Hi everyone, and good morning. Thank you for joining us at Needham & Company's 28th Annual Growth Conference. My name is Neil Young, and I'm a Semiconductor Analyst for Needham & Company. It is my pleasure to host this presentation from InterDigital. InterDigital is a global research and development company focused primarily on wireless, video, AI, and related technologies. The company designs and develops foundational technologies that enable connected, immersive experiences in a broad range of communications and entertainment products and services. Additionally, the company licenses its innovations worldwide to companies providing such products and services, including makers of wireless communications devices, consumer electronics, IoT devices, cars, and other motor vehicles, and providers of cloud-based services such as video streaming. Joining me from the company today is... Sorry, Chen. Oh, my name is Liren, Liren Chen. I'm the President and CEO for InterDigital. Thank you for the introduction. Welcome. Thank you for joining us, and I think I have 40 minutes, so I plan to go through a summary deck of slides to introduce the company, explain the foundational technology we do, and also describe all the growth opportunities we have executed on and also going forward all the way to 2030. I'll try to leave about 10 minutes for questions, but in the meantime, if you have any questions while I'm presenting, feel free to raise your hand, and I'll do the best I can to address them. All right? Thank you. Okay, disclaimer. I'm not going to read it. One thing I want to clarify is there's a lot of financial/business development status, and the snapshot we took was end of Q3 of 2025. The reason being we are releasing our Q4 as well as full year results in about a month. For obvious reasons, we are not incorporating those numbers into this deck of slides. All right, so in my presentation today, I'll give you the highest level of company introduction, our business model, what we work on. As always, the achievement of the business dream by a team. So I'll explain who we are at the high level. I'll give you some examples of foundational technology we are working on, why they are super important. We'll lay out a long-term growth strategy, and the strategy, frankly, was explained in detail about a year and a half ago in our Investor Day, July of 2024, and I'll compare and contrast what was the status at that time, where we are today, and where we are going by 2030. All right, then I'll finish with one summary slide, and then I'll take questions. All right, this is a one-pager summary summarizing what the key ingredients are of our business, why we are successful for what we do, and also a whole year financial summary at the bottom for FY24. As I said earlier, in about a quarter, we'll give you the latest summary for 2025, so I'll start with the team. We have a world-class team. Our team is driven primarily by researchers, but we also have the leading experts in licensing, in IP, and also in foundational developmental research, and we do very basic research at the foundational level, which I'll explain in the following slide. The company is 50+ years old. We were involved in developing every single generation of cellular technology, and we are increasingly putting more money and effort into video and AI and other functions. We have built a very large patent portfolio. I want to emphasize for a couple of words. One, it's an evergreen nature of patent portfolio. Some of you guys are familiar with some IP companies, and some of them are based on acquired patent asserting them. So very often when I engage investors, I get the question to say, when is your patent going to expire? And I explain to them we license at portfolio level, and as long as we keep on the idea engine going, the portfolio as a whole will be staying evergreen and increasing in value. All right, our customers are very long-term. Some of our customers have been with us for almost 30+ years now, and we generally sign contracts in a very long term, which I'll explain in the following slide here, and think of us as an IP as a service licensing model. People pay for a subscription to our portfolio. The revenue, by definition, is recurring in nature, and then we are able to build on top of layers and layers of technology. What we enable is super, super big, and this is just for the cellular piece alone. If you look at the overall ecosystem side from the device to infrastructure services to applications, the technology and services and product building on top of what we enable is a gigantic number. It's literally measured in trillions and trillions of dollars. Our licensing model, we take a very small slice of the big pie, and that's our key ingredients of our business model. Just try to put into context, it's hard to see what is $5.7 trillion. If this were a separate country, this would be the third largest economy in the world in terms of annual GDP. It's a huge thing that our technology enables. On the bottom, I have a later slide breakdown of the numbers. We have a lot of success. Our revenue is growing really fast in terms of year-over-year growth, and our business model inherently when we grow revenue, our profitability grows faster than revenue, and our margin is considered very high in our industry. Frankly, relatively speaking, in any industry, we are very well-funded for the reason I'll explain later on. Our biggest customers are some of the biggest names, Apple, Samsung, Lenovo, Oppo, who are leading customers in smartphones as well as some other devices. All right, here's the team. I'm not going to go through all of them. Two of us are here. I'm standing here, our CFO, Rich, is in the audience, so if you have time, you should approach him for the