Okay, good afternoon. Welcome, everyone. I'm Mark Murphy, software analyst with JP Morgan, and it is a great pleasure to be here with Henry Schuck, who's the Founder and CEO of ZoomInfo, seated right next to me, as well as Cameron Hyzer, who is the CFO of ZoomInfo. So, first off, welcome to the conference, and we really appreciate you being here with us. Great. Thank you for having us, Mark. So maybe we could just begin with a kind of quick one-minute introduction to ZoomInfo for the benefit of anyone out there who might not be familiar. Sure. ZoomInfo is software and data that helps go-to-market professionals, sales, marketing, revenue operations, sales operations professionals identify their next best customers and have the data needed to engage with them. And so what the foundation of ZoomInfo is company and contact data across 100 million companies, 300 million business professionals, and we've surrounded that with a tremendous amount of signal and insight that tells you when a potential customer is in market for your products and services, and then workflow technology to take action on that. So, Henry, I was sitting here with you, I believe it was two years ago, at the conference, and that was the first time that you mentioned, in this economic cycle, and you were early, I think, mentioning it, that, you know, some of your sales teams had started to say at that point that deals are taking a little longer. And we've obviously been in this kind of macro, deceleration phase, you know, pretty, pretty broadly now, since then. How far do you think we're in? You know, how far do you think we have gone through the down cycle? I think we're trying to understand, you know, do you see your customers getting to a point where they might be done, you know, cutting into the fat, maybe they're cutting into the muscle or the bone now? Or, you know, the other scenario is, we're through some of the pain in the tech industry, right? And then, and then you could still have a little bit of non-tech contraction moving forward. How do you think this through? Yeah, I think in Q1, we saw a number of signs that told us that we're starting to see improvement in the customer base, and where over the last two years, where we've stayed relatively strong is on the new business side, and what we're trying to get our arms around is net retention in the customer base, renewal rate and net retention in the customer base. In Q1, we saw enterprise retention and renewal rates stabilize, then improve. We saw the same thing happen in mid-market. We saw it stabilize, we saw that continue through April. We felt really good about those trends. Where we still have noise and volatility is in our SMB segment. When you think about the customer base, there are obviously two factors that drive net retention in the customer base. One is just your net renewal rate, and then the second is your net retention rate, which is upsell. And over the last year and a half, we've taken a much more customer-first, customer-centric view of our customer base. We said: Look, we created a bunch of new product. We acquired a bunch of new product over the previous three years. We showed up to every customer interaction and said, "Do you want to add this? Do you want to add this? Do you want to add this?" And what we found between 2022 and 2023 is that customers were in a very different state of mind. Mm-hmm. They didn't want to add new things. In fact, you know, we had a customer who bought 600 seats, and they showed up to the call, and they said: You know, we only have 400 sellers, and so these 200 seats, I'm not even using, and your reps just keep showing up and asking me if I want to buy more things. So we pulled back, and we've spent the last year really driving customer trust and customer health and getting our customers into a place where they're really healthy and there's fertile ground for us there. And in the meantime, we spent the last year building our ZoomInfo Copilot product- Mm-hmm. Which is the first product we're bringing to market really in the last 2.5 years. We feel really strongly about that product. We think it's gonna have a meaningful impact on the upsell, on the upsell side of things, and then really drive net retention in the customer base. Our account managers and account executives have been using it for the last quarter, so they're very familiar with it, and the early feedback from our customers is really strong. I think that makes a meaningful impact in net retention for us. So your customers have been in this non-expansionary, you know, headspace for a while. You saw some encouraging signs that you mentioned in Q1, and now. And you have some excitement about the Copilot product that I think we'll definitely. I'll definitely wanna come back to that- Sure. In a couple of moments. But it, Henry, if we zoom out for a moment, you know, we have been pointing out that what has been happening, if you look at front office revenue-generating, you know, software landscape, it's been a very broad slowdown, right? It has affected everyone. You know, if you look at the more transactional systems, they may still be growing 10%-20%, maybe a HubSpot or a Freshworks. Some of them are in mid-single digits. I think if we look at Twilio or LinkedIn, they're kind of in that zone. Presumably, I would say some of the private companies may be shrinking because their headcount is down. But you have more exposure to the software vertical. The software vertical has been tougher. If you look outside of that, do you view ZoomInfo as kind of gaining, maintaining, or ceding, you know, share in this current environment where you are today? Gaining outside of tech and software, and I would say even in tech and software, we're starting to see stabilization there as well. But outside of tech and software is where