for Altus, because we can now build large solar systems on the distribution centers that don't consume that much energy and sell it to the data center, data center in the middle. We're in discussions with people to do things like that. We haven't done them yet, but that's something that I think the grid would find very attractive as well because of what you're talking about, which is the lack of power. Is storage a prerequisite for that kind of a relationship? I think it probably involves some storage. Okay. I think the second you start to think of this sort of network- Yeah ... emerging, of energy being made, it probably is being stored as well. Okay. Of course, what ultimately we think of as a triple play is for some of it going to vehicles. It doesn't have to be personal vehicles, it can be school buses or ambulances or whatever. But at that moment, you've disconnected yourself a little bit from the grid because you're not able to charge something that will move later on, which is very attractive to us. When did you pass on a deal? What was the typical pass?inaudible] Pass on a deal? That's a great question. The contract terms, if they are not robust enough for us. So there is this term of art in energy called take or pay, where energy that's being made is going to be sold to somebody, and whether they want it or not, they're gonna have to pay for it. That's a very important part of an energy contract, and occasionally, we have a developer come to us where they say, "Hey, we have a solar system, we'd like to sell it to you, and the contract is standard, but there's no take or pay in it." And if you underwrite no take or pay to worst, it means the client is not buying any power. And so that's a very difficult asset for us to work with. We might gently suggest that we have a moment to speak to that client, and perhaps we can give them a discount proposal that they find attractive enough so they can switch back to take or pay, but that will be a blocker for us effectively on the way in. What happens if energy prices plunge? Your model is going off on inflation. What happens when nat gas prices fall 20%-30%?[inaudible] We have a slide for that. So, they did. Nat gas prices fell 30%. So we started Altus in 2009, and between 2009 and 2019 was this really deflationary decade, where energy prices actually kept coming down- Fell 100% for a day, right? Yeah. I know. I think this graph shows you that. So pray, what happened to retail energy prices during that decade, do you think? I don't know. I don't know. I just remember some of those YieldCos, you know, those solar YieldCos got killed, the stock price yield. So I'm trying to think of... I'm not smart enough to know what happened, everything went down.[inaudible] Well, I'm gonna tell you what happened. And by the way, we agree with you on the YieldCos. That was a setup that, you know, wasn't maybe well thought out. And one of the reasons, by the way, on the YieldCos, and then I'll answer your question, we think of a solar contract as having the client be the most important part of that contract. The asset is incidental to us serving that client with clean electric power. Because we can work with the client to increase the size of the solar system, to add storage, to add charging, to charge school buses, whatever the case might be. And so the YieldCos, where you took an asset and lobbed it over, and it just was meant to sit there, isn't, like, the most efficient way of doing this. We think a living, breathing company like Altus is, is better to do this. During the deflationary decade, between 2009 and 2019, when gas prices went from, you know, $8 to $2, the average annual increase in retail electricity prices nationally, 2.9%. So wholesale energy was down by a ton, and retail electricity prices were up by 2.9%. And I'm sure you can guess what the reason for that is. Bucket trucks probably increased in expense, telephone poles were hard to get. The linemen's salaries perhaps had to increase during that period of time. And so the beauty of selling power to somebody effectively in competition with their retail electricity rates, is that all those charges for getting the energy to the building gets baked into the basis. And that's why we're so enamored with commercial solar, where we are able to sell energy at effectively retail rate. Okay. And how often are those assets already in operation? You know, I would think that you're taking on a lot less, you know, project risk, timing risk, availability of resources, you know, any time shortages of labor. Talk to us about how often you would have to have, like, a big, you know, maintenance production go on. Absolutely. So, so in the beginning of Altus' history, I think for the first four or five years, maybe even longer, we couldn't buy a single asset. Nobody who built solar assets like we did, wanted to sell any of those solar assets to Altus. Everybody wanted to hold on to their solar assets, presumably for the same reasons that we wanted to hold on to ours. So every asset that, that we owned, we had to build ourselves. At some point, possibly coincidental with getting backed by Blackstone in 2014 and 2015, and definitely by the time that we had our funding facility set up, we became quite competitive on the cost of capital. In our ability to be efficient about both, due diligencing, we take all the horsepower and the muscle that we've grown in building solar systems, and we use that same exact horsepower in buying other people's solar systems. In order to, we think, be a good buyer of systems, you have to be a good builder of systems. And so once we had access to the efficient, efficiently priced capital, we started buying a lot of systems as well. And that's come and gone a little bit. The market for buying systems that other people are building for you, is a little bit dependent on exactly what their capital cost is for the moment. As you can imagine, for the last six months, and we think for some amount of time going forward right now, it's been an amazing market to buy other people's solar systems. Yeah. They're having their bank lines pulled, they're reaching a conclusion that they can't reach critical mass or scale on their own, and they're coming to Altus and asking us if we're interested in buying their solar systems. The answer is, as long as the contract doesn't have any crazy clauses in it, that we are interested in buying the system. There, of course, are systems that are built to a level that we feel uncomfortable with, can't buy every solar system. But if we have a 25-year contract that we feel comfortable with, with a client that we feel comfortable with, and a system has been built to specifications that we are comfortable with, we're very happy to buy some, some solar systems so that people are built. Okay. What is this... You put aside Blackstone, why is this a good investment?