more difficult questions. All of us have decades and decades of experience. Some of us have done built our career in some other companies bigger than we are, but I like to think of the team together, we are the best team in our industry. Right, what do we do? Okay, the key ingredient in our business boils down to two factors. Number one is we hire the best people, solving the most difficult problem. We try to be 5 to 10 years ahead of time. When we solve those problems that have never ever been solved before, we file a patent to protect them. Eventually, we license our IP, get paid, and put the money back into R&D, but that's only half the story. The other half of the story is we actually send our engineers to global standard development organizations to advocate for our position, to overall win leadership roles in this organization, to incorporate our technology into different versions of the open standard, and standard is our go-to-market strategy. Standard is what allows our technology to be in many, many billions of devices. Standard, frankly, by having the technology in the standard, so we ensure our technology gets widely adopted. We ensure people who use it having essentially need a license or IP. So those two things go hand in hand, which I'll explain a little bit further. So the three pillars of our research, I could spend an hour on each one of them, but I'm not going to. So for wireless, think about anything that's wireless connected, cellular-enabled, 3G, 4G, 5G, and now we're working on 6G. That'll be commercialized at the end of the decade. We're also a major contributor for Wi-Fi. That's obviously on your laptop or your phones. But we're also one of the key leaders in video development. Video by video primarily means video codec, but there's also other technology that makes your video more vibrant, makes the color a wider range, makes everything smoother, makes the transformation of content more efficient, a lot of them. And increasingly, we are putting more effort into AI. We are actually a foundational developer in AI for multiple decades now, but with all the attention in AI, that's increasingly become more important. But we are solving AI problems at a different layer, at the foundational layer, not the service or app layer, which I'll touch on a little bit more. All right, why solving the end-to-end video delivery problem such an interesting and challenging topic? Why is that such a high-value use case? It boils down to what is consumer buying? When the consumer buys the latest phone, buys the latest TV, buys the latest iPad, buys the latest PC, pays for hundreds and hundreds of dollars for a combination of subscriptions, what are they buying? They are buying a consumption, a consumption of video. As of today, video on average is driving 80% of internet traffic. The trend is not going to stop. This is going to be a vast merged system people are building. By the way, that's already with encoding, with codec, which I'll explain without codec what's going to happen. All right, okay, this is an interesting chart. I know it's a bit hard to read, but let me sort of walk you through it. On the left-hand side, this is a 4K HD movie. My engineer who created this style happened to be a fan of Deadpool. It could be any movie, by the way. If that content without compression in the raw format, it's going to be 11+ TB. So you say, what is 11 TB? That number is so hard to grasp. I'll tell you, without compression, if you're having an average internet connection at home, it's going to take you roughly two weeks to download the movie. Two weeks. With compression, on the right-hand side, we are blowing up a very small square on the right-hand side. This chart is done proportionally. With multiple generations of codec, each generation of codec is more advanced, frankly, more complex. They are able to compress the same content with the same quality with less bandwidth. So if you combine them, the latest generation codec is able to compress 11 TB into about 9 GB. That's a compression ratio of more than 1,000 times to 1. That's what allows you to download that Netflix video you're going to watch at the airport on the plane before you take off. Otherwise, you would never be able to do it. So let me talk about standard a little bit here. So why do we need standard? I mean, everything seems fine without standard. By the way, I always make a statement, which I have been proven to be right every time, to say from the time you wake up today to the time you sit here, you have touched on dozens and dozens of standards. Standard is everywhere. You look around, that socket for power is standardized. That voltage is standardized. That socket for the light is standardized, and standard is what allows you to promote interoperability, allows you to do compatibility. It's giving the scalability of the economy, but you can boil down the benefit to multiple layers. Consumers want standard because that's what it'll allow your iPhone to talk to Android device. An implementer like a device maker wanted standard because then they can make one device and sell it worldwide. I'm old enough to remember the days 20-some years ago using different phones when you go to Europe versus the U.S. versus China. You literally need to get a new phone from the IT department. Oh, I'm traveling next week. I need a new phone. The hidden cost for the vendor is very high. That means they need to produce different versions of the same product. They have to manage the inventory. They have to stock them. They don't always do a good job of predicting the volume. So there's going to be a lot of waste. Standard allows them to make one thing that works everywhere. But there's also operator. Standard for the operator means they can roll out their