our business is growing double digits, where we're finding new use cases, where traditional companies like a, you know, a Cintas or an Aramark or a Carrier, where they have large sales forces, are just starting to think about: How do I drive productivity, productivity and efficiency in those teams? How do I use data and intelligence to drive better outcomes for those teams? And then you're seeing an emergence of chief data officers, particularly in the enterprise, where they actually have authority and budget to do things, where historically they've kind of been like an innovation farm. Mm-hmm. Today, they're gaining more authority, more budget, and when they're thinking about the initiatives that they need to launch, particularly around AI, they're also recognizing a hole in the data. That the data that they have to work on is inaccurate, it's not complete, cannot be used for AI-related initiatives, and then they're pulling us through there. We talked about in the quarter, our largest increase in our multimillion-dollar cohort, customers spending over $1 million with us. We see continued excitement from the customer base in the, in the enterprise. So a double-digit, you know, growth glide path outside of the software vertical. Yeah. You're gaining share there. What about the, what about the trend toward... You know, a lot of, a lot of companies have been trying to reduce the list of vendors that they're dealing with. I think the trend toward platform consolidation has been something that's been very noticeable right across all of our work. Are you seeing any more or less interest in that? Like, are, are, are there cases where, where customers are calling you and saying, "We need, we need to get off of a bunch of point products and kind of consolidate onto, onto ZoomInfo? Look, I think where you actually have opportunity here is less in the front office, in sales tech, there isn't, there hasn't been a migration to consolidation today. A lot of like, if you think about the vendors like Outreach or Salesloft or Gong or Clari, they all have kind of pieces of the puzzle, and every place where they've gone outside of their core- Mm. They have, like, a second-rate, also-ran platform. And so it's not compelling for companies in this space to consolidate where they get one strong thing and then eight really weak ones. They'd rather- Mm. have best in class across, across the, the software stack. Where we see a real opportunity with this is with data, where our customers, they buy North American contact data and company data from us, then they get something else in Europe, and then something else in LATAM. They get intent data from another vendor. They get, website-to-company data from another vendor. They get company and hierarchy data from another vendor. They get funding data from another vendor. That's where there's a big opportunity to consolidate, where we have the, we have, best-in-class data assets across all of those, and we can show up and say, "Listen, you've got eight different global vendors for a bunch of different data. You could get it in one pipe from us. You could get it through DaaS, you can get it, you can have it in the platform for your sellers." There's a much bigger, more real opportunity to consolidate across what has become data sprawl across the- Mm-hmm mid-market and enterprise than I think there is to consolidate a bunch of sales point solutions. So, there's more of a consolidation impetus at that back end kind of data infrastructure layer than at the front-end application layer? Yeah, definitely. Do you think, is that going to evolve over, in the fullness of time? Do you think that's gonna kind of move its way up to the app layer? I think to the extent that... Look, it's, it's an interesting time right now, right? Because the, like you said, the private companies, they're shrinking or they're flat, and that means that most of their energy is focused back on their core, not on the expansion areas. And that means they're not gonna be consolidators either. And so you have this moment in time where I don't think consolidation is gonna materialize in a real way, because no one is putting together best-in-class assets outside of the core thing that they- Mm-hmm they do. Mm-hmm. Now, when I think about the, you know, the data consolidation, that's something that we've always been focused on, has always been a core tenet of ours. And then what we've seen over the last three years is, companies don't know what the right hand doesn't know what the left hand is doing, and they went out and doubled up vendors in a number of different places, and it's ripe for consolidation in a different way. You know, as we try to wrap our arms around, you know, what inning this kind of, you know, rev tech opportunity is, you know, I think sometimes there's a temptation to think about this a little bit in terms of seat penetration. I don't know, Cameron or Henry, if either of you, you know, have a feel for where that stands. You know, there were cases, I mean, I think at the time of the IPO, you know, there were cases where, you know, you could have a huge enterprise field selling team or even looking at the broader, the entire sales and marketing team. We would say, "Well, there are a lot of seats at ZoomInfo, but it's only 3% penetrated," or something like that. Is there a way to think about this? You know, how many ZoomInfo licenses are sold into your typical customer now? Or maybe another way to look at it is, if they have 100 seats of Salesforce, you know, how many seats of ZoomInfo do you think they've absorbed at this point? Still very, very small, particularly in the enterprise. I would tell you it's like high single digits penetration of the seats that we could have. And I'll tell you, just if I back out a little bit and I think about what