[inaudible] ... I mean, I think it is a good business model without Blackstone. Blackstone likes to say that they look for unfair advantages, and we look for unfair advantages as well. And, you know, some of our biggest unfair advantages is Blackstone and CBRE, but we're an entity, you know, without them. Blackstone has given us phenomenal rigor in the way we underwrite and the way we built Altus. We love them dearly, and they're, of course, a very important part of our business right now because of the funding collaboration that we have. But ultimately, the rating agencies like our assets, not because Blackstone brought them there, but because of what we built for the last decade and a half. If Blackstone, for some reason, couldn't or wouldn't fund these assets going forward, there's another 14 people ready to take their place. Because of the diversification and credit quality of the asset pool that we built and the reputation that we've built up, we don't see any reason to think that Blackstone isn't gonna be involved, but I think we can stand on our own legs nicely, nicely without them. Some of the things that we have built, we think are relatively hard to replicate. This funding structure is one of them, but our nationwide construction horsepower is also very difficult to build. Our ability to service assets in Hawaii, in Vermont, in Florida, if a solar system has an issue right now, within an hour or two, somebody is going to be there checking it out. It took a long, a long time and a lot of effort to get to that, and it's going to be further strengthened. So there's some sort of barriers to entry that we tend to make sure that we keep growing, that we think will allow us to remain the market leader. What is the maintenance capital for the Altus corporation?[inaudible] It's relatively low. The investment profile of a solar system is a lot of money upfront and then relatively little money over time because there are no moving parts. The thing isn't trying to sort of spin itself into pieces or so. But you still have to budget. If you imagine that you have a large Stop & Shop that might have a 2- or 3-MW solar system on it, that's gonna be like $15,000-$25,000 a year worth of truck rolls, insurance payments, perhaps some reserves, equipment reserves, effectively, so that in case something has to be replaced in year three, you've been building a little bit of a buffer to buy that equipment, so you don't have to dip back into your balance sheet. So you budget for it? [inaudible] We do. We do. What's the pipeline for new projects compared to now versus the past few years? [inaudible] Actually, I'll hang on this one for a second. The current size of the commercial solar market is systems that should roughly be able to produce around $5 billion of revenue a year, and per Wood Mackenzie, the potential size of the market, and this is rooftop only, is 9x that. So there's a lot of assets that haven't been built yet and a lot of real estate that hasn't been approached. There are some very strong drivers of growth, we think. Power demand is growing. We do believe there's a bit of a re-industrialization of the United States. We think a lot of factories and activities are gonna come back to this country, which we support, and they're gonna all need power. All of them, most of them, are very eager to have that power without an associated carbon emission, and that's a trick you want to solve, and building-sited solar does a lot of good on the way there. The electrification of everything, which means that from distillates and diesel and other things, we think a lot of vehicles are going to sort of shift into electrical. You can charge your Tesla at home as well, but nobody really wants to charge a school bus at home. And so those things all will effectively turn into kind of commercial facility gas stations that we think we can help power. This translates into a pipeline that, in the case of Altus, comes to us from a couple of different sources: from CBRE, of course, from Blackstone, existing customers, which we like because it's a very low cost of acquisition, they're already with us, channel partners, who are these other people who are building current systems that they want us to buy, or existing solar systems. And so between all of these, there's roughly a pipeline of 1 GW right now that we're mining so that we can add to our existing 840, give or take, MW of assets in the ground. And if you came to our office in Stamford, Connecticut, we have people across the country, we have offices on the West Coast, but our main office is in Stamford. You'd find a significant number of people up there sitting on the origination desk, talking to new big tenants, Iron Mountain, TJ Maxx, and, and others, and also talking to landlords about building these solar systems, which are assets and discussions that will then go into our pipeline. So are you saying that 842 MW that exist already can generate $5 billion? [inaudible] No, we're about 4%-6% of the market- So this is our share of that. There's been something like 22 GW of solar built, about half of it commercial scale solar. Half of it has been built and is owned by the real estate owner themselves, and the other half is third-party owned. So that all those solar assets, depending a little bit on price, should correspond to $5 billion of revenue. I think we are out of time, unfortunately. Thank you.