different generation technology over time in different regions. Standard is built to be backward compatible. That allows the carrier who paid many, many billions of dollars to buy the spectrum to deploy the network over time, allow the user to use the technology ubiquitously, adjusting to the best quality they can do. So we are one of the leaders in the standard development. By my estimate, we are one of the handful of leaders who lead the wireless and video and AI together. And you will see why. Why do people want your engineer to lead standard? Because those groups are very highly sought after. People wanted to be leading the development of standard because you had a better understanding. You, frankly, have a stronger influence on the future direction of technology. So boil it down to a few things. One is we have a long history. Our engineers are very, very good. They earn people's trust by paying the due, by working on this many, many decades of time. That's important. Second thing is people understand our business model to know, hey, you build a technology, but you share them. We are not one of those vendors who build something, control it, and keep it to ourselves. Our business model inherently is sharing to other people. So if I support you, I can guarantee there's some kind of benefit for me over time. The third one, which is not 100% by design, but the fact that we don't make product means we do not compete against that product division of the other company. So think of somewhat a Switzerland of standard because they know our engineers, our company are driven by neutral position on the product side, but driven 100% by the technical merit of the solution. So that itself very often gives us a better chance of being selected to the chair position for the standard organization. All right, those are not random pictures I downloaded from the internet, just for clarification. Those are real pictures for my engineers who are currently in the leadership position of very important standard organizations. 3GPP is what defines cellular standards, 3G, 4G, 5G, going forward 6G. ETSI, it's a European branch of the cellular organization. ATIS is the U.S. branch. IEEE is what defines the Wi-Fi and so on and so forth. On the bottom, those are the video standards. And those are our real engineers. If you pay close attention to the small font, you're recognizing some of the mature positions, some of the vice-chair positions, some of them actually says AI and machine learning. Those are indications of AI being incorporated into the wireless standard, into the video standard already, and our engineers are actually leading them. Just try to hit the home here. This is one of the blocks we have joined, 3GPP, this defining 5G, going forward defining 6G. There's literally only 15 chairs, only 15 of them. Every company in our industry wants to have one of them. We are one of the very few companies who have more than one. And you recognize all the names on them. China Mobile has two. China Mobile is the number one carrier in the world. They have about 700 million-800 million subscribers. And then the other company is Samsung. So among all the companies, everyone wanted them, we have two chairs. That's just an indication of how widely our engineers are being respected, how we have led the development of standard. All right, this is another interesting topic. So there's a company called LexisNexis, which is probably the number one ranking company of IP and innovation in the industry. Earlier, they published a study of the most innovative company in the world. This is not just in our industry. It's not a U.S. company only. This is worldwide company-wise. Four years in a row, we have been ranked as one of the top most innovative companies in the world. They actually said we are driving the highest level of innovation momentum in the industry. Now let's talk about patent. Patents are our product. We don't make other products. We make IP. IP is our product. So we are growing our patent portfolio quite a bit in the last eight years here, growing by size and, more importantly, by diversity. We used to be a primary wireless company, as you can tell from the cellular assets in our pie. Now cellular is still very big. Arguably, it's still the most important asset, but we added a bunch of other stuff in there. And collectively, they combine enormous valuable IP portfolio that people need to take a license for. On the right-hand side, this is really sort of the evergreen point. Every single day, on average, we get six new patents added to our portfolio every single day. And I always clarify to that includes weekends. That's really how robust the engine is. Now let's talk about business momentum. I'm doing OK on time. So I'll go through a few things here. One is we started, frankly, for 2020. I joined the company, by the way, five years ago. So this is very close to my five-year anniversary. Within the five years here, we have signed more than 50 license agreements. By the way, on average, our license agreement is roughly a five-year term. When people negotiate, we don't do one-year deals because those are, frankly, complex negotiations. More importantly, people know our technology is long-term. It's in the standard. They have to use it. So there's no point of thinking, hey, next year, I'm not using it. So those are long-term agreements. And we're summarizing the total contract value. And so in the last 4+ years, again, this goes all the way to September of 2025. Doesn't count the last quarter. Doesn't count the beginning of the year yet. So we have signed more than $4 billion worth of contracts. Our margins were down through about every negotiation. And if you look at the names for those vendors, you are recognizing some of the largest