every company wants to do from a go-to-market perspective. What every company wants to do is they want to take their first-party data, data that exists in CRM or marketing automation tools that tell them something about their customer. They're in this stage of opportunity. Maybe they came to this webinar or clicked on this link in an email, and they want to marry that with third-party data and insights that live outside of their CRM or marketing automation system, not their first-party data. That, you know, for us, that's company data, contact data. But it's more importantly, insights and digital breadcrumb that tells you a company is potentially in market for your products and services. And so that's like, are they researching your products and solutions or competitors on the B2B web? Did they just hire somebody in their buying committee? Did they say something on an earnings call that would indicate they're struggling with a problem that your product or solution solves? And what every company, when you go to every company, they're thinking about: How do I do this? How do I bring it together? Where do I bring it together? Do I put it in Snowflake or Databricks? Do I put it in Google BigQuery? How do I join it? How do I join that third-party data from ZoomInfo and others to my first-party data, and then how do I get signal once I've joined it? Just... If you just imagine a revenue operations professional or a sales operations professional trying to do that at any company, and the ticket line they're gonna have to get into to get that data into Snowflake, to get a provision, to get a join, to get another developer- It'll never happen. It'll never happen. But maybe the worst thing is, a lot of money will chase trying to make that happen with disappointing results. Because once I've even gotten that signal, I have to deliver it to a sales rep, or I have to deliver it to a system to take action on it downstream, and the interfaces to deliver that are incredibly bad. And so these even though the vision is right, the execution is next to impossible right now, and it requires a major investment. You know, one developer is gonna fully burdened, who's any good, is gonna cost you call it $350,000-$500,000. You're gonna need a team of them, and a UI person, and a product person. And so the investment behind seeing that vision come to life is astronomical, and most people will never get... The vast majority of people will never get to it. Our hope is that with two things, with Copilot, what we're really confident of, is, one, we deliver that, take your first-party data, marry it to ZoomInfo, and then we have the UX downstream to deliver those to you in Slack and email and ZoomInfo. And then we've built AI that will take those signals and write the communication for you, much better than any of my account executives or account managers can do, and I think they're pretty good. And then it's taking that action for you downstream. So what that means for us, this is a very roundabout way to answer your question, Mark, but what that means for us is instead of being tied just to a sales development representative and a couple of account executives, this platform gives us a right to expand ZoomInfo across a much broader range of sellers, account managers, marketing automation professionals, sales operation professionals, than we've historically been able to. I think one of the really interesting things about the Copilot platform is we're actually not only able to take your first-party structured information and all the ZoomInfo company and contact data, but also signals. But we also have existing connectivity into a lot of our customers and a lot of great tools to take unstructured first-party information. So you think about what's in your email system, what's in your conversations that you're having with customers, and bringing it in to enhance the signal even more, puts you at a spot where, you know, that's unimaginable and even further than what people are already trying to contemplate. Because the Copilot, the LLM, can parse through and ingest- Yep and kind of, you know- Yep ... pull the signal out of the noise. Well, and we already do that, right? Yep. We're already recording conversations, taking AI, transcribing those, and pushing those into Copilot. We can do that with emails as well. So it's every conversation that you have all of a sudden becomes an important signal, that then you're marrying with third-party signal to really understand the full picture of your customers in the market. So again, industry growth rates, they're so mired down right now, right, in front office application software. But you're seeing this opportunity to expand. You're seeing that kind of at the data infrastructure layer on the back end. Sounds like there's a lot of momentum there. You've got the Copilot vision in the future, which I'll come back to in a moment. But what can this translate to for the growth of this market that you're in? I mean, so when we come out of the mired down environment, I mean, if we try to envision forward, I don't know how long it will take, but where we're in a normal kind of macroeconomic backdrop, is, you know, can we have a market that's growing 10%? Can we have a market that's growing 10%-20% at some point? Yeah, look, I think in a normalized environment without Copilot, I think you have we have a business that's growing 10%-20%. If the market normalizes growing 10%-20%, which I think it can, it will get back to, we'll have a... And look, it's not gonna get back to it the same way it got there in 2020, 2021, and 2022. The way it got there then was we just said, "Hey, you wanna grow, you wanna grow, add more headcount, add more headcount- Yep ... add more headcount. Mm-hmm. And so, you know, we were the beneficiary and then the victim of that, or I think victim is the opposite of beneficiary in that context, of that moment, right? When they were adding sales heads, they were adding ZoomInfo. When they were pulling sales head back, they were downselling ZoomInfo. I think what we have an opportunity with in the future is to drive productivity across, and this is what everybody talks to us about. You asked me this on the earnings call. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. What everybody is talking about is: How do I drive productivity across the sales reps that I have today? Mm-hmm. That continues to be a focus. Now, they're not doing it with, like, every tool that's been on the market for the last ten years, they don't believe that you can just go grab another sales engagement tool or another point solution, and that's actually gonna drive productivity for them. But when they see something that incorporates AI, that's able to predict their next best customer, what I'm seeing on calls that we're recording and having, is a different level of appetite to invest behind that than there is to invest behind adding another conversation intelligence tool. Okay, so I wanna go back, because I think about a minute and a half ago, you said, "In the last cycle, it was about hiring. Just hire more people and absorb our technologies." And it, it is just so clear that that is not what is happening in the world today. I have actually been harping on this fact, for a while now, that the software industry is just not hiring, right? Like it, like it sees a real material recovery and demand, at least that would be my opinion of it. It's sluggish. I mean, like, the headcount growth out there is very slow, and it's actually slower for a lot of companies than it is for the revenue growth rate, out there today. So I am really wondering, right, I'm wondering what your perspective on that would be. Is it just... You hear these theories: "Well, we just had a lot of bloat, right? And so there's more of, like, an efficiency mandate." You know, you hear some of that. Is there-- is it a reflection, is it a reflection of software companies maybe not seeing enough, like, quota attainment or other companies? Maybe they're just not seeing enough quota attainment to justify hiring more sales reps. Look, I think, I think two things. One, there was a long focus on growth and growth at all costs. You know, when we went public, the number one thing people would ask me is, "Can you just take margin down and grow more? Why is your margin so high? Take it down more. Take it down more. Yeah. Those conversations are not happening anymore. People are looking at the business, the unit economics of a business today, and they wanna drive productivity in their go-to-market motion in a very different way than just driving growth. Today, the questions are around driving productivity, not driving. Yeah ... not just driving growth at all costs. I do think there was bloat. There's definitely bloat. That's not untrue. I think we probably, when we bloated, we also brought down expectations from a quota perspective for our sellers. And so we said, "Hey, you know, I'd rather have three people doing $1.5 million quota, than two people doing $1 million quota, or $1.25 million quota," or whatever it is. Mm-hmm. They wanted. They brought down quota against people. And then I think we—probably the biggest thing you're seeing a reversion from is overspecialization. And what we did in the account bases at a lot of these software companies was we said, "Okay, there's an account manager. That person's responsible for renewal and upsell or for upsell. There's a customer success manager. That person's responsible for the health of the account, not responsible for upsell, just responsible for these five key engagement metrics or health metrics. There is a renewal manager. That person is just responsible for renewing the account. There's an SDR. That person is responsible for driving demand in the account." And now you've got, like, four people doing what was historically done by one person. The account manager was responsible for renewal, upsell, and the health of the account. Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. And we, we spread that out to four people, and we said, "Hey, if the account manager is just focused on driving growth, then you're driving growth in an account. That's great. We're gonna get, we're gonna get a lot out of that specialization." In a market time where companies were spending, spending, spending, spending, that, that structure works. It's bloated. It's not the most productive structure, but when everybody is trying to buy more products and for all the heads that are coming into their business, it's probably not a bad structure. The minute scrutiny turns on deals, now you got four people doing the same job, and people are saying: "Okay, well, I don't need the customer success manager. I'm gonna make that the account manager's job. And renewal, I don't need a separate renewal team. I'm gonna make that the account manager's job. The SDR driving demand into the organization, I don't really need that. I'm gonna make the account manager drive that. Mm-hmm. The account manager hasn't been somebody who's historically been responsible for prospecting into the account, driving health into the account. What businesses are doing today is trying to drive that level of productivity in a different way than they've had before. So, okay, that's... There's a lot to, there's a lot to noodle on there. But just to make sure, going back to kind of my original statement, when you look within your software industry vertical customers, would you push back on that at all? Because you... I mean, you could look, you could look back a year ago and say: Well, that's when the peak of the layoffs were. It must have been roughly a year