vendors in the world, both in the mobile industry together with a lot of other consumer electronics, together with some other very large, large companies in the United States, in China, and everywhere else. This is another slice of how we demonstrate business progress. So we like to think our business model is close to a subscription-based model. People pay for recurring revenue subscription to our IP. So one of the parameters people use to measure progress is annualized recurring revenue. Essentially, it's how much repeatability you can count on of your revenue. So as you can tell from the last several years, we are able to grow quite a bit, quite meaningfully going through. So one of the questions I get was, hey, what happened to 2021, 2022, 2023? The first three years, what happened here? Because in those years, we were actually working on some largest renewal in our contract pipeline. That's when we were able to renew the Apple and Samsung and other progress. Because they are renewal here, we are able to increment, adding on top of those existing contracts one by one. I can go through the detail offline. But collectively, once we had done some major renewal, we were able to get a lot of new customers adding to the pie. That's where we were able to grow the very significantly in the last several years. This is what we fondly refer to as the four-panel chart, which is Rich's favorite chart. He loves this chart because what it says is we are able to grow the revenue quite a bit in the last few years. If you try to do the CAGR on these four or five years here, it's 25% CAGR. But the beauty for our business is once you invest in foundational research, once you build a patent IP portfolio, then any new customer we sign to add on top of the revenue, they come with a 100% profit margin. So the power of our business model inherently will be able to drive profitability faster than revenue growth. And this chart demonstrates that. We measure by adjusted EBITDA. You can tell our adjusted EBITDA margin was overall total value as well as margin has been increasing. And our EPS, which is also a benefit of share buybacks, has gone up even faster, which is shown on the right top chart. And on the bottom, it's our share capital returning, primarily done by dividend as well as share buybacks. For last year alone, we increased our dividend by roughly 50% from $0.45 per quarter to $0.70. And our buybacks for share repurchase for the last, I think, 10+ years was more than $1 billion. And we are able to very meaningfully reduce the shares outstanding overall. All right, so this is a little bit bragging, but this is not me bragging. This is third party recognizing us. So for the last year alone, we have received quite a few rewards. And those are just a selection of them. We are ranked the number one of all the medium-sized companies by Forbes. They have their own criteria. We didn't influence them. They have their growth, EPS, and valuations, and all this stuff here. So we are being recognized quite a bit for the ability we grew the business. And we are recognized by the way we drive innovation. Now let's talk about long-term strategy. So our goal, which was laid out in July of 2024, was we want to grow our recurring revenue. At the time, it was about $400+ million to about $1 billion by 2030. So if you look at the color coding here, the sort of dark blue is what we delivered by Q3 of 2025. And the light blue was what we set as a target in July of 2024. So when we set the target in July 2024, our, frankly, recurring revenue of smartphone at the time is about $350 million. We said, oh, we think we can grow to $500 million. At the time, by the way, I got a lot of questions. People said, hey, that market is stagnant. It's growing at a much slower pace. How can you grow it that fast? We'll say, hey, there's multiple drivers. Drivers in getting more devices sold under license and also try to achieve an incremental value when you renew them, so I'm very pleased to see that as of Q3 of 2025, our recurring revenue of smartphone is already at $490+ million. Obviously, that's very close. It's within striking distance of $500 million, and we are roughly two years ahead of schedule, and then the other bucket, which is consumer electronics, IoT, and auto, which I'll have a breakdown for later slide here. At the time, we were roughly $50 million, and now we are close to $100 million, so we are growing. It's a smaller segment. It's actually growing percentage-wise faster. But the biggest question mark is in the online streaming industry, which I'll take a later slide to explain what it is and why do we mean we can grow something from $0 to $300, which at the surface feels very ambitious. But I could tell you that we believe we can do it. All right, let's break it down here. On the smartphone side, that number used to be 50% when we laid it out. And now we are 85%. That means we have licensed the top 8 of the top 10 smartphone vendors worldwide. This is not China. This is not the U.S. This is worldwide. So if you're recognizing on the right-hand side, those are the vendors already under license. And those are the very few outliers. Again, I don't want to get into individual of them, but I can answer your question offline. So we are very, very close to achieving our goal. Our target is to keep on growing the industry together with the overall pie expansion, both by volume as well as our content per device. Keep in mind, we came by adding new technology into different generations. So the type of footprint IP we have in a device keeps on growing over time. And consumer electronics and IoT, this is more than one market. This is a collection of fragments, some are smaller markets. I'll walk you through it. We are licensing PC market. A lot of you guys are still using PCs. PC has Wi-Fi connectivity. PC has video capability. So we are licensing to that space. As of today, as of September of 2025, we have licensed about 60%. Those are big names. We are getting paid on them. And on the TV side, again, almost all the TVs are Wi-Fi connected. All the TVs have video capability, so we are licensing together with a joint venture with Sony, which is long-lasting, which has been going on for multiple decades now, and we are making very good progress, so the dark blue are the portion licensed, and then the light blue and others are the ones that we keep on working on, and then let's talk a little bit about other connected devices here or connected cars. I consider cars as just smartphones on wheels. They have connectivity. They have processing. They have Wi-Fi. They have other stuff in there. This is only talking about the cellular connectivity piece, which we are a part of our joint platform with a third party called Avanci. We are licensing both 4G and 5G connectivity. And there's actually quite a little bit of progress on there. If you look at the 4G portion, it's already licensed pretty much every single major automobile vendors in the world, but for some new vendors of EV in China, which they are making progress. But also, cars are starting adopting 5G technology. Automobile industry, as you guys probably know, tends to have a longer adoption curve. But the good news is once you are in, you are in for the long haul. So when 5G takes off, it started taking off here, there will be meaningful uplifting of the per vehicle value of IP in those vehicles. And then there's a number of other connected IoT, both on cellular-enabled as well as Wi-Fi-enabled devices that we are pursuing. Collectively, this is all a very large pie. And our goal, as a reminder, is to monetize roughly $200 million recurring revenue from this pie up to 2030. Along the path, we'll collect a lot of catch-up revenue, which I'll touch on a little bit. But this is the large opportunity here. This is our greenfield opportunity, if you would. This is the cloud opportunity. And sometimes we'll say, oh, yeah, you started from zero, which I will correct. No. Square 0 is R&D. Square 1 is building the IP portfolio. Square 2 is building the team to licensing. So we are frankly already made a lot of progress. We have the foundational research. We have extraordinarily valuable IP. And we are licensing in the industry for a couple of years. And then the industry is very, very large. When we did the slides in the summer of 2024, the forecast said by 2027, this industry will be the same size in terms of annualized revenue as smartphone. But they were actually wrong. This industry is growing faster. And the latest report says, as of today, the streaming industry in terms of annualized revenue is the same size as smartphone, and it's growing at a faster pace. So this is a very important market for us. Our technology is what allowed them to compress this content a thousand times to one, allowed them to save in bandwidth, power, cooling, storage, memory, all kinds of stuff. So therefore, it's an enormously valuable piece of technology, and we feel we deserve to be paid. But so of this $300+ million opportunity we laid out by 2030, we're only covering the first two blocks. There's frankly other opportunities we'll keep on growing in terms of video driven use cases. So now let's talk a little bit of capital allocation. By the way, our CFO, Rich, is here. He's an expert on this. If you have follow-up questions, I encourage you to ask him. But our capital allocation strategy is actually multi-pronged. Number one, we need to make sure we have a very strong balance sheet. The reason being we negotiate with some of the largest vendors in the world. Those vendors are 100 to 1,000 times bigger than we are. We need to demonstrate we have the capability. We have the staying power in the industry to convince them to work with us on long term. The second thing is really our business requires to make long-term investment, 5 to 10 years. Building a patent portfolio is expensive. Hiring the best minds in the world is expensive. So we need to make sure they are properly funded to keep on growing, and our business properly scaled up produces a lot of cash, and we are being selective in M&A strategy. Recently, we bought a startup company based in the U.K. on AI research. We bought their expertise. We bought their patent portfolio. Interestingly enough, we are trying to leverage our standards expertise to try to get that technology into the next generation open standard. That M&A piece, we are selective. We have a very high bar, but we are able to do it. Largely, as I said earlier, due to our business success, we produce a lot of cash. We increase our dividend quite a bit. We have done a lot of meaningful acquisitions, and we look to do more going forward. And that's our long-term target. People say, where do you want to be when you grow up? And so this is by 2030. We are confident, and we hope we will make our target. And in order to make it, we need to get our ARR annualized recurring revenue by 10% double digit year-over-year. But we have done more in the last few years. And we want to maintain our margin at 60% adjusted EBITDA margin. By the way, in the past couple of years, we are at or exceeding that target, which allows me to invest more in organic growth, even though we will scale up, but we will increase more. And by doing so, we will produce a lot of net margin. And we will do more in terms of new area of research, in terms of new area of licensing. I believe this is my last chart, but before I go through, I promised to explain to you what is catch-up, what is recurring. Keep in mind our technology is