ago, right? And you're not getting the layoffs anymore. Yeah. But does the hiring feel sluggish with your software customers? Are there any signs of life? Does it feel like some of this could recover a little bit, where they're adding more seats later this year? Yeah. Look, we've had a number of situations where we've, where we've grown our customers because they've added seats, but it's not, it's not universal. It's- Yeah. There are some spots. There certainly, layoffs have significantly muted, and that's really positive for the software and technology space, but I, I wouldn't tell you that hiring is back- Yeah in any way. Okay. I wanna, I wanna ask you a question or two on the core data platform in the underpinnings, and then I wanna make sure that we're going in and talking about the Copilot product. So I think we've always known ZoomInfo is very highly regarded for the actual accuracy of the data, the accuracy of the data, the freshness of the data, the breadth of the data, the depth of the data. It feels very different to us and, and, and to your customers. How would you characterize the underpinnings of that? You know, the machinery you've got that drives that. You've got the contributory network. You're syncing and refreshing a lot of the CRM systems in the world. You know, how can we tell from the outside if you're kind of maintaining or kind of expanding that competitive mode? Yeah. Basically, providing the best data. Yeah. So, you know, internally, we track this across a number of dashboards. We think about contact accuracy, company accuracy, depth coverage, and so we're constantly watching those metrics. I would tell you, the health of the contributory network, the health of the community network, they're more healthier today than there's ever been across those two, and so we continue to build moat there. We continue to build feedback loops, so as customers use our Engage solution or send emails or receive emails, we're adding that deliverability component into the accuracy rates of our products. And so every additional customer who leverages ZoomInfo, we're building a feedback mechanism that tells us the accuracy of the data they're using and then getting smarter throughout the platform. But today, we have the highest accuracy rates we've ever had, the broadest coverage we've ever had, the highest accuracy rates, both on company and contact data, as we've ever had, and the largest community and contributory networks we've ever had. Okay, so that foundation is pretty robust. Now, the last couple of quarters, we did notice something different in what you were communicating, and it was this, it was this concept of win backs. And I believe you said Q3 and Q4 were both the biggest win back quarters on record. Over 550 customers who had left ZoomInfo and tried something cheaper, and then they returned to the platform. And I'm assuming most of those are contact record or firmographic. You know, they can some way... I assume a lot of those are at the data level. Can you talk about that, just what is driving the win backs? Yeah, and Q1 carried that trend. It wasn't as high, it wasn't our highest quarter, but it was right there. And so what we're seeing is customers, when they are under scrutiny from their CFOs to cut 20% or 30% across all of their software stack, if they've only deployed ZoomInfo as a contact lookup tool, they're much more—they're likely to go try a cheaper alternative. And when they go try a cheaper alternative, they come back, and they're coming back in higher rates today than they ever have. It is that moat that we talked about, that contributory and community addition moat, the AI that we built to parse through that and triangulate and keep the data fresh, all those feedback loops coming in, those are difficult to build. They're difficult to activate at scale. When you're doing this across 300 million people records and 100 million company records, you have to have a lot of built-in B2B nuance and AI to get that right. And so we see our customers, particularly in the low end of the SMB, try something cheap and then come back. So the cost of capital rises, right? You have some customers that go and try something, try something a little cheaper, and then there's a lag. There's a lag of a quarter or two? Yeah, there's a lag of a quarter. And you see them coming back. Okay. Let's go back to... Let's spend a couple minutes here talking about your Copilot product, because you're investing pretty heavily into it. And this AI product, I think you said you had over 20,000 beta users, and the feedback had been pretty positive. Is it possible to make this sort of tangible? You know, what kind of walkthrough for someone in the audience who might not be a BDR or a direct seller, can you explain to them what the vision is, and how do you create something that's differentiated in this market? Yeah. So the vision is, tell me who the next most likely buyer of my products and service is gonna be. So if you just start with that, every sales team, every marketing team, wants to put their resources and their dollars behind the next most likely customer. But how do they know who the next most likely customer is? Mm-hmm. And who they should be putting resources behind? If you wanted to deliver that, you can't deliver that based solely on my first-party data. And this is why CRMs and... Well, CRMs are poorly positioned to be able to deliver a true copilot experience for sellers. Maybe in customer service, where I don't need any outside information to deliver that. But for a seller, for me to know that a company is likely to be my next best customer, what do I need to know? Do I need to know anything in my CRM? Yeah, I probably just need to know that they're not a customer right now. And I probably also need to know that they're not an