in the standard, has been in the standard for decades now. Keep in mind the people who have not paid us have been infringing our IP for a long time. When we sign people up for the very first time, we'll negotiate for going forward rate, which adds to our ARR. We'll also try to negotiate for a fair settlement of the past infringing our IP up to that point. That is what we classify as catch-up payment. The catch-up payment by its nature is one-time only, but it's real money. In the last 4+ that have been here, we have collected more than $1 billion worth of catch-up payment. And that catch-up payment is being funded to our R&D, research, and also being funded for our share repurchase. So that's the definition. So I have gone through all of them. I believe we have a worldwide team. I believe our momentum is accelerating. We have been recognized by peers as one of the most successful companies. We are one of the large four, if you would, in terms of licensing technology in the field. Addressable market is very big for our existing branch, as well as very big on the cloud side. It's growing very fast. And I'm quite confident in our ability to deliver. With that, I'm happy to answer your questions. Yes. Hi. Thank you for taking the time to present. I really enjoyed hearing your presentation. I saw that InterDigital recently won the litigation battle against Disney. So congratulations on that. Shortly thereafter, there was a new litigation put out against Amazon. Are you able to speak to any level of confidence you have in winning there and any potential financial impacts it might have on the company going forward? Yes. So that's a very good question. So first of all, I'll start with to say we always prefer bilateral negotiation to get deals done. As I demonstrated, of the 50+ deals we have signed during my term here, 90%+ of them are done through negotiation. However, there are cases where after years and years of negotiation, we could not get a deal done. Then we feel it's not fair for people to keep on infringing our IP, to frankly keep on not paying us. It's not fair to us. It's not fair to other competitors who are paying. So we make that decision very carefully. And we do, on occasion, have to enforce our right. So Disney, in particular, we negotiated with them for multiple years. And their streaming business, which includes Disney+, Hulu, and ESPN+, is more than $25 billion revenue with 250 million subscribers. So we decided to launch our litigation against them last February, February 25. And the case actually is proceeding exactly quite well. We asserted roughly a dozen different patents in different jurisdictions. So far, four of the patents have been decided at different levels of legal process in Brazil and Germany. And based on third-party expert, the court has heard in Brazil. And based on the court judgment in Germany, we win on four out of four of the patents. Our patent was found to be valid. We were found to be infringed. And the court actually ordered Disney to either pay us a license or stop infringing our IP. So honestly speaking, you cannot do any better. I mean, four out of four is awesome. And the speed we come to in conclusion to decision is also quite smooth. But it's not done. I mean, we still have frankly 8+ other patents in different jurisdictions that will go to trial by June or September time frame. And I'm confident with our case. But we have to wait for the court to decide. That's our current status for Disney. Amazon's been interesting. Amazon actually litigated against us first. And Amazon is a licensee for us on the device side for a certain segment of technology. So they decided to go to U.K. court and litigate against us in August of last year. And we responded to the case. I will not bore you with all the gory detail on the legal procedure because they are fast-changing. Long story short, we are currently asserting our patent in multiple jurisdictions against them on both our service side as well as our device side. We will, unlike Disney, Amazon actually make and import devices into the United States. So by the way, we disclose all the details in 10-K. We will keep on updating them as the procedure progresses. Awesome. Thank you. Yeah. Yes. I guess a separate question. Could you talk about comparing InterDigital against any peers in the space, any competitive advantages you guys have or a moat that separates you from the rest of the pack? Yeah. Look, it depends on how you define the market. If you define the market as R&D and IP-driven company, there's actually quite a few of us. I mean, if you think about, you can define the whole software industry as an IP company because they are copyright-driven. But I know that's not how most people think. So there's a number of publicly traded companies. And they do license different technology. I'm actually not going to name them because I know most of them. We do get together for dinner. And so what I like to say is always think about the layer of innovation we do, which is the foundational layer, which has certain advantages because then you don't have to make bets on the application layer, which one will become bigger and better over time. And also think about our strengths in the standard side. Some of those other companies, if they operate in a different layer, sometimes they are more operating in the implementation layer, which has advantages, which also has disadvantages. So, I'll say all of us have our own secret sauce. I'm happy to hear what we have. And we have demonstrated our business has a lot of growth still in there. Thank you. Yeah. Good. All right. Thank you for everyone participating. I know I'm between you and lunch, so I won't spend more than what I allocated. So enjoy the rest of the conference. Thank you.