opportunity right now, because I don't wanna go spend my resources on something that's already in the pipe or something that's already a customer. Outside of that, my CRM doesn't hold any special insight about who my next best customer is. All of that lives outside of the CRM, and it lives in digital breadcrumbs all over the world. It, it lives on whether the company visited your website, they visited your pricing page. It lives on whether the company just had some event that would indicate that they're in market for your products and services. Maybe they hired a chief marketing officer, and that's who you sell to, or a director of marketing or a VP of infrastructure. Maybe they just got funding. Maybe they just put a job posting out that said they're hiring an SAP analyst for a new SAP project. Maybe they, in the earnings call, said that they were weak in international sales, or they had a cybersecurity incident, or on and on and on and on and on. All of that lives outside of your CRM. Right. There's no capturing it in some special, automatic way in your CRM. So what you really have to do is you have to marry that first-party data with this living, breathing, third-party data asset. So what we started with, which was company and contact data, we've surrounded now with all of this unique, additional insight that tells you when a customer is in market. That's nice. In the historical application layer, it took a lot of configuration to make that work. In today's application layer, where we're leveraging generative AI, we're going out to the customer CRM, we're going to their website, we're going to their press releases, we're capturing the customer's information. We create for every customer something called a customer context database, where now we understand what intent topics matter to them, who their best customers are, who their buying committee is. So when they step into Copilot, it's fully pre-configured, and it's sending, it's pushing them the next best customer by territory, by customer, by account manager or account executive, and it's pushing that in real time every single day. It's writing the communication for them, so it's a simple action step once we've identified and delivered that, the next best customer. I believe you said that in the construction of that, of all that capability, that you're—I mean, I thought there was mention of it using Anthropic. I thought there was also mention of OpenAI. Yep. You have your own internal LLMs as well? Yep. Can you flesh that out for us? Like, what causes you to wanna use multiple providers- Well, we- with your own internal? There are some things that OpenAI does better than Anthropic. There are some things that Anthropic does better than OpenAI. There are some things that Anthropic does the same as OpenAI for a fraction of the cost of OpenAI. There's something that our LLM does that's as good as Anthropic and OpenAI- Cheaper. that's much cheaper. Yeah, I see. And so we are just... You can think of it like today, we use GCP for some things, we use AWS for some things, we use Azure for some other things, and so we're balancing costs based on the performance of the different models. Okay. Okay, understood. We're down to about two less than 3 minutes. I thought I would just do a quick check for any questions in the audience, and if there are, we'll run you a microphone. Okay. Let's then let's stay on this topic for another moment. The topic being, of course, seed compression, right? So, I think in a lot of cases, we look at it, we say, well, the AI capabilities are just taking off so rapidly, right? And you're gonna infuse it in your products. You're gonna have this copilot out there. When you look at the world five years down the road, is the typical team size, like, if you look at a BDR group, you know, even if you just kinda look at the number of direct sales reps or, you know, the broader marketing team, is that something that's gonna be a bit smaller, where... Because you look at it, you say, "Well, the software's gonna do a lot of the heavy lifting," right? Certainly- Depends on how bullish you wanna be about AI, Mark. Like, there's, there's one part that goes, are the bots just gonna talk to the bots and sell the software themselves? Yeah. Mm-hmm. There's that universe and those people who are being that bullish about it five years out. And then there's... If you look back 2.5 years, 2.5 years ago, when OpenAI was first released to the public, the last 2.5 years, we're talking about AI a whole bunch more, and there are spots where you're seeing it automate out a human in customer service. But in a lot of the other places, you're not really seeing probably what you thought it was gonna do 2.5 years into the future of when it first came out. That's fair. We didn't think we were still just gonna be talking- Yeah about when it might actually truly manifest itself. And so the actual progress has been, you know, take VC Twitter out of the mix. The actual progress has been less than what you probably would have imagined over the last 2.5 years. And so I think fundamentally, we're focused on how do we automate out the rote tasks that a seller has to do to make them much more productive and get them in front of the right places at the right time. Five years from now, I'm still gonna wanna be in front of the right companies at the right time with the right message. I'm still gonna need to know who's in market for my products and services. I'm still gonna need to know who do I engage with at those companies to sell to. I don't think that magically goes away in five years. And so we're focused on that as a, as a problem to solve. Okay, great message to end on, and I can't thank you enough, Cameron Hyzer, Henry Schuck, for taking the time to be here with us. Really appreciate it. Thank you, Mark. Thank you.